Senators turn back ID requirement for immigrant healthcare

[bodypilot90 0]

I guess it's to much to ask for a photo ID?

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Senate Finance Committee Democrats rejected a proposed a requirement that immigrants prove their identity with photo identification when signing up for federal healthcare programs.

Finance Committee ranking member Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) said that current law and the healthcare bill under consideration are too lax and leave the door open to illegal immigrants defrauding the government using false or stolen identities to obtain benefits.

Grassley's amendment was beaten back 10-13 on a party-line vote.

The bill, authored by committee Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.), would require applicants to verify their names, places of birth and Social Security numbers. In addition, legal immigrants would have to wait five years, as under current law, after obtaining citizenship or legal residency to access federal healthcare benefits such as Medicaid and the Children's Health Insurance Program or receive tax credits or purchase insurance through the exchange created by the legislation.

But the would not require them to show a photo ID, such as a drivers license. Without that requirement, the bill "remains dearly lacking when it comes to identification," Grassley said. "Frankly, I'm very perplexed as to why anyone would oppose this amendment," he said.

But Democratic Sen. Jeff Bingaman, who represents the border state of New Mexico, said that the type of fraud Grassley said he wants to prevent is highly uncommon. "The way I see the amendment, it's a solution without a problem," Bingaman said.

[wmw999 2,168]

Would the requirement for photo ID be for everyone, or just immigrants?

If just immigrants, how do you know someone is an immigrant? Ask them?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Ron 7]

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Would the requirement for photo ID be for everyone, or just immigrants?

Everyone.

I think everyone should have to show ID to vote as well.
I don't see why showing an ID it is such a big deal.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Rstanley0312 0]

But Democratic Sen. Jeff Bingaman, who represents the border state of New Mexico, said that the type of fraud Grassley said he wants to prevent is highly uncommon. "The way I see the amendment, it's a solution without a problem," Bingaman said.


This statement is just dumb! No ID = loopholes to be exploited. Why would anyone oppose this?

Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

[rickjump1 0]

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This statement is just dumb! No ID = loopholes to be exploited. Why would anyone oppose this?

..someone who has received large donations from people who employ illegal aliens?

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[Rstanley0312 0]

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This statement is just dumb! No ID = loopholes to be exploited. Why would anyone oppose this?

..someone who has received large donations from people who employ illegal aliens?

Ya.... I get that but that is just sad.

Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

[shah269 0]

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Everyone.

I think everyone should have to show ID to vote as well.
I don't see why showing an ID it is such a big deal.

GREAT IDEA! BUT....a few of our tin foil hat wearing friends may say no.
But it is a great idea and can be made very secure.

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[okalb 79]

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***I think everyone should have to show ID to vote as well.
I don't see why showing an ID it is such a big deal.

I actually don't have a problem with having to show ID but just tp play devil's advocate here, lets change a few words.

I think everyone should register their handguns
I don't see why registering a handgun is such a big deal.

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[Ron 7]

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I actually don't have a problem with having to show ID but just tp play devil's advocate here, lets change a few words.

I think everyone should register their handguns
I don't see why registering a handgun is such a big deal.

Sure, lets change some words but make it more realistic:

I think everyone should show ID to buy their handguns
I don't see why showing an ID to buy a handgun is such a big deal.

You already have to show an ID to buy a handgun.... Why not have to show an ID to vote?

Would you agree to having who you voted for recorded?

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[rickjump1 0]

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This statement is just dumb! No ID = loopholes to be exploited. Why would anyone oppose this?

..someone who has received large donations from people who employ illegal aliens?

Ya.... I get that but that is just sad.

In addition, the senator no doubt has a large Hispanic voter turnout. He is more interested in votes than the good of the country.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[jcd11235 0]

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Why not have to show an ID to vote?

I had to do just that last November. And, I got lots of static from the volunteers because I used a university ID (valid form of ID by law for voting purposes) instead of a driver license.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[Ron 7]

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I had to do just that last November.

I don't know about your exact area, but in most places a picture ID is not required to vote. Florida, Hawaii, Louisiana, South Carolina and South Dakota require ID. An Indiana appellate court declared that it was not legal to require an ID to vote.

http://blogs.findlaw.com/law_and_life/2009/09/no-id-no-vote-voter-id-law-not-okay-in-indiana.html

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[jcd11235 0]

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I had to do just that last November.

I don't know about your exact area, but in most places a picture ID is not required to vote. Florida, Hawaii, Louisiana, South Carolina and South Dakota require ID. An Indiana appellate court declared that it was not legal to require an ID to vote.

http://blogs.findlaw.com/law_and_life/2009/09/no-id-no-vote-voter-id-law-not-okay-in-indiana.html

I'm in Florida.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[GeorgiaDon 340]

Here in Georgia the state legislature has had a lot of trouble passing/enforcing a requirement to show photo ID to vote. It seems a sizeable segment of the poor/elederly population don't have a drivers license or any other form of photo ID, so the law was interpreted as an attempt to disenfranchise that population. Even when the state set up a mechanism for people to go to DMV and get a photo ID for on'y $5 that was challenged (successfully) in court as a "poll tax". Now if you're poor you can get a photo ID for free, and people (including all these professional "advocates for the poor") are still complaining that it's too much of an imposition. Still, the law is now likely to stand up in court.

I can't understand why it's such a big deal to show a photo ID to vote (or to register for gov't benefits either). That being said, there is actually zero evidence of a problem with fraudulent voting. If people were pretending to be someone else in order to vote, the problem would immediately be apparent when the authentic voter showed up at the polls only to be told they had already voted (or the reverse if the imposter arrives second). So the law (as reasonable as it seems) truely is a law in search of a problem.

As far as health insurance is concerned, the existing bill already requires proof of birthplace (which effectively includes citizenship), name, and social security number. If someone is willing to fake those documents to register for benefits, do you really think a photo ID will be an insurmountable barrier? Around here (college town, lots of underage would-be drinkers), fake ID is a major cottage industry.

It seems to me that photo ID is much like 90% of what the TSA does, window dressing to look like you're "protecting the taxpayers" but really accomplishing squat.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[bodypilot90 0]

It's only a bid deal if you are trying to cheat the system, vote a few times or work for acorn.

[GeorgiaDon 340]

Do you really think it's very hard to get a fake ID?

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[billvon 2,470]

>I don't see why showing an ID it is such a big deal.

Good to see you still favor taking away citizens rights when they have done nothing wrong!

[kallend 1,678]

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But Democratic Sen. Jeff Bingaman, who represents the border state of New Mexico, said that the type of fraud Grassley said he wants to prevent is highly uncommon. "The way I see the amendment, it's a solution without a problem," Bingaman said.


This statement is just dumb! No ID = loopholes to be exploited. Why would anyone oppose this?

Do you have data to contradict Bingaman, or are you just blowing hot air?

Without knowing the actual extent of the problem you have no idea whether the "cure" is worse than the disease.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Ron 7]

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Good to see you still favor taking away citizens rights when they have done nothing wrong!

Asking someone to prove they are a citizen prior to having them vote is not taking away a right. It is making sure that they are allowed.

Glad to see that you are more interested in misreading things to start a fight than using any logic.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Ron 7]

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That being said, there is actually zero evidence of a problem with fraudulent voting.

Sorry, that is just not true.

http://www.wftv.com/news/17848541/detail.html

Thousands of dead Floridians are registered to vote and some in Central Florida had ballots cast in their names long after their deaths

"That is scary," said Jim Branch.

Branch's mother Marjorie died in 2004 but someone voted for her in 2006. Branch had tried to get his mother removed from the voter.

Channel Nine discovered 1,636 registered voters in Central Florida are dead.

http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2000/12/24/104421.shtml

"André Alismé died of cancer in 1997," yet records show he voted in November’s election.

"# I am not a registered voter, but I voted,'' Michel Guerda, 20, admitted to the Herald.

# Aldo Rios voted as well – though he isn’t even registered to vote in Miami-Dade and his family told the Herald he lives in Union City, New Jersey.

# "Claudine Richard said her mother, Claudette Richard, was allowed to vote even though she was registered outside Florida.

# In Precinct 146, Pamela Perez signed affirmations for seven people who gave her addresses within that precinct. Elections records show that none were registered voters.


So sorry, that is just not true.

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If people were pretending to be someone else in order to vote, the problem would immediately be apparent when the authentic voter showed up at the polls only to be told they had already voted

What if that person does NOT vote? Then it would never be known. Even if you did show up and found you had already voted... There is no way to remove the false vote once it was cast.

So yeah, it does happen and asking for ID is not that big a deal.

In TX all I had to do was show a bill with my name and address on it. So all someone had to do was steal a piece of mail from my mailbox and go to the polls.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Ron 7]

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I'm in Florida.

And only 5 States require it.... Even then people vote without it.

http://archive.newsmax.com/...0/12/24/104421.shtml

"André Alismé died of cancer in 1997," yet records show he voted in November’s election.

"# I am not a registered voter, but I voted,'' Michel Guerda, 20, admitted to the Herald.

# Aldo Rios voted as well – though he isn’t even registered to vote in Miami-Dade and his family told the Herald he lives in Union City, New Jersey.

# "Claudine Richard said her mother, Claudette Richard, was allowed to vote even though she was registered outside Florida.

# In Precinct 146, Pamela Perez signed affirmations for seven people who gave her addresses within that precinct. Elections records show that none were registered voters.

In TX all I had to bring was a bill in my name with my address on it. I didn't have to show ID, just state I am who I claim to be. All that someone would have to do is steal a piece of mail from my mailbox and claim they were me.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[bodypilot90 0]

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I don't see why showing an ID it is such a big deal.

Good to see you still favor taking away citizens rights when they have done nothing wrong!

So you don't buy beer, cash checks, open a bank accounts, take out a loan, go to the ER or ride on airlines? How dare they take your rights away. How weak,! (yawn)

[SkyDekker 1,150]

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Would the requirement for photo ID be for everyone, or just immigrants?

If just immigrants, how do you know someone is an immigrant? Ask them?

There is a way around this (which of course is open to loopholes as well).

My old style health card for Ontario does not have a picture on it, just a number. To get it, I had to prove at one point that I had a right to it. When I present it, I am not asked for any other ID. This off course also means that anybody with my health card could pretend to be me and get health care.

The new style health cards in Ontario do have your picture on it (and require renewal for a fee every 5 years)

[billvon 2,470]

>Asking someone to prove they are a citizen prior to having them vote
>is not taking away a right.

You are stating that you want to deny people the right to vote if they do not have ID. Not having ID is not a crime.

There is more to the US constitution than the Second Amendment; often I think you overlook the rest.

[billvon 2,470]

>So you don't buy beer, cash checks, open a bank accounts, take out a
>loan, go to the ER or ride on airlines?

None of those are constitutional rights.

Let's go after one of your sacred cows. Suppose we passed some laws that said you had to provide ID every time you bought a gun or ammunition so that there was a record of who owned what? Would you be OK with that?