BIGUN 1,112 #1 September 28, 2014 QuoteFBI Director James Comey said in an interview this week that Apple’s data encryption will hurt law enforcement and prevent them from capturing criminals and terrorists. “What concerns me about this is companies marketing something expressly to allow people to hold themselves beyond the law. The notion that someone would market a closet that could never be opened – even if it involves a case involving a child kidnapper and a court order – to me doesn’t make any sense,” Comey said. He also spoke about parents who come to him wanting to figure out how to best find evidence on their child – but that the FBI will be unable to help because of Apple’s new data encryption process. “It’s like taking out an ad that says, ‘Here’s how to avoid surveillance – even legal surveillance,” he said. SOURCE: http://www.inferse.com/18015/iphone-6-data-encryption-puts-nsa-run-disrupts-data-gathering-activities/ Doesn't it scare you that the government acts like it's entitled to spy on anyone and is appalled when something helps to protect your right to privacy?Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FB1609 0 #2 September 28, 2014 Good on Apple. Technology has made a huge difference in surveillance and loosing privacy to governments etc, good to see it working against all that for a change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #3 September 28, 2014 Is the encryption on the new iphone only, or is in the software and will be able to be used on all iPhones? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #4 September 28, 2014 new iphone onlyNobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,412 #5 September 28, 2014 BIGUNnew iphone only According to Apple, it is *any* device running iOS 8: http://www.apple.com/privacy/government-information-requests/"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #6 September 28, 2014 It's disturbing, but not surprising that law enforcement would take this attitude when (1) we [the US] pass laws allowing this level of surveillance, and (2) we demand that "the government" keep us absolutely safe from any crime or terrorist activity. As a society, we need to make it clear that (1) we do not want this level of intrusion into our privacy, and (2) we are willing to accept some increased risk as a result. It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. Law enforcement still can get information about specific people, they just have to have probable cause to get a warrant. The argument that encryption prevents them from doing their job is a stealth argument that it's too much bother to get a warrant (i.e. to respect our constitutional rights). I am concerned about hackers stealing my information and taking the product of my labors for themselves. To that end, I welcome anything that improves security of my data. I'm surprised the FBI can't see that side of things. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 644 #7 September 28, 2014 Yep, iOS 8 only. So long as you do NOT synch with iCloud, subpoenas still served on the cloud. Local backups to a pc running good encryption should close the risk nicely. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #8 September 28, 2014 ryoder***new iphone only According to Apple, it is *any* device running iOS 8: http://www.apple.com/privacy/government-information-requests/ Thanks to you & Normiss for the correction and additional information.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chutem 0 #9 September 28, 2014 GeorgiaDonIt's disturbing, but not surprising that law enforcement would take this attitude when (1) we [the US] pass laws allowing this level of surveillance, and (2) we demand that "the government" keep us absolutely safe from any crime or terrorist activity. As a society, we need to make it clear that (1) we do not want this level of intrusion into our privacy, and (2) we are willing to accept some increased risk as a result. It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. Law enforcement still can get information about specific people, they just have to have probable cause to get a warrant. The argument that encryption prevents them from doing their job is a stealth argument that it's too much bother to get a warrant (i.e. to respect our constitutional rights). I am concerned about hackers stealing my information and taking the product of my labors for themselves. To that end, I welcome anything that improves security of my data. I'm surprised the FBI can't see that side of things. Don My understanding is that even with a warrant Apple would be unable to access the information in the phone as even they can not crack their encryption. Don't get me wrong, I'm completely with you on points 1 and 2. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #10 September 29, 2014 GeorgiaDon It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. 1. 17 Intelligence Agencies. 2. 75 Billion Dollar Budget 3. Multi-billion dollar satellite programs, aircraft, weapons, electronic sensors, intelligence analysis, spies, computers, and software. 4. 200,000 Intelligence Community Employees + Contractors 5. A Director of National Intelligence (DNI) You might be asking a bit much, Don. Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #11 September 29, 2014 GeorgiaDon As a society, we need to make it clear that (1) we do not want this level of intrusion into our privacy, and (2) we are willing to accept some increased risk as a result. Right up until the point where people blame larger society when something bad happens to them. As a general rule, everyone's for increased risk for other people, but if something terrible happens to their child it's all 'how can this happen? How did the police not see this predator on chate rooms??' etc etc. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #12 September 29, 2014 BIGUN ***It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. 1. 17 Intelligence Agencies. 2. 75 Billion Dollar Budget 3. Multi-billion dollar satellite programs, aircraft, weapons, electronic sensors, intelligence analysis, spies, computers, and software. 4. 200,000 Intelligence Community Employees + Contractors 5. A Director of National Intelligence (DNI) You might be asking a bit much, Don. As you are no doubt aware, those resources/people are in large part being used to run and analyze surveillance programs. If such surveillance was outlawed, many of those people would be out of a job. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #13 September 29, 2014 GeorgiaDon ******It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. 1. 17 Intelligence Agencies. 2. 75 Billion Dollar Budget 3. Multi-billion dollar satellite programs, aircraft, weapons, electronic sensors, intelligence analysis, spies, computers, and software. 4. 200,000 Intelligence Community Employees + Contractors 5. A Director of National Intelligence (DNI) You might be asking a bit much, Don. As you are no doubt aware, those resources/people are in large part being used to run and analyze surveillance programs. If such surveillance was outlawed, many of those people would be out of a job. Don You're kidding, right?Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #14 September 29, 2014 BIGUN *********It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. 1. 17 Intelligence Agencies. 2. 75 Billion Dollar Budget 3. Multi-billion dollar satellite programs, aircraft, weapons, electronic sensors, intelligence analysis, spies, computers, and software. 4. 200,000 Intelligence Community Employees + Contractors 5. A Director of National Intelligence (DNI) You might be asking a bit much, Don. As you are no doubt aware, those resources/people are in large part being used to run and analyze surveillance programs. If such surveillance was outlawed, many of those people would be out of a job. Don You're kidding, right?Well, OK, maybe they'll be put in a basement cubicle and allowed to post to dropzone.com all day. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #15 September 29, 2014 Quote Well, OK, maybe they'll be put in a basement cubicle and allowed to post to dropzone.com all day. You people act like that's not hard work. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #16 September 29, 2014 GeorgiaDon ************It isn't reasonable to expect law enforcement to detect in advance and prevent every terrorist plot (an unreasonable expectation) without allowing them access to unreasonable tools. 1. 17 Intelligence Agencies. 2. 75 Billion Dollar Budget 3. Multi-billion dollar satellite programs, aircraft, weapons, electronic sensors, intelligence analysis, spies, computers, and software. 4. 200,000 Intelligence Community Employees + Contractors 5. A Director of National Intelligence (DNI) You might be asking a bit much, Don. As you are no doubt aware, those resources/people are in large part being used to run and analyze surveillance programs. If such surveillance was outlawed, many of those people would be out of a job. Don You're kidding, right?Well, OK, maybe they'll be put in a basement cubicle and allowed to post to dropzone.com all day. Don Or maybe they could shift the declination of their azimuth 180 degrees to outside the US - instead of on US citizens. Rather than targeting terrorists and really honing in on them, the US Government is running secret, extravagant, unconstitutional, and an out-of-control labyrinth of electronic surveillance operations that targets every American. This government has redefined citizens as suspects. And, then acts appalled that we dare purchase encrypted phones to protect our privacy from our [we the people] government. And, your biggest concern is for the jobs for those who survey its own citizens. Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #17 September 29, 2014 QuoteRather than targeting terrorists and really honing in on them, the US Government is running secret, extravagant, unconstitutional, and an out-of-control labyrinth of electronic surveillance operations that targets every American. This government has redefined citizens as suspects. And, then acts appalled that we dare purchase encrypted phones to protect our privacy from our [we the people] government. I'm equally appalled by the domestic surveillance as you are. But just for the sake of historical perspective, and starting only with post-WWII for brevity's sake, it's always been done, limited not by policy (for the most part), but only by the limits of the technology of the day. And it was without regard to political party in charge. 1950s surveillance of everyone per Red Menace justification under Truman and Ike, FBI surveillance of civil rights leaders and anti-Vietnam War activists under LBJ and Nixon, the list goes on. (How was national security enhanced by tape-recording M.L. King in bed with women?) With a few interludes here and there, treating citizens as suspects has been SOP almost unabated since the earliest Cold War days post-WWII. It's rare that the Executive branch, irregardless of party, willingly devolves, much less divests itself of, the power to abuse the constitution. Sure, the Obama administration may be more verbally liberal than Bush-II on social issues, but on use and abuse of executive power? - not an arc-second of practical difference, except to adhere to every administration's natural inclination to make it a growth industry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #18 September 29, 2014 Quote Or maybe they could shift the declination of their azimuth 180 degrees to outside the US - instead of on US citizens. You think they don't already do this, in addition to surveillance of US citizens? Quote And, your biggest concern is for the jobs for those who survey its own citizens. Crazy[/crazy] With that sense of humor, you'd be a prime candidate for a TSA job. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #19 September 29, 2014 >You think they don't already do this, in addition to surveillance of US citizens? Yeah, I kinda do since that was my job for a long time. Although, I never surveyed US Citizens. >With that sense of humor, you'd be a prime candidate for a TSA job. I'm pretty much over-qualified. But, I do have a large bucket of TSA jokes.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #20 September 29, 2014 I look forward to the day that you, I and nerdgirl can have a very intellectual dinner.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boomerdog 0 #21 September 29, 2014 QuoteFBI Director James Comey said in an interview this week that Apple’s data encryption will hurt law enforcement and prevent them from capturing criminals and terrorists. To which I respectfully reply; "Mr Director, tough $#!T! Deal with it!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #22 September 29, 2014 BoomerdogQuoteFBI Director James Comey said in an interview this week that Apple’s data encryption will hurt law enforcement and prevent them from capturing criminals and terrorists. To which I respectfully reply; "Mr Director, tough $#!T! Deal with it!" Of course a lot of this can be tied directly to that "thing" called the "Patriot Act." What an abomination on our rights.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #23 September 29, 2014 BIGUN>With that sense of humor, you'd be a prime candidate for a TSA job. I'm pretty much over-qualified. You wrote "surveyed" instead of "surveilled" so, yeah... you're over-qualified. Don't damn yourself with faint praise. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #24 September 29, 2014 BIGUNI look forward to the day that you, I and nerdgirl can have a very intellectual dinner. OK, but I insist on your buying, if only to uphold the principle of Getting Free Stuff. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,112 #25 September 29, 2014 Dear Lord, man. There are thesauruses on-line now.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites