0
immanence

fear of floating

Recommended Posts

Something from "Introductions & Greets" posted by another newbee (like me) to these forums got me thinking:

Quote

:) I am afraid of the door. Isn't that silly?



I don't think it's silly. I have something different but similar. Dive exits, no problem. Flip exits, love 'em! Unstables? Can't get enough of 'em! But as for climbing around outside the door, forget it :( — I pee my pants!

It's the wierdest thing. Anyone else feel or felt this?

For me, I think the basis of it is that I am scared of heights! (I know! Go figure!) Being out and in the air at 12,000ft, I could be asleep I am so relaxed. But I sure don't like loitering around between the plane and the sky. I think it's because vertigo is something not so much to do with height as such, but rather visual perspective. So I can be in the air at 12,000ft and totally happy, but don't ask me to climb a 12,000ft ladder, even with a parachute on: my legs would be like jelly.

Relative to skydiving, any exit is fine, except ones where I have to visually confront something (i.e., the plane) which establishes relativity to the ground. For that moment — floating on the rail, for example — in my visual perspective I have something to be relative to, so I feel a sense of vertigo. Additionally, I think hanging on the outside of a plane enhances the "uncanniness" of the "unusual" act of jumping off the damn thing! My mind knows what it's doing. I'm prepared, trained and safe. But my eyes see the situation unfold and send "WTF!" signals to my survival synapses!

Example: recently I saw a video where a guy gets out, hops on top of the main fuselage, shimmies down to the tail and rolls off. I get the willies even watching it on my laptop! Am I scared of hitting something, of some horrible accident happening? Perhaps. On Skydiving Movies there is a video of a premature main deployment where a guy gets wrapped around the tail. My god, it's just awful (thankfully the guy lived). So accidents, yes. But there's something else there too, enhancing my anxiety. Proof is that I feel the same about video of dudes hanging off the wing struts of Cessnas — what is my fear of this? That guy hanging there off the strut: there is total clearance below him! — or a video I saw of a guy who had belayed down a rope hanging underneath the basket of a balloon.

A lot of these things, I guess, are just trace echoes of the survival instinct. The more one jumps, perhaps, the more one learns how to command that instinct. For me, I try to make friends with these demons. I may as well, because I probably can't — possibly shouldn't — free myself of them. Sometimes they kick up a fuss in my head ("sh*t, I gotta do a floating exit"), but I know they are probably looking out for my better interest. So I listen to them, try to learn from them, and hopefully one day ........ one day, I'll be the guy on top of the plane, shuffling down to the tail.

Are there others out there who have faced this same, specific fear — of clambering around outside the plane? If so, how did you — or how do you — face and overcome this fear?

Blue skies,
ian

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am definitely much fonder of diving exits than floating exits. I think it has more to do with feeling clumsy, like I'll bang my gear on something or knock someone else off if it's a group exit, etc.

I'm facing it by doing it more, even on solos. I'll do a step exit rather than a door dive from a cessna, or do a floating exit when I'd much rather say "let's just dive it."

Weird, I know, but you're not alone.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have similar feelings. When the pilot banks & you feel the increased Gs in the plane, i get that WTF feeling a bit. I also get it when i approach the door but it disappears when i'm actually in the door, or maybe just decreases alot. I get a huge wave of release as soon as i've let go of the plane. Kinda counterintuitive. I got over (most of) my stomach butterflies on the ride up by reminding myself, "hey, i'm wearing a parachute.."

I don't have many jumps so i'm sure it will decrease as time goes on but i hope it doesnt totally disappear as i think it keeps me just paranoid enuf to gear check gear check gear check :)

dont prefer diving to floating exits. like them both..

can you post the link to the fuselage shimmy tail guy? i'd like to see that & do it in the future (far future)!!
-Rainier

Sparks Brother #1 // "I vaguely heard someone yell "wait!" but by that point i was out the door." Quote from dz.com somewhere

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

can you post the link to the fuselage shimmy tail guy?



Took a bit of finding, but I tracked it down. Click here and then go to "preview". It's quite funny, actually. Once he rolls over off the top of the plane he goes into some pretty funky freefly skywalking :D:D

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Are there others out there who have faced this same, specific fear — of clambering around outside the plane? If so, how did you — or how do you — face and overcome this fear?



I've never had the fear about floating exits but I do know that they can be quite tough to get the hang of, and maybe thats adding to your fear. The prop blast and slipstream can make it difficult (for newbies like us) at the best of times, especially when launching a 4-way or suchlike.

Maybe it would be good for you to ease into doing some rear float exits, with someone taking the wind off you it is much much easier to get into the right positions. Not having that feeling like you're about to be blown off the plane could help you get to grips with clambering around outside it. Get comfortable with that and then maybe try some front floats and handling the airflow.

As for climbing over the fuselage and hanging from balloons, fuck it, if that ain't your thing then don't worry about it. There is plenty of other cool stuff to do in this sport.:)
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am way too new to be giving any kind of advice, expecially on this as I have never had the chance to float. I did get the WTF half way to the door on my first jump and maybe even worse on my second but when the third rolled around i didn't get it at all, go figure. As for hanging outside the plane, the first time I saw a videographer climb out I thought that was the grandest thing and I can not wait for the chance. But ofcourse I am also the one that owns a construction company and from time to time still put my tools on with the boys and that is normally when we have a job that is way up, involves hanging off the side of a half completed structure on little or no scalfold and they get butterflys. I love to remind them that I can still out climb anyone on the payroll at anytime. I love the thrill of the climb. Cant wait to be outside the plane. but thats just me and then again who knows what I will think about it afterwards.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Face it, you're being a pussy :P



:|:D:| you know .................................. :S ...... you're totally f-cking right :D:D But for the purposes of learning ............................ anyone else here a big pansy? LOL! :D

No, seriously folks, I would like to hear from others, either on this specific aspect, on people who feel height in the same way I do, or others with general comments about overcoming anxieties.

Maybe it would help some of us newbies and not-quite-so newbies.

And relative to me? Don't worry, :)

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It took me a bit to get over the floating exit... I am deathly afraid of hights, I still can not climb a ladder to my roof without shaking, getting down is worse. I felt like I was afraid of falling off the plane when floating (duh!) ... Just do it a few times, it takes some getting used to having the prop blast trying to rip you from the door, ... I got over it when I had to, I was doing RW and there were jumps that I was told I would float, so I did... To "ease" into it, you may try to be a rear float first so that the front float can take most of the prop blast until your comfortable with that ;)

Just do it, and have fun.. Wear a smile as you climb out or something. :)

FGF #???
I miss the sky...
There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I hate floating! I tried it twice, the first time I freaked in the propblast, and took the guy I was jumping with for a ride or tumble as it were! The next time, I just got disoriented and lost my heading, but still had trouble dealing with the propblast! I am fine in the middle of a train exit, with 1 to 3 other people, cause someone else is getting the prop:P I would love to be at a point where it is comfortable to be outside the plane (and I'm not at all afraid of heights) hanging on and not be bothered at all and in complete control as float.

Muff Brother 3723

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A silly fear I have is spotting. I hate the responsibility of deciding if the 'spot is good'. If I wait too long people start to yell (nothing like a little pressure) because we all know the first person out if they take too long they fuck up the spot for the other people on the plane, and if I go too soon I fuck it up for me and have to fight to make it back. I dread being the first one out of the door!

Muff Brother 3723

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I like hanging out on the outside with the wind rushing. But the tail makes me nervous. Most of the time I dive out the door head low, then turn 180 to face the plane.

taking off, sitting next to the open door bothers me much much more. I take off the seat belt on time, but I hold onto one end until I'm at least 3 or 4k.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm wondering how what type of plane you were trained on plays a role in all of this. I was trained on a 182, so of course I'm used to being outside the plane hanging onto the strut. I love being outside the plane. I would crawl all over the outside of the plane if I could. I'm not afraid of heights though. Actually I'm more claustorphobic than anything and when that door opens, it's like I can breathe again.

I'm making myself do the exact opposite and that's staying inside the plane and practicing my diving exits because I have been doing way too many floating exits lately.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I don't think it's silly. I have something different but similar. Dive exits, no problem. Flip exits, love 'em! Unstables? Can't get enough of 'em! But as for climbing around outside the door, forget it — I pee my pants!



Try 4way for a while. I have floated many times. At first, it seemed weird, now it is natural... Does not mean I still don't suck at the gymnastic maneuver required of the outside center, but the doorway is natural.:S

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

I get a kick out of sticking my head out the door for some reason [Smile]



Next time, stick your tongue out like a dog in a car. Gets you the weirdest looks B|.



What? Doesn't everyone do that? :S

FGF #???
I miss the sky...
There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks, guys, for these replies so far. It's good for me to think through what this thing is — this glitch or bug in my program — and your posts are helping me do that.

There's a couple of things I'm thinking right now:

1) While I feel, like NWFlyer, some nervousness about the actual climb out — especially given that often the "rail" on a plane consists of a mere strip of metal sticking up on the top of the fuselage, as opposed to any kind of bar that one could get a decent grip on, while the "step" is often very short and wafer thin, and moreover that one doesn't often get a lot of ground practice on the plane itself before climbing out on the jump run, and this climb out, let's be honest, is not taking place under the least stressful of conditions (especially if you're the first group out with dozens of others in the plane waiting, anxious about their jump or the spot or looking cool for the videoman, or that last dodgy repack) — it's not so much this I have the problem with. At least it is not the origin of my anxiety (which I think is different to nervousness).

Sure, I could slip off, be blasted off by the prop (I was jumping a Twin Otter last year and if they don't throttle down — which they didn't always — it's quite a hurricane out there, let me tell you), fuck up somehow, but so what? The question remains: why do I have a sense of vertigo (which, strictly speaking, is a fear of heights, which must mean a fear of dying from a fall), when I'm wearing a parachute? It just doesn't make sense. If I stood on top of a building, at the very edge, I might be worried of losing my balance and falling to my death. But I get in the plane because I want to get out of it, so what is it about hanging on to the side of the plane on run-in, or swinging off the strut, or belaying down a rope underneath the basket of a balloon, that gets my heart beating?

2) I've done enough floating exits so be okay with them. I prefer to dive, but I can do float, front or rear. Deep down inside, though, for some reason I feel anxiety. This is what i want to address because it pisses me off that there's a part of this beautiful sport that I don't like. Maybe it's a mix of nervousness, prop blast, engine noise, the rather unusual visual perspective of being outside a freakin airplane at 14 grand, the time pressure, expectations and needs of others, etc. Still, I wish I could unlock that moment. Maybe practice makes perfect. But maybe hearing others' views on this can help in the mental process, which I'm sure is part of it.

I have no problem with near enough anything else. G-force in planes makes me giggle. I could hang my head out the door all the way to altitude. I always look out the window or out the door if I can. I have no sense of any fear of heights looking down at the ground from the inside. I love turning round and watching the plane disappear from me on exit, sticking my tongue out at some dude counting for separation. In most other aspects of the sport — at least in this regard; "proficiency" is a different bag of weasels :P — i'm fine. But I don't think it's healthy to want to get off the plane as quickly as possible, and to be anxious about floating or hanging of the strut, or whatever.

I want to be calm, at ease and open to all aspects of the skydive. With most everything else I am ........... not this sucker, though [:/]

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I'm wondering how what type of plane you were trained on plays a role in all of this



Good point. My first jumps were with an Islander or a PA-32, both of which are sit exits. My first step exit was jump # 23 on a C-172. Maybe if I'd have been forced — at a time when I knew no better — to get out there on a step on jump one I'd be more comfortable now. Possibly. I don't know. I remember, too, however, thinking that the step exits were kinda cool [:/]

It's all screwed up in my head. I started jumping at heights of 2000ft. Somehow being on a step at 2000 is okay while being on one at 14,000 seems wierd. Go figure.

I need a shrink! B|

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

It's all screwed up in my head. I started jumping at heights of 2000ft. Somehow being on a step at 2000 is okay while being on one at 14,000 seems wierd. Go figure.



I am the exact opposite. I love altitude. I would rather be hanging onto the side of an airplane at 14K rather than 2K. I don't even think I have 5 total hop n pops... they just scare me. I'm getting better though. I did make one this past weekend. :D


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Having only 2 jumps, I am afraid of everything until I`m under canopy.;)
But what really gets me is the climbout. The skinny ass little step and almost losing my grip on the
fat strut of the Beaver due to sweaty hands freaks me out.
I dont really care much for the roller coaster belly feeling when I let go either, but for some reason I
keep coming back for more.:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Are there others out there who have faced this same, specific fear — of clambering around outside the plane? If so, how did you — or how do you — face and overcome this fear?



Whenever I float, I have a fear of hitting the tail. I don't know why - probably because I've seen a dented tail that a friend of mine hit with the back of his head - improper trim on jump run combined with a poor choice of exit in a camera suit. The only way I can get this out of my head is by watching groups exit and also watching video of exits repeatedly. If the exit is proper and the plane is trimmed for jumping, the physics of it make it very hard to come close to the tail. But it can still happen, so I still get a little freaked out :S
Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ok... I think I can relate to this. I dont have a fear during climb, the exit, nothing. The 'only' part where I think twice about what I'm holding on to is when I set up at the door to exit. I jump from a Caravan, currently doing the left knee up, right knee down, facing the prop, hands on edge of door, instructor on the right side. Everytime the instructor needs to tell me to step out a bit more. I don't think it's fear of the fall, but of something going wrong. You know you're about to jump, and maybe something can get caught, etc. Diving exits (from what I've seen) seem alot easier to do, since you "hang" out less time than floats, where you're in that "if something happens now, im f*cked" stage.

This is me, though. I think I'd be scared shitless of something going wrong while hanging outside of a plane with people next to me. It wouldn't be so much the "what's the worst that can happen, fall?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

0