Unions poised to score one-year reprieve from Obamacare tax

[airdvr 200]

Quote

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/15/unions-poised-score-one-year-reprieve-obamacare-ta/

The deal that’s emerging from Democrats would grant union members a delay in paying the reinsurance fee mandated by the health reform law, for a period of one year, The Hill reported. The tax is imposed for three years, and it’s aimed at bringing in the necessary level of revenue to keep premiums for all insurance holders low.

How much more proof do you need to know the average american middle class wage earned is gonna be run over.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[davjohns 1]

"Union leaders say the tax will ultimately raise health insurance costs for all."

Duh.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[regulator 0]

My wife has to deal with unions on a daily basis. They are fantastic at representing horrible employees and keeping their jobs and not much else.

[lawrocket 3]

[Quote]The tax is imposed for three years, and it’s aimed at bringing in the necessary level of revenue to keep premiums for all insurance holders low.

This is the essential statement of how government works. Only by taxing people can the government keep premiums low. Example: one can pay twenty dollars per day for insurance. Or, one could pay fifteen dollars a day for insurance and ten dollars in taxes that subsidize the insurance.

The latter is more affordable!

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[normiss 643]

CWA and IBEW FINALLY agreed to accept the contract here at work they have been arguing negotiating for the last year and a half!!!!

It's good until 2017.

[rushmc 18]

airdvr

Quote

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/15/unions-poised-score-one-year-reprieve-obamacare-ta/

The deal that’s emerging from Democrats would grant union members a delay in paying the reinsurance fee mandated by the health reform law, for a period of one year, The Hill reported. The tax is imposed for three years, and it’s aimed at bringing in the necessary level of revenue to keep premiums for all insurance holders low.

The rule has now been written
Gotta love the ability to write rules into law after the law is passed
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/11/07/obama-rewrites-rule-to-let-unions-avoid-obamacare-tax

How much more proof do you need to know the average american middle class wage earned is gonna be run over.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kelpdiver 2]

rushmc

Gotta love the ability to write rules into law after the law is passed

actually, rule making has traditionally been done after legislation is passed, and it's another example where the Executive Branch has more power than our 5th grade version of Washington would suggest.

[rushmc 18]

kelpdiver

***
Gotta love the ability to write rules into law after the law is passed

actually, rule making has traditionally been done after legislation is passed, and it's another example where the Executive Branch has more power than our 5th grade version of Washington would suggest.

And by your post I guess you think this is the way such power should be (ab)used?

Really?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[champu 1]

rushmc

******
Gotta love the ability to write rules into law after the law is passed

actually, rule making has traditionally been done after legislation is passed, and it's another example where the Executive Branch has more power than our 5th grade version of Washington would suggest.

And by your post I guess you think this is the way such power should be (ab)used?

Really?

I don't get that from his tone or, more importantly, from his posting history at all.

[kelpdiver 2]

rushmc

And by your post I guess you think this is the way such power should be (ab)used?

Really?

It was more an attempt to tell you how the real world works, and not just since Obama took office. Legislation can change substantially between the signing by the President and when the bureaucrats are done with it.

Practically speaking, it would be very difficult for all intricate details to be resolved before the House & Senate vote. Hence it is done by the appropriate department afterwards. Sometimes this may lead to a result not intended by the promoters or those who voted to approve, may require follow up legislation.

[rushmc 18]

kelpdiver

***
And by your post I guess you think this is the way such power should be (ab)used?

Really?

It was more an attempt to tell you how the real world works, and not just since Obama took office. Legislation can change substantially between the signing by the President and when the bureaucrats are done with it.

Practically speaking, it would be very difficult for all intricate details to be resolved before the House & Senate vote. Hence it is done by the appropriate department afterwards. Sometimes this may lead to a result not intended by the promoters or those who voted to approve, may require follow up legislation.

I know how it works
I also know how it is intended to work
I also know the Obama admin is abusing this

Follow up legislation is the right way

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[wolfriverjoe 1,370]

Iago

That may be the case, but I still want to know why the Unions are special. Why doesn't my employer get a one year reprieve?

Because of all the political contributions the unions make?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[rushmc 18]

In the end
should the Dems stay in power
This will become permanent

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[turtlespeed 212]

wolfriverjoe

***That may be the case, but I still want to know why the Unions are special. Why doesn't my employer get a one year reprieve?

Because of all the political contributions the unions make?

I think it goes to say that if you directly impact your voting base's wallet negatively, you would likely lose votes. All that is happening is that Obama is shoring up his party to stem the flood of voters that are disgusted with him and his.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[champu 1]

rushmc

In the end
should the Dems stay in power
This will become permanent

Well, in a year, when one side wants to extend the breaks for unions and the other wants it to expire, the side that wants it to expire will be "attacking unions and trying to bust them." And a few more years when the fee is set to expire and one side wants to extend it the opposition will be "pushing for unsustainable tax cuts that erode our health... the most fundamental resource we have..."

[Channman 2]

regulator

My wife has to deal with unions on a daily basis. They are fantastic at representing horrible employees and keeping their jobs and not much else.

Unions: Cost to build 3Xs higher, and the final product...iffy.

[freethefly 6]

Channman

***My wife has to deal with unions on a daily basis. They are fantastic at representing horrible employees and keeping their jobs and not much else.

Unions: Cost to build 3Xs higher, and the final product...iffy.

I was union for a good number of years at Hussmann Refrigeration in Bridgeton,MO. We busted our backs building the finest commercial refrigeration units in the world. Due to Ingersoll Rand, that is no longer true.
Back in 2001, they started sending the lines to Mexico, along with the sheet metal department. The quality went from the finest to the worst. The same happened when they moved part of the company to Atlanta,GA. Non union employees earning low wages did not give a damn about the quality of their work. That was not the case at the Bridgeton plant.
I worked from 3am till 3pm, Monday through Friday. On Saturdays, I worked from 5am till 3pm. We did not stand around doing nothing. We busted our backs and earned every fucking penny they gave us.
Unions built this country and the people were proud of what they built. The city you live in was built by unions. BY AMERICANS! My trucks (GMC, Chevrolet, Ford) and 2 of my motorcycles (1968 FLH and 2005 FLSTFI) are quality union made.
It was the management of Ingersoll Rand that destroyed the quality of Hussmann products, not the union employees.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[normiss 643]

You sure it wasn't any sort of government incentives to corporations to start moving to offshoring models of manufacturing?

[freethefly 6]

normiss

You sure it wasn't any sort of government incentives to corporations to start moving to offshoring models of manufacturing?

Here's a wiki page on Ingersoll Rand. It pretty much says it all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingersoll_Rand

IR buys Hussmann for 1.83 billion. Two years later I and a thousand plus others are out of a job.
http://www.achrnews.com/articles/ingersoll-rand-to-buy-hussmann-for-1-83-billion

I was laid off in June of 2002. This article concerns the lay offs later in the year.
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/stories/2002/11/11/story1.html

Quote

Shatney said Ingersoll-Rand has a strategy to move production, such as the Hussmann refrigeration cases manufacturing, to lower cost facilities, perhaps even to Mexico. "But they don't want to do it. That would take another round of restructuring," she said.

Not so, they began moving production no sooner than they bought us.

Although, the Hussmann Bridgeton plant did not shut the gates, Ingersoll did send more than 1000 jobs to Mexico, including mine.
http://blog.timesunion.com/business/hussmann-corp-reportedly-closing-gloversville-plant-90-jobs-lost/5664/

IR sells 60% of Hussmann for 370 million 11 years later.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/ingersoll-rand-sells-60-hussmann-for-370-mln-2011-08-08

I left Sperry Rail Service in 1994 to go back to work at Hussmann as I was tired of the travel. 10 months of the year was spent away from home testing rail in the US and Mexico. I would still be at Hussmann today if not for IR. As of this moment, I am sitting in a room at the La Quinta in Sulpher, LA (should had brought my gear.) Monday I am testing rail on the KCS instead of enjoying Veterans Day. No union in the rail testing business. I am a salary employee.
I made over 55k at Hussmann. I worked a lot of hard hours. For those who are uniformed about how a production line works. It never stops. Which means that you never stop. Yup, just a bunch of lazy union people breaking their backs.
Every drop of fault lands directly on the management at IR. Hussmann was not the greatest company to work for as the hours were long and the work was non stop (one cannot simply walk away and take a break.) Yet, it provided good wages that were redistributed back into the community. That makes for a strong economy. A lot of my money went to DZs and on gear.
When jobs leave this country to boost the profits of companies such as IR, this country suffers. Local economies take a big hit. When wages go from high to low or no wage at all, how can this economy recover when there is little need to restock the shelves in the local stores? When I lost a good paying job I did not, because I could not, support the economy.
When will people, such as the the conservatives wake up and realize that good paying jobs are the keys to a striving economy. Can't buy, if you can't pay.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[lawrocket 3]

It's rather interesting to me that unions are often viewed as a key piece of the puzzle in fighting corporate power. But failing to understand that a union is a corporate organization. Just like government.

Unions are in the business of increasing their own power and revenue. And they are BIG money and power. The mob has never been interested peanuts. Unions always have a lot of money. And politicians are interested in cutting them favors.

Unions don't give a shit about their dues-paying members any moer than a drug dealer cares about a junkie. A union cares about itself (nobody hates a union like another union. Seriously. Inter-union battles are awesome to behold).

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[turtlespeed 212]

The question is, why is it that Unions get a pass, what makes them so special that they get treated differently then the rest of us?

Are you saying that people in a union are somehow better than everyone else?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[rickjump1 0]

turtlespeed

The question is, why is it that Unions get a pass, what makes them so special that they get treated differently then the rest of us?

Are you saying that people in a union are somehow better than everyone else?

Their pass is in proportion to the amount of money they extorted from the membership to elect President Barack Hussein Obama. He loves the SEIU and Acorn. http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/gaynor/100420"President Obama owes his presidency to Rathke's ACORN and its Project Vote affiliate and Stern's SEIU and Rathke is rightly concerned with the next presidential election, because voters have been discovering what the Obama/ACORN/SEIU agenda really involves."

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[turtlespeed 212]

rickjump1

***The question is, why is it that Unions get a pass, what makes them so special that they get treated differently then the rest of us?

Are you saying that people in a union are somehow better than everyone else?

Their pass is in proportion to the amount of money they extorted from the membership to elect President Barack Hussein Obama. He loves the SEIU and Acorn. http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/gaynor/100420"President Obama owes his presidency to Rathke's ACORN and its Project Vote affiliate and Stern's SEIU and Rathke is rightly concerned with the next presidential election, because voters have been discovering what the Obama/ACORN/SEIU agenda really involves."

I was hoping Freethefly would answer, but if no one disputes this answer we can pretty much call it correct, can't we?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[rushmc 18]

freethefly

******My wife has to deal with unions on a daily basis. They are fantastic at representing horrible employees and keeping their jobs and not much else.

Unions: Cost to build 3Xs higher, and the final product...iffy.

I was union for a good number of years at Hussmann Refrigeration in Bridgeton,MO. We busted our backs building the finest commercial refrigeration units in the world. Due to Ingersoll Rand, that is no longer true.
Back in 2001, they started sending the lines to Mexico, along with the sheet metal department. The quality went from the finest to the worst. The same happened when they moved part of the company to Atlanta,GA. Non union employees earning low wages did not give a damn about the quality of their work. That was not the case at the Bridgeton plant.
I worked from 3am till 3pm, Monday through Friday. On Saturdays, I worked from 5am till 3pm. We did not stand around doing nothing. We busted our backs and earned every fucking penny they gave us.
Unions built this country and the people were proud of what they built. The city you live in was built by unions. BY AMERICANS! My trucks (GMC, Chevrolet, Ford) and 2 of my motorcycles (1968 FLH and 2005 FLSTFI) are quality union made.
It was the management of Ingersoll Rand that destroyed the quality of Hussmann products, not the union employees.

I was in the IBEW for 17 years

Yours, is one side of the story

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[freethefly 6]

turtlespeed

******The question is, why is it that Unions get a pass, what makes them so special that they get treated differently then the rest of us?

Are you saying that people in a union are somehow better than everyone else?

Their pass is in proportion to the amount of money they extorted from the membership to elect President Barack Hussein Obama. He loves the SEIU and Acorn. http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/gaynor/100420"President Obama owes his presidency to Rathke's ACORN and its Project Vote affiliate and Stern's SEIU and Rathke is rightly concerned with the next presidential election, because voters have been discovering what the Obama/ACORN/SEIU agenda really involves."

I was hoping Freethefly would answer, but if no one disputes this answer we can pretty much call it correct, can't we?

Been in the swamp all day hunting alligators to shoot (with my camera.) Down here in Sulphur, LA.

I do not believe that union members should be treated any different. All people should be treated equally. After all, is it not what is written in the DOI that it is so? We need to stop giving free passes to one group while ignoring another, if were all ever to be on an even field.

I would not call it completely correct but, give it a partial as unions do play a major roll in elections. That said, it is the final vote that counts. Union members are free to vote whichever way they wish when in the booth. If an election swings in the favor of the unions then the membership did as they vowed to do. They stood together. Can you blame them for looking out for their interest?

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young