kallend 1,623
Recommended Posts
buzzfink 5
<<>>>
With the knowledge I currently have, I believe the current bid system is best. However, the DZ that host the Nationals must be able to meet the needs of the competitors. These needs that need to be evaluated should include prior weather history. I don't think a single place is the best way to host the Nationals. With that said, I think more efforts to ascertain the needs of the competitors should be done. Don't just send out a questionnaire and be happy with the 5% that send them back. Take a proactive role by assigning someone to call the competitors that did not respond. If you REALLY want to know what the competitors want you have to be willing to take that extra step. And yes, it will cost some money to do this. But that is what we are here to do, service the membership.
<<>>
I believe the ISP is a good guide. I do not believe USPA should try to make one program work for everyone. The Basic Safety Requirements should be just that-Basic. USPA should provide guidelines as to how to run a student progression but not try to over regulate them. Let the DZ's and Instructors have the freedom to run their own programs. Of course, their needs to be certain criteria that need to be met but let the DZ's run their program.
Thanks and Blue Skies!
Buzz
With the knowledge I currently have, I believe the current bid system is best. However, the DZ that host the Nationals must be able to meet the needs of the competitors. These needs that need to be evaluated should include prior weather history. I don't think a single place is the best way to host the Nationals. With that said, I think more efforts to ascertain the needs of the competitors should be done. Don't just send out a questionnaire and be happy with the 5% that send them back. Take a proactive role by assigning someone to call the competitors that did not respond. If you REALLY want to know what the competitors want you have to be willing to take that extra step. And yes, it will cost some money to do this. But that is what we are here to do, service the membership.
<<
I believe the ISP is a good guide. I do not believe USPA should try to make one program work for everyone. The Basic Safety Requirements should be just that-Basic. USPA should provide guidelines as to how to run a student progression but not try to over regulate them. Let the DZ's and Instructors have the freedom to run their own programs. Of course, their needs to be certain criteria that need to be met but let the DZ's run their program.
Thanks and Blue Skies!
Buzz
Jimbo 0
Here's goes...
You said: 'Probably the most controversial point about me is that my Drop Zone is Cypres Required.' and then in the same paragraph you say this: 'I hear it all the time that if elected I might vote to make USPA AAD required. Nothing can be further from the truth.', and this: 'I believe in personal freedoms.'.
How can we as skydivers be expected to believe this? You claim to belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ. I don't get it. If you're perceived as deceptive on this issue how can we trust you on others? I believe to really know a man we should look at his actions, not his words.
-
Jim
You said: 'Probably the most controversial point about me is that my Drop Zone is Cypres Required.' and then in the same paragraph you say this: 'I hear it all the time that if elected I might vote to make USPA AAD required. Nothing can be further from the truth.', and this: 'I believe in personal freedoms.'.
How can we as skydivers be expected to believe this? You claim to belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ. I don't get it. If you're perceived as deceptive on this issue how can we trust you on others? I believe to really know a man we should look at his actions, not his words.
-
Jim
"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
buzzfink 5
<<>>>
I believe the most serious issue is post 9-11 over-regulation. I believe keeping Ed Scott of USPA in touch with all the letter organizations (AOPA, NBAA, etc.) and working together we can keep our planes flying and our jumpers jumping.
On a personal note, not many people understand how much Ed Scott has done for skydiving. To me, he is the single most valuable person at USPA Headquarters.
Thanks and Blue Skies!
Alan "Buzz" Fink
I believe the most serious issue is post 9-11 over-regulation. I believe keeping Ed Scott of USPA in touch with all the letter organizations (AOPA, NBAA, etc.) and working together we can keep our planes flying and our jumpers jumping.
On a personal note, not many people understand how much Ed Scott has done for skydiving. To me, he is the single most valuable person at USPA Headquarters.
Thanks and Blue Skies!
Alan "Buzz" Fink
buzzfink 5
<<>>
Jimbo,
You and I have beat this one into the ground. I do not belive the government or USPA should require AAD's. I do believe a Drop Zone has the right to set rules as they see fit.
Anyway, Blue Skies!
Alan "Buzz" Fink
Jimbo,
You and I have beat this one into the ground. I do not belive the government or USPA should require AAD's. I do believe a Drop Zone has the right to set rules as they see fit.
Anyway, Blue Skies!
Alan "Buzz" Fink
QuoteJimbo,
You and I have beat this one into the ground
Buzz, just to avoid confusion, this is not Jimbo (Jim Bozarth), this is a different guy, same logon id.
I don't know why the accusatory, suspicious reply. The whole conspiracy issue is well noted for its source. Don't worry about it. I have read your replies before. Keep them coming.
Bill
billvon 2,400
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)
>How can we as skydivers be expected to believe this? You claim to
>belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ.
So does every other DZO. Some do not allow you to swoop the main landing area; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can swoop. Some do not allow you outside (or inside) a beer line; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can or can't be in relation to the beer line. Some require freeflyers to get out after belly flyers; yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. Some require camera flyers to have X jumps before flying camera, or jumping a small canopy, yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. More importantly, none of the BOD members who are DZO's of such DZ's have proposed such rules.
So I would ask you - why do you think that Buzz is the _only_ candidate who would try to take local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis?
>belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ.
So does every other DZO. Some do not allow you to swoop the main landing area; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can swoop. Some do not allow you outside (or inside) a beer line; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can or can't be in relation to the beer line. Some require freeflyers to get out after belly flyers; yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. Some require camera flyers to have X jumps before flying camera, or jumping a small canopy, yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. More importantly, none of the BOD members who are DZO's of such DZ's have proposed such rules.
So I would ask you - why do you think that Buzz is the _only_ candidate who would try to take local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis?
buzzfink 5
Thanks.
Alan "Buzz" Fink
Alan "Buzz" Fink
Quote>How can we as skydivers be expected to believe this? You claim to
>belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ.
So does every other DZO. Some do not allow you to swoop the main landing area; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can swoop. Some do not allow you outside (or inside) a beer line; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can or can't be in relation to the beer line. Some require freeflyers to get out after belly flyers; yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. Some require camera flyers to have X jumps before flying camera, or jumping a small canopy, yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. More importantly, none of the BOD members who are DZO's of such DZ's have proposed such rules.
So I would ask you - why do you think that Buzz is the _only_ candidate who would try to take local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis?
As USPA couldn't very well make a map of every beer line and landing area at every dropzone in the US, that particular portion is not really relevant. As for x jumps before jumping a camera or hotrod, I don't know if any current DZO BoD members have such rules, and if they don't, why would they try to make USPA have them. In any case, such things are qualifications to be achieved, not blanket requirements, regardless of experience.
Buzz doesn't think skydivers should make up their own minds on whether they wear an AAD, he wants to make up their minds for them. I personally don't want a director who thinks he knows better than the people he represents. Sure, in some cases, it will be necessary for a representative in any government to vote his conscience rather than popular sentiment. But if a candidate lets you know upfront that he considers his opinion (on a controversial subject) to be more important than yours (even if it's your life on the line), he's probably not someone who will defer to your opinion on other (less controversial) subjects either.
Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)
(drink Mountain Dew)
QuoteBut if a candidate lets you know upfront that he considers his opinion (on a controversial subject) to be more important than yours (even if it's your life on the line), he's probably not someone who will defer to your opinion on other (less controversial) subjects either.
to me, that's characteristic of a strong leader, a rarity among political types. (disclaimer: i don't know buzz from adam. i jump at perris.
) in a democratic situation, you can hardly ask for better; your yay or nay is easily determined by how much commonality you share with the candidate on pertinent issues. less chance for wicked surprises (i.e., position shift based upon lobbying or other influences).
steve
Jimbo 0
Bill,
You're reading entirely too much into this. I asked Buzz specifically why we should trust that he won't vote for mandatory AAD usage when he already requires it at his own DZ.
Exactly where did I mention Bill that I thought Buzz was the only candidate who would try to take his local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis? I've read and re-read my post and I don't see it. If there were other candidates here who said the believed in one thing and their actions showed differently I would ask them the same question.
-
Jim
You're reading entirely too much into this. I asked Buzz specifically why we should trust that he won't vote for mandatory AAD usage when he already requires it at his own DZ.
QuoteSo I would ask you - why do you think that Buzz is the _only_ candidate who would try to take local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis?
Exactly where did I mention Bill that I thought Buzz was the only candidate who would try to take his local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis? I've read and re-read my post and I don't see it. If there were other candidates here who said the believed in one thing and their actions showed differently I would ask them the same question.
-
Jim
"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
billvon 2,400
>Buzz doesn't think skydivers should make up their own minds on
> whether they wear an AAD, he wants to make up their minds for
> them. I personally don't want a director who thinks he knows better
> than the people he represents.
As he will not represent his own DZ, but DZ's from all over the country, that point really isn't relevant. It makes about as much sense as saying he will require all people to jump out otters because he has an otter, and therefore "wants to make up the minds" of everyone who jumps at his place by forcing them to jump out of an otter.
>Sure, in some cases, it will be necessary for a representative in any
> government to vote his conscience rather than popular sentiment.
I think it is _required_ that candidates vote their conscience. We do not have a pure democracy here in the US for a reason; I vote for people I think will do a good job, not people I think will always bow to popular opinion.
>But if a candidate lets you know upfront that he considers his opinion
> (on a controversial subject) to be more important than yours (even
> if it's your life on the line), he's probably not someone who will defer
> to your opinion on other (less controversial) subjects either.
His opinion is that DZ's should make their own decisions on AAD usage. He's said that upfront. He will not likely change his mind. If you disagree with that, or think he's a liar, don't vote for him. I know him well enough to know he's not a liar; you may not.
> whether they wear an AAD, he wants to make up their minds for
> them. I personally don't want a director who thinks he knows better
> than the people he represents.
As he will not represent his own DZ, but DZ's from all over the country, that point really isn't relevant. It makes about as much sense as saying he will require all people to jump out otters because he has an otter, and therefore "wants to make up the minds" of everyone who jumps at his place by forcing them to jump out of an otter.
>Sure, in some cases, it will be necessary for a representative in any
> government to vote his conscience rather than popular sentiment.
I think it is _required_ that candidates vote their conscience. We do not have a pure democracy here in the US for a reason; I vote for people I think will do a good job, not people I think will always bow to popular opinion.
>But if a candidate lets you know upfront that he considers his opinion
> (on a controversial subject) to be more important than yours (even
> if it's your life on the line), he's probably not someone who will defer
> to your opinion on other (less controversial) subjects either.
His opinion is that DZ's should make their own decisions on AAD usage. He's said that upfront. He will not likely change his mind. If you disagree with that, or think he's a liar, don't vote for him. I know him well enough to know he's not a liar; you may not.
billvon 2,400
>Exactly where did I mention Bill that I thought Buzz was the only
> candidate who would try to take his local DZ rules and implement
> them on a widespread basis?
I don't think you did say that, but as several candidates are DZO's, and all their DZ's have rules not covered by the BSR's, I assumed that was OK with you. If it's not - if you will not vote for any DZO that has any rules beyond the BSR's - then I apologize for making that assumption.
> candidate who would try to take his local DZ rules and implement
> them on a widespread basis?
I don't think you did say that, but as several candidates are DZO's, and all their DZ's have rules not covered by the BSR's, I assumed that was OK with you. If it's not - if you will not vote for any DZO that has any rules beyond the BSR's - then I apologize for making that assumption.
kallend 1,623
Quote>How can we as skydivers be expected to believe this? You claim to
>belive in personal freedoms, yet you restrict them at your own DZ.
So does every other DZO. Some do not allow you to swoop the main landing area; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can swoop. Some do not allow you outside (or inside) a beer line; yet USPA has no BSR's on where you can or can't be in relation to the beer line. Some require freeflyers to get out after belly flyers; yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. Some require camera flyers to have X jumps before flying camera, or jumping a small canopy, yet USPA has no BSR's on that issue. More importantly, none of the BOD members who are DZO's of such DZ's have proposed such rules.
So I would ask you - why do you think that Buzz is the _only_ candidate who would try to take local DZ rules and implement them on a widespread basis?
I don't see any inconsistency in Buzz's position. I don't allow anyone to smoke (tobacco or pot) in my house, but I don't advocate outlawing smoking (in fact, I think pot smoking should be legal too, for adults). Buzz can set whatever rules he likes at his DZ, and the customer base will reward or punish him as the customer sees fit. Buzz's probably better off if all the complainers go elsewhere.
Luminous 0
QuoteAs he will not represent his own DZ, but DZ's from all over the country, that point really isn't relevant.
This is exactly why DZO's should not be on the BOD. The BOD should represent the base membership, (aka: jumpers), not the group membership.
My Opinion.
BSBD
Larry
'In an insane society a sane person seems insane.' Mr. Spock
If Buzz was elected and even if Buzz wanted to TRY and make AAD's mandatory at all DZ's he has to convince the rest of the BOD's.
If elected, its not like Buzz or any other candidate by themself can change the rules.
judy
If elected, its not like Buzz or any other candidate by themself can change the rules.
judy
Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.
wmw999 2,121
QuoteThis is exactly why DZO's should not be on the BOD.
Dunno if I agree with this. I think, though, that we might want to ensure that too many BOD members aren't DZ owners -- maybe an overall limit of 2 or 3 or something like that.
They are definitely part of the parachuting worldscape, and if we can talk together instead of having our organization contact their organization it's probably easier in the long run.
Wendy W.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)
billvon 2,400
>This is exactly why DZO's should not be on the BOD. The BOD should
> represent the base membership, (aka: jumpers), not the group
> membership.
That's a good point. There are several candidates who are more DZO than fun jumper, and people may want to take that into account. I can see the value of having a 'balanced' board as well - one where both fun jumpers interests and DZO's interests are balanced. Both are important for skydiving to remain the sport it is.
> represent the base membership, (aka: jumpers), not the group
> membership.
That's a good point. There are several candidates who are more DZO than fun jumper, and people may want to take that into account. I can see the value of having a 'balanced' board as well - one where both fun jumpers interests and DZO's interests are balanced. Both are important for skydiving to remain the sport it is.
QuoteQuoteAs he will not represent his own DZ, but DZ's from all over the country, that point really isn't relevant.
This is exactly why DZO's should not be on the BOD. The BOD should represent the base membership, (aka: jumpers), not the group membership.
My Opinion.
BSBD
Larry
The BOD is representing skydiving. DZOs know a little about the industry, government, and business. I like the idea of a knowledgeable decision maker.
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites