Death panels will exist???

[normiss 622]

NY Times says so.

[billvon 2,407]

On the minus side, they will kill your grandma and your children. On the plus side, they might kill all the Arabs and illegal immigrants living under right winger's beds.

[doughboyshred 0]

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NY Times says so.

No, the new york times says that end of life counseling plans, which right wingers incorrectly labeled death panels, will be enacted.

How is a doctor advising a patient on their various options a "death panel"?

It's not unless your favorite activity is tea bagging.

[popsjumper 2]

So...now the DRs get paid for talking to you about stuff they normally talk to elderly people about anyway.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[normiss 622]

Well, my understanding is that they now get paid for "end of life" planning.
Quite Kevorkian IMO. Unlike wellness treatment.
So yes, no "death panel", just "end of life" planning.

Sounds better when you say it fast.

[popsjumper 2]

I didn't take as something like...

Dr: Ok, dude, You're gonna die soon
Old Guy: No shit?
Dr: Yeah. So here's what we're gonna do for you.
Old Guy: Ruh Roh
Dr: We're gonna give you a shot of this cool stuff that will put you to sleep and you'll wake up in heaven!
Old Guy: Well, asshole, do I shoot you now or later?

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[normiss 622]

"a patient with incurable cancer might be asked, “When the time comes, do you want us to use technology to try and delay your death?”

No bullets, just pushed into a corner and let go...hopefully made comfortable....a bong and some morphine maybe.

[Amazon 7]

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NY Times says so.

DUUUUDE they already exist. It seems like every "insurance company has a legion of mindless drones seeking to line their pockets with bonus money ... your money that they refuse to pay out to the doctors and hospitals that performed your surgery or procedure.


Personally I am good with sitting on a death panel and decide who gets some payback... stand all these mutherfuckers who ever falsely uttered the word "PREEXISTING CONDITION" up against a wall and put them in the ground with the OTHER worms

[Lindsey 0]

That's great! End of life planning is too often overlooked until a person is critically ill and unable to participate in decision-making. I don't know if it will play out as expected, though. I'm not sure that people will schedule a visit for end-of-life planning any more than physicians will encourage it if it's not an issue that either was already thinking of.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Amazon 7]

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That's great! End of life planning is too often overlooked until a person is critically ill and unable to participate in decision-making. I don't know if it will play out as expected, though. I'm not sure that people will schedule a visit for end-of-life planning any more than physicians will encourage it if it's not an issue that either was already thinking of.

linz

Hey just think of it as another revenue stream into the office.


IF

The insuance company will actually pay for it once you send them the bill

[popsjumper 2]

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No bullets, just pushed into a corner and let go...hopefully made comfortable....a bong and some morphine maybe.

Can I sign up for that or do I need an appointment?

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[jgoose71 0]

The end of life plan is not a death panel. I don't know who or why it was trying to be labeled as such. The death panels were a bunch of bean counters in bed with the insurance companies trying to decide if it was economically worth it to let you live.

I agree with Lindsey, end of life plans should be mandatory. It saves your family the problems of "when should we pull the plug on this vegetable" and what ever guilt may come along with it. It takes the decision out of doctors, lawyers, and government officials and puts it where it belongs, in the hands of the person lying on the bed.

Self responsibility, nothing more "right wing" than that.

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[kallend 1,635]

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On the minus side, they will kill your grandma and your children. On the plus side, they might kill all the Arabs and illegal immigrants living under right winger's beds.

You have to be nice to illegal immigrants:

"The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.", Leviticus 19 (34)

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,635]

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Well, my understanding is that they now get paid for "end of life" planning.
Quite Kevorkian IMO. Unlike wellness treatment.
So yes, no "death panel", just "end of life" planning.

Sounds better when you say it fast.

When my wife died earlier this year she and the family were counseled by someone who was paid. It most certainly was not a "death panel". Your post is both ignorant and inflammatory.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Andy9o8 0]

You're falling for the sound-byte demagoguery, and spreading it, to boot. It doesn't merit further discussion.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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Well, my understanding is that they now get paid for "end of life" planning.
Quite Kevorkian IMO. Unlike wellness treatment.
So yes, no "death panel", just "end of life" planning.

Sounds better when you say it fast.

When my wife died earlier this year she and the family were counseled by someone who was paid. It most certainly was not a "death panel". Your post is both ignorant and inflammatory.

Keep Fear Alive!

Speed Racer
--------------------------------------------------

[turtlespeed 212]

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So...now the DRs get paid for talking to you about stuff they normally talk to elderly people about anyway.

Who is to say there is a limit where you get a scenario like this one -

Pt: Hey Doc - I've been having trouble
Dr: Have you been smoking all your life?
Pt: Yes, why
Dr: Well - you have cancer
Pt: Am I going to die
Dr: no One can tell if you will or not.
Pt: Well, what are my chances
Government: Your chances may be good, and they may be bad - it doesn't matter, we are not allowing treatment.
Pt: When did you get here?
Government: We have been monitoring your case through the electronic medical records system
Dr: Nothing I can do, a panel of people decided the lenght of your life span for you.
Dr: Now please excuse me I have a newly minted citizen, a brand new, former illegal alien that is now a citizen to give my attention to now.
Dr: Sorry - that is the way it goes. Have some of these pills and don't scream to loud.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,407]

With the alternative:

Pt: Hey Doc - I've been having trouble
Dr: Have you been smoking all your life?
Pt: Yes, why
Dr: Well - you have cancer
Pt: Am I going to die
Dr: no One can tell if you will or not.
Pt: Well, what are my chances
Insurance company: Your chances may be good, and they may be bad - it doesn't matter, we don't cover pre-existing conditions.
Pt: When did you get here?
Insurance company: Our lawyers have been going through your records
Dr: Nothing I can do, a bunch of bureaucrats decided the length of your life span for you.
Dr: Now please excuse me I have a brand new, 20 year old patient that the insurance company will pay me to take care of because there's nothing wrong with him.
Dr: Sorry - that is the way it goes. Oh, and you can't have any pills for the pain - they're not covered.

[turtlespeed 212]

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With the alternative:

Pt: Hey Doc - I've been having trouble
Dr: Have you been smoking all your life?
Pt: Yes, why
Dr: Well - you have cancer
Pt: Am I going to die
Dr: no One can tell if you will or not.
Pt: Well, what are my chances
Insurance company: Your chances may be good, and they may be bad - it doesn't matter, we don't cover pre-existing conditions.
Pt: When did you get here?
Insurance company: Our lawyers have been going through your records
Dr: Nothing I can do, a bunch of bureaucrats decided the length of your life span for you.
Dr: Now please excuse me I have a brand new, 20 year old patient that the insurance company will pay me to take care of because there's nothing wrong with him.
Dr: Sorry - that is the way it goes. Oh, and you can't have any pills for the pain - they're not covered.

The problem with your scenario is that he knows what coverage he has before he goes in to see the doctor, if he has done his homework.

Do you really think that the government is going to publish and send out and make sure that everyone reads their coverage book.

that thing would eat up half the trees in Brazil and not everyone has access to the computer.

they proved that by the whole - you will have plenty of time to read and understand the bill before it is passed . . . and then to "You have to pass it to know what is in it"

The government cannot run and keep a system uncorrupted for a fraction of the population of this country, what in the name of all that is good and right in this world makes you think it has the management skills to keep a system uncorrupted and useful for the entire population? Where is the logic to back that up?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,407]

>Do you really think that the government is going to publish and send
>out and make sure that everyone reads their coverage book.

Do you really think that the insurance company is going to publish and send out and make sure that everyone reads their coverage book?

>The government cannot run and keep a system uncorrupted for a fraction
>of the population of this country, what in the name of all that is good and
>right in this world makes you think it has the management skills to keep a
>system uncorrupted and useful for the entire population? Where is the
>logic to back that up?

And you'd rather rely on the system that gave us Enron and Bernie Madoff? Who would you rather rely on to manage a heart transplant - Wal-Mart or NASA?

[turtlespeed 212]

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Do you really think that the insurance company is going to publish and send out and make sure that everyone reads their coverage book?

Yes - it has always been part of the Welcome Package - It is part of the HR intro that I give to new employees - but they are very few.

>The government cannot run and keep a system uncorrupted for a fraction
>of the population of this country, what in the name of all that is good and
>right in this world makes you think it has the management skills to keep a
>system uncorrupted and useful for the entire population? Where is the
>logic to back that up?

And you'd rather rely on the system that gave us Enron and Bernie Madoff? Who would you rather rely on to manage a heart transplant - Wal-Mart or NASA?

[billvon 2,407]

>Yes - it has always been part of the Welcome Package - It is part of the
>HR intro that I give to new employees - but they are very few.

Hmm. You said a while back that you would shut down your business if the healthcare package passed! Shall we believe you now, or are you making something up again?

[normiss 622]

It's actually neither.

[mnealtx 0]

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>Yes - it has always been part of the Welcome Package - It is part of the
>HR intro that I give to new employees - but they are very few.

Hmm. You said a while back that you would shut down your business if the healthcare package passed!

Actually, I believe the argument was that the increased cost from obamacare would force him to shut down his business.

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Shall we believe you now, or are you making something up again?

Like a made up argument, perhaps, or did we skip a few years and it's 2014 now?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

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Quote

>Yes - it has always been part of the Welcome Package - It is part of the
>HR intro that I give to new employees - but they are very few.

Hmm. You said a while back that you would shut down your business if the healthcare package passed!

Actually, I believe the argument was that the increased cost from obamacare would force him to shut down his business.

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Shall we believe you now, or are you making something up again?

Like a made up argument, perhaps, or did we skip a few years and it's 2014 now?

Hmmm seems to me that might be an expense ... one of those pesky things like big ole redneck trucks that are supposedly part of the cost of doing business... that we as taxpayers get to subsidize when they are written off