downwardspiral 0 #51 September 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteblaming tv or violent video games is just as silly as blaming music or guns. But why is it just as silly? .................................................................... I can see a very direct link between violence seen over and over on video games or T.V. and violent behavior in kids. I thought Albert Bandura proved the link between observing violence and aggression. Remember the Bobo doll experiment. I read a book recently called, (On Killing). The author was a former Army Ranger who became a clinical psychologist. The author states that it is very hard to train someone to kill another person. But with the proper training it can be done. There is chapter after chapter detailing how it is easier for soldiers and police to kill after spending hours in video game like training. He went on to state that kids are being desensitized to death and violence, in the same manner a soldier or policeman is, when they spend hour after hour playing violent video games. These games are so real that kids often have a hard time sleeping after. Their heart rate remains very high for a long while after. I'm not a research nut. Perhaps there isn't a ton of hard evidence out there yet, but I'm convinced that seein violence (even on TV or Video games) does have an impact. I grew up watching violence once in a while on TV. I loved shows like Bonnanza, Gun Smoke, and wrestling. You've got to admit that the realism to shows like that are a far cry from what kids are watching now..... Murder rates in the US doubled between 1960 and 1976, the year of the first violent video game. Murder rates continued to increase at a much slower rate until it maxed out in 1993. In 1994 the first first person shooter video game called Doom was released. Since then we have seen murder rates consistently decline while video games continued to get increasingly more realistic, immersive, and violent.www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #52 September 30, 2009 Quote Murder rates in the US doubled between 1960 and 1976, the year of the first violent video game. Murder rates continued to increase at a much slower rate until it maxed out in 1993. In 1994 the first first person shooter video game called Doom was released. Since then we have seen murder rates consistently decline while video games continued to get increasingly more realistic, immersive, and violent. Yes, it's quite clear that there is absolutely no link at all between TV/computer violence and violence in the real world. Sorry, Steve, your vision is false. The majority of violence continues to be felons killing felons. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #53 September 30, 2009 QuoteQuote remove guns and of course there would be much less of a problem... So you don't want to prevent murder, just make the tools used in it's commission a little less convenient? Yeah, much better if he had beaten his ex wife to death, not shot her. She could have fought back with her equal strength...er, wait a minute. Flaw in logic emerging. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #54 September 30, 2009 Quoteif people don't have so many guns then logically less people will be murdered with them... And if we ban spoons, less people will be fat and die of obesity then. Or you could accept the simple fact that both guns and spoons are just tools. And that people will kill or eat with something else."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #55 September 30, 2009 QuoteOr you could accept the simple fact that both guns and spoons are just tools. And that people will kill or eat with something else. Bah. Of course not. Without spoons (guns), there would be no more eating of ice cream (violent crime). Oh, wait, we'll have to ban those cone things (knives), too.-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
downwardspiral 0 #56 September 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteOr you could accept the simple fact that both guns and spoons are just tools. And that people will kill or eat with something else. Bah. Of course not. Without spoons (guns), there would be no more eating of ice cream (violent crime). Oh, wait, we'll have to ban those cone things (knives), too. And that's why I eat ice cream with chopsticks. Spoons are far too dangerous.www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #57 September 30, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteOr you could accept the simple fact that both guns and spoons are just tools. And that people will kill or eat with something else. Bah. Of course not. Without spoons (guns), there would be no more eating of ice cream (violent crime). Oh, wait, we'll have to ban those cone things (knives), too. And that's why I eat ice cream with chopsticks. Spoons are far too dangerous. Ack! No! Must ban chopsticks!-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #58 October 1, 2009 "gun addiction" has fuck all to do with it. There are lots of people out there who collect lots of guns, belong to gun clubs & read all those gun books & magazines & yet never try to kill anyone. Russia has much stricter gun laws than the US & double the per capita murder rate. And there are countries in South & Central America who don't allow their citizens to bear arms, and yet the murder rate is also higher. Maybe we should outlaw sex. Then there would be fewer people born who might turn out to be murderers, or their targets. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #59 October 1, 2009 I agree, the cost of Gun Addiction in America is way to high..... ...they wanted $18 for a box of .223 at Wally World! Fuck that!---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LongWayToFall 0 #60 October 1, 2009 Fuckin A right. Just so ya'll know, I had a most excellent time the other day learning how to skeet shoot. Using non toxic lead, shooting biodegradable clays. I was in San Francisco, after all. Guns are not always used for violence!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #61 October 1, 2009 They had 100 round boxes for $36 iirc in Union City TN wallyworld. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #62 October 1, 2009 QuoteI suspect that the opposition of some to this very reasonable suggestion is more readily attributable to their unreasoning prejudice against firearms, which stems from an often willful ignorance. Of course, that's often the same place a desire to ban firearms comes from. i suggest that suggesting i am wilfully ignorant and unreasonably prejudiced is very silly coming from someone who thinks a gun is a spoon...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #63 October 1, 2009 your dream-fu is weak today (where is your smiley face? -- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #64 October 1, 2009 careful with that spoon...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Glitch 0 #65 October 1, 2009 Someone once said something to the effect that 'if you don't know your history, your bound to repeat it'... the following is some food for thought: In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control.. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated. ------------------------------ In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated. ------------------------------ Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated. ------------------------------ China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated ------------------------------ Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.. ------------------------------ Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated ------------------------------ Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated. ----------------------------- Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million. ------------------------------ It has now been >12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own Government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in: List of 7 items: Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent. Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent. Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)! In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns! While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort, and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns. The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it. You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late! The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson. With guns, we are 'citizens.' Without them, we are 'subjects'. During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED! Note: I didnt' check the figures above as this was just c/p from an email... but I think the point is well made regardless of the technical accuracy... For those who wish to dispute the above, feel free to do so. BUT... also include 1, just one, example of a non-oppressed society where the citizens are actually better off in terms freedoms from the political power structure. Just one. Please, enlighten us. Randomly f'n thingies up since before I was born... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #66 October 1, 2009 your australian figures are two years out of date and not sourced - what are the latest figures?stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #67 October 1, 2009 said it before and I'll say it again, slowly this time in the hopes that at least some of the gun-ophobes might actually understand... Guns don't kill people any more than forks make people fat. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoteaccording to the latest crime statistics forks were only used in three murders last year...Only directly. The fork, by proxy, has been the cause of obesity, in the US, which, in turn, has led to the deaths of thousands. Maybe our only eating utensil, should be a dull edged butter knife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #68 October 1, 2009 Quotesaid it before and I'll say it again, slowly this time in the hopes that at least some of the gun-ophobes might actually understand... Guns don't kill people any more than forks make people fat. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoteaccording to the latest crime statistics forks were only used in three murders last year...Only directly. The fork, by proxy, has been the cause of obesity, in the US, which, in turn, has led to the deaths of thousands. Maybe our only eating utensil, should be a dull edged butter knife. i'm worried that many gun addicts confuse their guns with forks and spoons...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #69 October 1, 2009 Quotei'm worried that many gun addicts confuse their guns with forks and spoons... Lets see, exactly right now I'm ready for work and eating breakfast. On my person I have two loaded guns. A third loaded gun is with in reach. I have the news on and am eating. So far I haven't confused anything. As a side note, I also haven't murdered anyone and none of these loaded guns have come to life and killed anyone. Funny how reality is so different from what you believe it is. EDIT: As a side note, the 3rd loaded gun is one of those really really dangerous "assault rifles." Thank god 100 people have been instantly shot by that "assault rifle" while I eat breakfast.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #70 October 1, 2009 QuoteWith guns, we are 'citizens.' Without them, we are 'subjects'. Bullshit .. false logic. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Glitch 0 #71 October 1, 2009 What, didn't read to the bottom of the post? I've included the pertinant part: "NOTE: I didn't check the figures above as this was just c/p from an email... but I think the point is well made regardless of the technical accuracy... For those who wish to dispute the above, feel free to do so. BUT... also include 1, just one, example of a non-oppressed society where the citizens are actually better off in terms freedoms from the political power structure..."Randomly f'n thingies up since before I was born... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Glitch 0 #72 October 1, 2009 Yep, and I'm sure all those folks mentioned in my post would agree...Randomly f'n thingies up since before I was born... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cliffwhite 0 #73 October 1, 2009 QuoteQuoteI agree totally ... we need a “SAFE ZONE” … a place with ABSLOUTE ZERO TOLLERANCE for weapons of ANY kind ... where the POLICE have ABSLOUTE POWER of SEARCH & SESIURE ... I know I would feel a lot SAFER then. I have signs on my lawn declaring a firearmfree zone . Anyone on my property,including police and federal agents,must disarm or be considered a threat to my safety. I will preemptively shoot any one carrying firearms onto my property. Preemptive action has legal precedent if you consider the war in Iraq legal. Blues, Cliff2muchTruth Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #74 October 1, 2009 You're welcome to believe what you like, but don't expect others to take that as fact. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 7 #75 October 1, 2009 Quotei suggest that suggesting i am wilfully [SIC] ignorant and unreasonably prejudiced is very silly coming from someone who thinks a gun is a spoon... What is ignorant is how you think we are saying a gun is a spoon. No one EVER said that. We did say they are both TOOLS. And that the tool is not responsible for the act. You want to blame the tool (guns) for the act (killing). Therefore you must accept that the tool (spoons) are responsible for the act (over eating). And your being unreasonably prejudiced is clear."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 3 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
shropshire 0 #74 October 1, 2009 You're welcome to believe what you like, but don't expect others to take that as fact. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #75 October 1, 2009 Quotei suggest that suggesting i am wilfully [SIC] ignorant and unreasonably prejudiced is very silly coming from someone who thinks a gun is a spoon... What is ignorant is how you think we are saying a gun is a spoon. No one EVER said that. We did say they are both TOOLS. And that the tool is not responsible for the act. You want to blame the tool (guns) for the act (killing). Therefore you must accept that the tool (spoons) are responsible for the act (over eating). And your being unreasonably prejudiced is clear."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
