br0k3n 0
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br0k3n 0
QuoteSorry, prayer works, and it has been a great source of strength and guidance for me. But the one hitch is that you have to have a relationship with God and be forgiven of sin.
As a Christian and a medical professional I strongly believe in preventative medicine. Disease prevention can be accomplished by both proper moral behavior and medical practices. There are certainly no contradictions that I can see.
Lets be specific here, you have a “feeling” that prayer works, you don’t know for sure you cant.
However the power of prayer can be tested, and has been a number of times, all with the same result.
The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference.
The MANTRA study, run from Duke University Medical Center in North Carolina, involved 750 patients. link
Similar study here with the same results
I’ve lost track of the number of times I heard people pray for world peace, and it almost seems that we are moving opposite direction…
Now a much simpler test that we can all do is, and hopefully this will put an end to this undignified topic of praying, is this....
lets begin, or should I say Lets Pray..
[I]"Dear Jesus, please appear to us, as you did to Paul and the 500 brethren, so that we can see the evidence of your resurrection. In your name we pray, amen."[/I]
Ok so JC might be busy so lets give him a week, now after that week if he hasn’t appeared then there are only 3 logical reasons (1) God does not exist, (2) God does not want to or (3) God can't.
Alternative (2) and (3) are not worth your worship and thus they equal alternative (1).
So if noone has seen JC appear before then after a week then prayer does not work, and most likely there is NO GOD/s
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
QuoteQuoteThe big deal is the Catholic church contributing to the spread of AIDS. How could you possibly have been following the thread and not understanding that?
This is a complete lie. If a person follows the teachings of the Catholic Church to the letter, their chances of contracting AIDS is next to nil. Speedracer has said this over and over, but you are not interested in hearing it. You have your mind made up (think close minded). You have no interest in having honest dialog on this subject. I suspect your only motive is to agitate. Believe what you want and let others believe what they want.
JackC, I know many people may think this is a callous belief; but the teaching of the Catholic Church is that the eternal life of the soul is more important than the life of the body. The laws we were given to live by were meant for the salvation of our souls. Make no mistake about it, we as Catholics must do everything possible to help those suffering with HIV/AIDS; but the line is drawn at sin.
Hey, just for the record i believe in a higher power just don't know what....So, in response to your arguement, lets say a virgin gets in a car accident and needs a blood transfusion. The aids infected blood gets in their system. They do not realize this and get married and pass on the disease. "If a person follows the teachings of the Catholic Church to the letter, their chances of contracting AIDS is next to nil. " So could you please explain how either of these two people who have followed the catholic church all their life. Their chances of getting aids is NIL in your words
http://www.skydivethefarm.com
do you realize that when you critisize people you dont know over the internet, you become part of a growing society of twats? ARE YOU ONE OF THEM?
do you realize that when you critisize people you dont know over the internet, you become part of a growing society of twats? ARE YOU ONE OF THEM?
billvon 2,435
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)
> If a person follows the teachings of the Catholic Church to the letter,
> their chances of contracting AIDS is next to nil.
And if a jumper gets rid of their reserve, and packs/maintains their main so they never have a malfunction, their chances of dying while skydiving are quite low.
Still, I think most skydivers would realize that preaching "don't jump with reserves!" would kill far more people than it would save.
> their chances of contracting AIDS is next to nil.
And if a jumper gets rid of their reserve, and packs/maintains their main so they never have a malfunction, their chances of dying while skydiving are quite low.
Still, I think most skydivers would realize that preaching "don't jump with reserves!" would kill far more people than it would save.
JackC 0
Quoteno they're not.QuoteCatholics are not just saying the soul is more important, they are actually prepared to put the body at real physical risk of death
Well thanks for that Speedracer, that really clears things up.
Nevertheless, if some institution tells me I have to forego the requisite safety gear when I go into bat, I'm gonna say they're putting me at risk, especially when I could end up dead. In the real world, institutions that say things like that get sued, maybe even prosecuted and you know it.
pirana 0
Quote. . . the teaching of the Catholic Church is that the eternal life of the soul is more important than the life of the body.
All that's left is to show even a shred of evidence that such a thing exists.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
pirana 0
Quote
QuoteSorry, prayer works, and it has been a great source of strength and guidance for me. But the one hitch is that you have to have a relationship with God and be forgiven of sin.
As a Christian and a medical professional I strongly believe in preventative medicine. Disease prevention can be accomplished by both proper moral behavior and medical practices. There are certainly no contradictions that I can see.
Lets be specific here, you have a “feeling” that prayer works, you don’t know for sure you cant.
However the power of prayer can be tested, and has been a number of times, all with the same result.
The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference.
The MANTRA study, run from Duke University Medical Center in North Carolina, involved 750 patients. link
Similar study here with the same results
I’ve lost track of the number of times I heard people pray for world peace, and it almost seems that we are moving opposite direction…
Now a much simpler test that we can all do is, and hopefully this will put an end to this undignified topic of praying, is this....
lets begin, or should I say Lets Pray..
[I]"Dear Jesus, please appear to us, as you did to Paul and the 500 brethren, so that we can see the evidence of your resurrection. In your name we pray, amen."[/I]
Ok so JC might be busy so lets give him a week, now after that week if he hasn’t appeared then there are only 3 logical reasons (1) God does not exist, (2) God does not want to or (3) God can't.
Alternative (2) and (3) are not worth your worship and thus they equal alternative (1).
So if noone has seen JC appear before then after a week then prayer does not work, and most likely there is NO GOD/s
Logic is futile in this debate, because, for True Believers:
<> Feeling = knowing
<> Faith = fact
<> Evidence is that silly bullshit critical thinkers rely on to "know" something
<> Logic = academic trickery
<> And therefore, SHE'S A WITCH!! BUUURRRNNN HERRRR!
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
pirana 0
Resistance is futile. Your ass will be simulated.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
rehmwa 2
QuoteLogic is futile in this debate, because, for True Believers:
<> Feeling = knowing
<> Faith = fact
<> Evidence is that silly bullshit critical thinkers rely on to "know" something
<> Logic = academic trickery
<> And therefore, SHE'S A WITCH!! BUUURRRNNN HERRRR!
nonsense, logic is futile because this isn't a logical debate - on either side
Faith = Faith
that's it
I think that people are confusing a small group of SELF-righteous assholes with a huge group of everyday people and making broad claims.
both sides have these SELF-righteous assholes and they are the ones that stir the pot and cause trouble - those from either side that considered my first paragraph applied to the side you oppose? well, you are likely one of them
I think religious types should quit trying to claim Faith = Fact, that's utter nonsense - by DEFINITION.
I think the non-religious types should knock their chips off their shoulders and stop being asswipes and quit trying to force a discussion on FAITH into being a discussion on tangibility. Reacting to the Faith=fact crowd with more tangential strawmen discussions is silly when the Faith-fact people are already wrong in that simple equation "BELIEVE what you will, I disagree and believe otherwise. end of story". "Prove it" is a wasted discussion, it's impossible either way.
You can't discuss something that has no common ground and neither sides is willing to even remotely try to meet on a common ground. The only common ground is "faith" and that's so personal and subjective the entire discussion is big waste of time.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
rehmwa 2
Quotethe entire discussion is big waste of time.
actually not true - it's useful as it keeps two types of people really busy
1 - very religious types where religion is their crutch and not their strength
2 - very religious types that call themselves atheists, but really just have some grudge against the whole concept for some reason (maybe they were an alter boy that got teased)
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
pirana 0
Are you disagreeing with yourself?
And did you just call me religious?
And how do I make my voice do this?
And did you just call me religious?
And how do I make my voice do this?
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
rehmwa 2
QuoteAnd did you just call me religious?
I didn't not misrepresent you as one who isn't not anti-religiously disinclined.
In a way. But not so much directly as indirectly and only in terms of sporadic mockery and crabfilled goodness.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
br0k3n 0
Quote2 - very religious types that call themselves atheists
huh!
Look we are all atheists, some of us just go one god further then everyone else, When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours... (now who said that)
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
br0k3n 0
QuoteI think the non-religious types should knock their chips off their shoulders and stop being asswipes
Its not us atheists that are preventing people from protecting them selves, and by openly and knowingly lying about scientific evidence in order to push our agenda..
Also were not the “asswipes” that spent $35,000,000.00 on a museum to misinform and uneducated people. Personally I would rather see that money spent on feeding the starving or helping the millions of AIDS victims in Africa…
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
Derekbox 0
BBC News Article
The head of the Catholic Church in Mozambique has told the BBC he believes some European-made condoms are infected with HIV deliberately.
Maputo Archbishop Francisco Chimoio claimed some anti-retroviral drugs were also infected "in order to finish quickly the African people".
The Catholic Church formally opposes any use of condoms, advising fidelity within marriage or sexual abstinence.
Aids activists have been angered by the remarks, one calling them "nonsense".
"We've been using condoms for years now, and we still find them safe," prominent Mozambican Aids activist Marcella Mahanjane told the BBC.
The UN says anti-retrovirals (ARVs) have proved very effective for treating people with Aids. The drugs are not a cure, but attack the virus on several fronts at once.
The BBC's Jose Tembe in the capital, Maputo, says it is estimated that 16.2% of Mozambique's 19m inhabitants are HIV positive.
About 500 people are infected every day.
'Serious matter'
Archbishop Chimoio told our reporter that abstention, not condoms, was the best way to fight HIV/Aids.
"Condoms are not sure because I know that there are two countries in Europe, they are making condoms with the virus on purpose," he alleged, refusing to name the countries.
"They want to finish with the African people. This is the programme. They want to colonise until up to now. If we are not careful we will finish in one century's time."
Aids activists in the country have been shocked by the archbishop's comments.
"Condoms are one of the best ways of getting protection against catching Aids," said Gabe Judas, who runs Tchivirika (Hard Work) - an theatre group that promotes HIV/Aids awareness.
"People must use condoms as it's a safe way of having sex without catching Aids," he told the BBC.
Archbishop Chimoio, who made the remarks at celebrations to mark 43 years of independence, said that fighting the disease was a serious matter.
"If we are joking with this sickness we will be finished as soon as possible.
"If we want to change the situation to face HIV/Aids it's necessary to have a new mentality, if we don't change mentality we'll be finished quickly," he said.
"It means marriage, people being faithful to their wives... (and) young people must be abstaining from sexual relations."
Our correspondent says the archbishop is well respected in the country and the Catholic Church played a leading role in sponsoring the 1992 peace deal that ended a 16-year civil war.
Some 17.5% of Mozambicans are Catholic.
The head of the Catholic Church in Mozambique has told the BBC he believes some European-made condoms are infected with HIV deliberately.
Maputo Archbishop Francisco Chimoio claimed some anti-retroviral drugs were also infected "in order to finish quickly the African people".
The Catholic Church formally opposes any use of condoms, advising fidelity within marriage or sexual abstinence.
Aids activists have been angered by the remarks, one calling them "nonsense".
"We've been using condoms for years now, and we still find them safe," prominent Mozambican Aids activist Marcella Mahanjane told the BBC.
The UN says anti-retrovirals (ARVs) have proved very effective for treating people with Aids. The drugs are not a cure, but attack the virus on several fronts at once.
The BBC's Jose Tembe in the capital, Maputo, says it is estimated that 16.2% of Mozambique's 19m inhabitants are HIV positive.
About 500 people are infected every day.
'Serious matter'
Archbishop Chimoio told our reporter that abstention, not condoms, was the best way to fight HIV/Aids.
"Condoms are not sure because I know that there are two countries in Europe, they are making condoms with the virus on purpose," he alleged, refusing to name the countries.
"They want to finish with the African people. This is the programme. They want to colonise until up to now. If we are not careful we will finish in one century's time."
Aids activists in the country have been shocked by the archbishop's comments.
"Condoms are one of the best ways of getting protection against catching Aids," said Gabe Judas, who runs Tchivirika (Hard Work) - an theatre group that promotes HIV/Aids awareness.
"People must use condoms as it's a safe way of having sex without catching Aids," he told the BBC.
Archbishop Chimoio, who made the remarks at celebrations to mark 43 years of independence, said that fighting the disease was a serious matter.
"If we are joking with this sickness we will be finished as soon as possible.
"If we want to change the situation to face HIV/Aids it's necessary to have a new mentality, if we don't change mentality we'll be finished quickly," he said.
"It means marriage, people being faithful to their wives... (and) young people must be abstaining from sexual relations."
Our correspondent says the archbishop is well respected in the country and the Catholic Church played a leading role in sponsoring the 1992 peace deal that ended a 16-year civil war.
Some 17.5% of Mozambicans are Catholic.
br0k3n 0
History teaches us that no other cause has brought more death than the word of god.
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
Derekbox 0
Amen and praise the lord to that shizzle....
OH MY GOD (accuse the pun) Yes they are, they Catholic church is denying the use of condoms, which prevent the spread of disease, some which are deadly. How is that not putting the body at risk????? Speedracer you know you fighting a loosing battle with this topic, so just stop be annoying and making us all have to constantly explain this to you.. Or are you actually having problems understanding this?????
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
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