ACA upheld

[kallend 1,647]

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No way - we all know better than that.

The general disregard for laws and lawful behavior is another topic entirely.

There will always bee a willful and criminal disregard of laws by some of the population.
No matter how many laws and penalties we add to it.

Which generally seems to have the inconvenient result of having more impact on innocent/non-intentional offenders.

There are already HUGE consequences to not paying your bills. Poor people generally don't care. They can't. They accept the result of being poor because there are no other options. Like a lot of people without healthcare policies. They cannot afford them. Period.

Moot point, there are subsidies and the medicaid expansion for such people.

Did you actually bother to read the details?

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[headoverheels 291]

From the ACA text:

(D) MEMBERS OF CONGRESS IN THE EXCHANGE.—
(i) REQUIREMENT.—Notwithstanding any other
provision of law, after the effective date of this subtitle,
the only health plans that the Federal Government
may make available to Members of Congress and
congressional staff with respect to their service as a
Member of Congress or congressional staff shall be
health plans that are—
(I) created under this Act (or an amendment
made by this Act); or
(II) offered through an Exchange established
under this Act (or an amendment made by this
Act).

[Bolas 5]

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So, what's next?

What's next is that over time, the ACA probably fails due to corruption in the system. Corporations instead of lowering rates, raise them, and they make out like bandits with little or no improvement in actual health care delivery.

Yep.

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Then we change it to single payer to resolve the corporate corruption and leave people who want to do private insurance free to do it, and they will still pay taxes to fund the public system, just like education.

just my guess.

Nope. Just trade the corporate corruption for government corruption and agendas. Plus the government will outsource treatment just like it does today.

So the health industry will purposely ensure the care is minimal at best to encourage people to pay for health insurance at private facilities.

Highly likely the same companies providing the government paid care will also provide the privately paid care.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[Shotgun 1]

I am glad to see that the Affordable Care Cat was upheld:

http://affordablecarecat.com/

[davjohns 1]

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A tax penalty for not having a mortgage? I see. So you don't get a tax benefit for having a mortgage. It's a tax penalty for not having one.

That's like saying the government doesn't want you to have a job. After all, you pay a tax penalty for having one. Let's cut the spin.

And answer the question - what are the limits?

Not disputing your point, Jerry...but sometimes it seems like the government doesn't want you to have a job. We pay people to not work. We provide housing, utilities, healthcare, cell phones, food cards that can be used at the liquor store, and bring the polling place to them so they don't have to work too hard to vote. At tax time, we give them money for not paying taxes. Sounds like income tax is a penalty for working.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[normiss 622]

Repeatedly.

Do you have any level of understanding what it's like to be poor?
Dirt poor???

These people don't have access to a cushy plan like your or I have. Nor will they ever.

I want a congressional healthcare and retirement plan myself.
THAT'S the one to have.

[kallend 1,647]

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I am glad to see that the Affordable Care Cat was upheld:

http://affordablecarecat.com/

Scalia Cat - very apt.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,647]

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Repeatedly.

Do you have any level of understanding what it's like to be poor?
Dirt poor???

These people don't have access to a cushy plan like your or I have. Nor will they ever.

I want a congressional healthcare and retirement plan myself.
THAT'S the one to have.

1. I have a son who is dirt poor, so yes.

2. See earlier post #202 about congress's plans. See also www.factcheck.org/2010/01/congress-exempt-from-health-bill/ which debunks (some of) the right's lies.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,647]

So when are you going to tell us how much extra tax you'll be paying as a result of this "largest ever" tax increase that you claim?

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,428]

>I want a congressional healthcare and retirement plan myself.

You're in luck. As part of the law, they have to use the same system we do - so you'll be able to get it.

[kallend 1,647]

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>I want a congressional healthcare and retirement plan myself.

You're in luck. As part of the law, they have to use the same system we do - so you'll be able to get it.

Clicky for the disbelievers.

I'd like to suggest that before anyone else posts a smear that they got from a GOP or Tea Party website, they might read the ACTUAL language of the act. Most of the smears are distortions or outright lies.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[lawrocket 3]

[Reply]Only if you are irresponsible and don't have health insurance. The responsible folks will not pay a penalty.

This is a tax on freeloaders, and I LIKE it.

[headoverheels 291]

Smokers don't live as long, so it isn't all that clear that the extra burden treating earlier illness doesn't pay off by not paying them social security for as many years.

How about that skydive and mountain biking and skiing lifestyle -- ends up in some pretty expensive orthopedics at times, and maybe long term care.

[kallend 1,647]

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[Reply]Only if you are irresponsible and don't have health insurance. The responsible folks will not pay a penalty.

This is a tax on freeloaders, and I LIKE it.

It's a tax on everybody. Primarily it is a tax on one class of person: the healthy.

[Shotgun 1]

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The sick (such as the obese, diabetics, smokers, alcohol users, etc) - and let's be real here: these diseases (except juvenile diabetes) are diseases of lifestyle - who use most of the healthcare are not able to afford their own treatments. In order for their treatments to be affordable, people who aren't sick and aren't using the doctors must pay into the system.

And then there is the lifestyle choice of having kids and using health insurance to cover most of the medical cost, while those of us who choose not to have kids are paying into the same system.

[normiss 622]

I hadn't heard of Congress' participation, merely assumed they were as they were prior to the act.
My bad.

It's hard to read the entire bill, equally as hard to trust news sources!

[rushmc 18]

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So when are you going to tell us how much extra tax you'll be paying as a result of this "largest ever" tax increase that you claim?

When are you going to tell us why some freeloaders are more dirt to you than others

As for the tax?


I see by your response that since it does not affect you you do not give a fuck

(although I am sure that is not true)
But I am sure it will cost me a bunch

But then I am not as rich as you so there is a different perspective

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[lawrocket 3]

Then why do my monthly premiums increase with a new kid?

I know about this. And it's odd because of the payments we have to make to have the kid. The deductibles.

Maybe it's because we''re not freeloaders that we have to pay.

And kallend - what are your thoughts on my proposition that the government encourages freeloading? Wouldn't the problem be solved if we simply said, "We're not covering you any more?"

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Shotgun 1]

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Then why do my monthly premiums increase with a new kid?

Do the premiums go up enough to cover the cost of prenatal care, delivery, hospital time? (Assuming your insurance mostly covers this stuff; if not, you're not who I was referring to.)

Or do they only go up to cover medical care for the new person you're adding to the policy?

[lawrocket 3]

No, the premiums don't increase. The out of pocket does (deductible).

But the $14k in payments per year? Naw - I don't think we use that.

I do like your thinking, though. It's causing me to think.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Coreece 190]

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I am glad to see that the Affordable Care Cat was upheld:

http://affordablecarecat.com/

I don't want to be forced to buy anything, even if it it actually does personally benefits me...and I suppose it does.

I can only imagine the additional intrusion into my life given the "tax" aspects of the plan...

Were can I go to just be left alone? Certainly not the land of the free...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[kallend 1,647]

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)
But I am sure it will cost me a bunch

But then I am not as rich as you so there is a different perspective

So you don't really have a clue, do you? Just running your mouth with GOP propaganda without bothering to find out.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

• Quote

[kallend 1,647]

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And kallend - what are your thoughts on my proposition that the government encourages freeloading? Wouldn't the problem be solved if we simply said, "We're not covering you any more?"

Well, when the law was like that it caused a whole lot of problems, so enlightened people (including St. Ronald Reagan, beloved patron saint of Republicans) decided that was a REALLY BAD IDEA. And they were right.

"We found that because of federal law, federal law requires that hospitals treat people whether or not they can pay. So someone (who) doesn’t have health insurance -- they can go to the hospital and get free care. And we found a growing number of people were dropping their insurance and going to the hospital if they got real sick." Mitt Romney, 2011

The Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (EMTALA) signed into law by St. Ronald Reagan, 1986

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,647]

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I am glad to see that the Affordable Care Cat was upheld:

http://affordablecarecat.com/

I don't want to be forced to buy anything, even if it it actually does personally benefits me...and I suppose it does.

I can only imagine the additional intrusion into my life given the "tax" aspects of the plan...

Were can I go to just be left alone? Certainly not the land of the free...

Do you have a mortgage?

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,647]

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I hadn't heard of Congress' participation, merely assumed they were as they were prior to the act.
My bad.

It's hard to read the entire bill, equally as hard to trust news sources!

Even harder to trust GOP propaganda.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.