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tsalnukt 1
the pilot in the above scenario is doing it from a 206 with a cargo door. The packers in the above scenario are getting 12 dollars for a tandem. 20 loads in a 206 in one day is pretty hardcore. I'm not saying it can't be done but probably not that often.
tsalnukt 1
I just got a note from "the Universe"
Whenever your perspective on something creates emotional pain, it's always because your perspective is still so narrow that you've yet to see all the good it will make possible.
Because it will.
I can see clearly now...
The Universe
Whenever your perspective on something creates emotional pain, it's always because your perspective is still so narrow that you've yet to see all the good it will make possible.
Because it will.
I can see clearly now...
The Universe
This disparity has been noted for years and years and once in awhile I bring the topic up.
It is supply and demand. Now, if we just give our new commercial pilots or pilots moving up from piston to turbine a sense of self worth the pay would increase because they wouldn't be taking the jobs. I worked my ass off at a Cessna DZ in KC. I flew the loads then packed the student rigs and jm rigs just to have some money (the DZ was always behind paying me). I didn't get my first airline job until 7 years after graduating my university for aviation. How many of you out there want to "intern" for 7 years? Didn't think so.
Your pilots are human beings. But if you use an analogy of aircraft engine operation you might see what I'm getting at. You can't run your engine in the red for very long before it fails. Run it within limits and it will last a long time and won't cost you more in the long run. Do you want to pay a little more now or a lot later? You must ensure your pilot is running within parameters as a human. They have to afford to eat and a place to live. They can be under tremendous stress due to financial obligations while getting that training. Do you want them distracted while working at your operation? No, you want them focussed totally on the task at hand. DZs have never given much thought to human factors in accidents and incidents. Or how a "corporate culture" or "industry culture" can play into it. Things that don't show up at the accident site and can't be photographed or measure with an instrument. It takes humans watching out for each other before the accident happens to prevent it. You don't want your pilot to be the weak link in this chain.
Treat the pilots with respect. Give them a sense of self worth either by increasing pay or adding perks that are not as tangible as money yet motivate the employee (free jumps, free sandwich brought out to them, etc...) And for God's sake watch for signs your diver driver is getting bored. Yanking and banking for the thrill of it is a sure way to creating more maintenance down the road or to a smoking hole when the fly by goes bad (accelerated stall trying to buzz campground on first load of day with a full load in the back).
It is supply and demand. Now, if we just give our new commercial pilots or pilots moving up from piston to turbine a sense of self worth the pay would increase because they wouldn't be taking the jobs. I worked my ass off at a Cessna DZ in KC. I flew the loads then packed the student rigs and jm rigs just to have some money (the DZ was always behind paying me). I didn't get my first airline job until 7 years after graduating my university for aviation. How many of you out there want to "intern" for 7 years? Didn't think so.
Your pilots are human beings. But if you use an analogy of aircraft engine operation you might see what I'm getting at. You can't run your engine in the red for very long before it fails. Run it within limits and it will last a long time and won't cost you more in the long run. Do you want to pay a little more now or a lot later? You must ensure your pilot is running within parameters as a human. They have to afford to eat and a place to live. They can be under tremendous stress due to financial obligations while getting that training. Do you want them distracted while working at your operation? No, you want them focussed totally on the task at hand. DZs have never given much thought to human factors in accidents and incidents. Or how a "corporate culture" or "industry culture" can play into it. Things that don't show up at the accident site and can't be photographed or measure with an instrument. It takes humans watching out for each other before the accident happens to prevent it. You don't want your pilot to be the weak link in this chain.
Treat the pilots with respect. Give them a sense of self worth either by increasing pay or adding perks that are not as tangible as money yet motivate the employee (free jumps, free sandwich brought out to them, etc...) And for God's sake watch for signs your diver driver is getting bored. Yanking and banking for the thrill of it is a sure way to creating more maintenance down the road or to a smoking hole when the fly by goes bad (accelerated stall trying to buzz campground on first load of day with a full load in the back).
Chris Schindler
www.diverdriver.com
ATP/D-19012
FB #4125
www.diverdriver.com
ATP/D-19012
FB #4125
kr0me 0
Quotethe pilot is required to have a commercial rating which on average cost anywhere from $25,000 to $40,000.
You don't need a commercial rating to be a jump plane pilot, a PPL with an extra training package given by the CAA is enough.
PhreeZone 15
Here in the States and in Canada to need a Commercial rating to fly jumpers. Many clubs have been busted and fined for not having a commercial rated pilot
Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery
Parachutemanuals.com
And tomorrow is a mystery
Parachutemanuals.com
kr0me 0
My mistake then, well that f*cks up my plans of coming to the US to work as a jump pilot! lol
BRAVO, you've hit the nail on the head. I could not
agree more; "treat the pilots with respect and give them a sense of self worth". I would also add that this should go for ANY pilot that you've entrusted with your well being - 182 driver to the DC3 driver - low timer to high timer. Also your thought on the perks - ABSOLUTELY - if a DZ can't afford more money then providing lunch, etc. really goes a long way toward a positive attitude and that sense that the jumpers and/or DZO gives a damn.
agree more; "treat the pilots with respect and give them a sense of self worth". I would also add that this should go for ANY pilot that you've entrusted with your well being - 182 driver to the DC3 driver - low timer to high timer. Also your thought on the perks - ABSOLUTELY - if a DZ can't afford more money then providing lunch, etc. really goes a long way toward a positive attitude and that sense that the jumpers and/or DZO gives a damn.
jclalor 12
in that weekend a tandem master would make $1,400 (40 tandems @$35/per jump)
I am kind of new at this, how many tandems can a TI due on a weekend?
I am kind of new at this, how many tandems can a TI due on a weekend?
Most don't do 40 in a weekend.
Yes I know it can be done but it is not the norm.
Yes I know it can be done but it is not the norm.
EDYDO 0
QuoteHere in the States and in Canada to need a Commercial rating to fly jumpers. clip clip
This keeps coming up. I suppose it is because everyone has the tandem/commercial operation mindset. In the US there are a number of circumstances where a private pilot can fly a jump plane legally. Just one example: Two (or 4 or 5) private pilots are also skydivers. They rotate flying and jumping, then they split expenses. It's perfectly legal and just one example.
Ed
QuoteGenerally as a jump pilot you are flying old airplanes with high time engines, the airframes have been close to redline airspeed by many inexperienced pilots and therefore probably overstressed. you're often taking off past max gross weight with a rearward CG, and lets face it, the maintenance is often neglected. seems pretty risky to me, ohh and one more thing, people are jumping out out your fucking airplane with big inflatable things that can easily get caught on the tail.
Um...You're freaking me out here a little, man.
Oh, and I'm a high school teacher. I get paid less than all you guys and I have 4 years of a undergratuate work, early field experience, one year of post graduate work and a year as a student teacher. I know I get summers off, but I need them because (and here's the worst part of the job) I work with...kids. Brrr.
Well said, Bill, well said. Anyone, jumper or pilot, can show up when the sun is shining and everything works. The ones with the sand stand out when the malfunctions happen and the world turns to crap in a heartbeat.
I second Bill's comments. When the shit does hit the fan, it's nice knowing someone w/ solid experience is at the controls. And is being paid appropriately.