USA - Glorifying guns?

[rehmwa 2]

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In the context of the current tragedy, isn't this thread null and void, considering the gunman is a S. Korean national, not a US citizen?

You beat me to it.

There is so much people can say about how bad the gun culture is, and how horrible the things are that Americans expose their kids to.

Is it not interesting (but reasonable) that the assumption was a white cornfed American male who was responsible. I mean, this had white boy written all over it.

Perhaps it is less about American glorification of guns than people would like it to be.

nonsense, he was polluted by eating in the cafeteria with "white American boys"

the obvious solution isn't to delete all guns. It's to delete all white American males

then everything would be perfect in the world

it's really simple, you just need a bunch of strings covered in fructose and a blimp.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[craddock 0]

I made nothing up. I asked for examples which you failed to provide.

Goodbye.

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[jakee 1,263]

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I made nothing up. I asked for examples which you failed to provide.

Goodbye.

You just made that up!

You asked for examples which I did provide. Unfortunately you were too impatient to wait for my reply, assumed there were no examples and declared that I had made it up. That is your failing, not mine.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Axe_Murderer 0]

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Citizens owning guns can be a very good thing, but citizens owning guns who are young and impressionable, now that's a recipee for disaster

That should read

Citizens owning guns and having the proper training in proper use and the responsibility of gun ownership IS a very good thing, but citizens owning guns who are young and impressionable without that training and sence of morals is not, and that can be a recipee for disaster

thanks

[jakee 1,263]

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In the context of the current tragedy, isn't this thread null and void, considering the gunman is a S. Korean national, not a US citizen?

In the context of America's generally appalling firearms homicide rate isn't this thread still extremely relevant?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[DJL 232]

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In the context of the current tragedy, isn't this thread null and void, considering the gunman is a S. Korean national, not a US citizen?

I see a pretty thorough analysis coming forth in this about what movies and videogames he was playing. They'll probably still blame it on some first person shooter and say there was American influence even though the game maker is Konami.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[NCclimber 0]

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Asseting something and showing it to be true are two completely different things. You seem to be big on making assertions about me, without ever proving them. [Tongue]

And yet, Jakee has shown very little to back up the following.

Well, I have demonstrated the third point, I've shown one example of the first (was planning on saving digging up another 9 until I'm bored to tears later on at work this evening). As for the second, well this thread should serve for a start. Note the discussions of which round will cause the largest wound.

Really? You gave one example of the third. It seemed a bit over the top, but that's just me.

One example of the second.

And I missed any examples of the first. Perhaps you could tell with post that was in.

Getting back to your initial post, it seemed that your point was those situations your provided were fairly commonplace. Providing rare examples doesn't really prove that point.

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I don't think that the main problem in the USA is that they have a lot of guns, I think it is the manner in which they view their guns, and their willingness to use them in any situation that could remotely be construed as self defense.

You can look back on this forum and see just how many posters are afraid to leave the house without being able to shoot someone, how many posters want to know what the best bullet for killing people is, how many posters reply to stories of succesful deterrance with the suggestion that it would have been much better if the OP had shot everyone instead of just scaring them off.

From what you've shown the answers are:

1) 0
2) 1
3) 1*

[craddock 0]

I just checked to see where you are from as there is obviously a language barrier or comprehension problem. Not sure what the problem is. Not sure what I made up? I asked for examples. So far all you have came up with was One example for that question. Perhaps that is were you are struggling. Plural vs singular. If I go hunting grouse and I ask someone for some shotgun shells, do you think I will be happy if I get One shell? If my wife and I fly to Flordia to do some jumps in the winter, do you think I will be content if she lets me do One Jump?

I did not ask for an Example. That is what you have provided. Your implication was that there were many posters saying these things. I doubted it and asked for examples. What the fuck does a single example prove? I have failed? I just made that up? Just blame it on a language barrier and go away.
I have already made my point. It was never to you I needed to make it anyway. I just wanted to make sure the casual reader did not take away the implication you intended. I would think your lack of examples and attacks on me have helped immensily.

For that I thank you.

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[billvon 2,446]

Both of you cut it out.

[kallend 1,658]

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Yesterday's events prove that it's not the brightest idea to depend on the kindness of criminals where your personal safety is concerned.

No it showed that relying on the local armed police force for your only personal safety is a VERY stupid thing to do .

.

No, it showed that unstable people shouldn't have access to guns regardless of whether or not they have a previous criminal record.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,658]

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No. Quit lying! I never said you did not have examples of this. Never!

"Do you have examples of this? No? Anything else you want to make up?"

You can't get anywhere. It's like arguing with the March Hare or Mad Hatter. Normal rules don't apply.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[craddock 0]

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One example of the second.

Actually, in the example I saw him give I must have missed people asking about the best bullet for "killing". I read(skimmed) talk about over penatration and some on and wound size I equate wound size that with stopping power, not "killing people" He said you could look back at this forum and see just many posters want to know what the best bullet for killing people is. The thread he referenced was a much more responsible thread than that.

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[NCclimber 0]

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In the context of the current tragedy, isn't this thread null and void, considering the gunman is a S. Korean national, not a US citizen?

In the context of America's generally appalling firearms homicide rate isn't this thread still extremely relevant?

And let's break it down by race.



Or is that taboo?

[GeorgiaDon 340]

According to CNN the guy has had a green card since 1992. If he is (was) 23, then he's been here since he was 8. Many legal immigrants are here on a H or J visa for years before they qualify for a green card, so he could have been significantly younger than 8 when he was brought here. At any rate he clearly grew up in American culture and it's influence can't be dismissed simply by saying he was a Korean national. Which is not to say that the problem in this case is American culture, just that it can't be dismissed out of hand.

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[jakee 1,263]

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Not sure what I made up? I asked for examples.

You asked for examples, assumed there were none and accused me of making up my whole post and being intentionally misleading. How much clearer do you want me to make this for you?

Tell you what, the SC references were merely supposed to be for illustration - you obviously find them inflammatory so lets put them aside for a moment.

Do you agree or disagree with my root proposition, that the USA has a general cultural problem with its attitude to guns, as evidenced by its extremely high firearms homicide rate?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[craddock 0]

Sure he can. Provide examples. I asked somewhat out of curiousity and somewhat out of disbelief. I think we now know the answer

Has it been that recent since I have argued with you that I deserve a PA?

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[justinb138 0]

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Yesterday's events prove that it's not the brightest idea to depend on the kindness of criminals where your personal safety is concerned.

No it showed that relying on the local armed police force for your only personal safety is a VERY stupid thing to do .

.

No, it showed that unstable people shouldn't have access to guns regardless of whether or not they have a previous criminal record.

Actually, it showed alot of things.

1. It showed that relying on the local armed police force for your personal safety isn't effective.

2. It showed that unstable people shouldn't have access to guns regardless of whether or not they have a previous criminal record (Which under most state laws, they shouldn't)

3. It shows that there is no such thing as a "gun free zone".

4. It shows that criminals don't obey gun laws.

5. It also shows that banning handguns at schools is a really effective way to make sure that criminals are the only ones with guns.

[jakee 1,263]

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From what you've shown the answers are:

1) 0
2) 1
3) 1*

And the * stands for? Regardless, your numbers are incorrect.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[mnealtx 0]

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Yesterday's events prove that it's not the brightest idea to depend on the kindness of criminals where your personal safety is concerned.

No it showed that relying on the local armed police force for your only personal safety is a VERY stupid thing to do .

.

No, it showed that unstable people shouldn't have access to guns regardless of whether or not they have a previous criminal record.

And 'unstable' people should be under direct observation 24/7, "for their own protection", of course.

And of course, we wouldn't want them speaking out in public and spreading those views, much less voting... right?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 2,446]

Your one warning.

[jakee 1,263]

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And let's break it down by race.

Or is that taboo?

Not to me.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[sundevil777 94]

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Don't forget how movies and TV shows show us how cool it is to hold a gun sideways while shooting, and when you've got a gun for each hand it is really cool to cross your arms in order to shoot in different directions.

I'm curious. If that was a strong cause in what we see today, why wasn't my generation that grew up on westerns where there was a shootout every half hour on the streets of didge city terrozing the streets with our ow shootouts?

I don't know. Modern films/TV shows it in a much more 'cool' way, makes it seem so much more glamorous, I think.

By the way, I have a gun and in general I support gun ownership rights. However I think both sides of the issue are taking unreasonable positions, both sides fearing the slippery slope if they give an inch, no matter what the specific issue at hand.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Amazon 7]

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No, it showed that unstable people shouldn't have access to guns regardless of whether or not they have a previous criminal record.

And who.. and by what standard do we as a society deem as unstable.... VERY VERY slippery slope there for abuse by the whackjobs in Washington. Do we only allow those who go to church?? Do we only allow those who are allowed by the government because they have their jackboots spitshined???

[jakee 1,263]

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I read(skimmed) talk about over penatration and some on and wound size I equate wound size that with stopping power, not "killing people"

To me, the two would generally seem to go hand in hand. I'll concede the point though.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[DaVinci 0]

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I don't think there is a direct answer, a so-called solution to this problem. A long time ago the US decided that guns were important to them as a nation and all(most) people were given the right to own them. I agree that in the last decade or so, violence has been glorified, gangsters have been glorified and to a large degree guns and its illegal use have been glorified. Just turn on VH1 or MTV. Combine that with even less parental and/or family oversight and the mix is quite explosive.

The US simply has many more guns in circulation than most other western countries. They are easier to come by and acquire than most anywhere else in the western hemisphere. Hence, in my humble opinion, yesterdays events at VT are simply the price the US, as a society, pays for the 2nd amendmend.

Yes, the ease of aquiring guns has done a lot of good in the US as well. It has prevented crime, it has stopped criminals, killed criminals, prevented crime, protected homes, families and loved ones. But, there is always another side to the coin, a price to pay if you will. Yesterday the world saw what that price is.

In my opinion, there is no solution to this. The US chose a path to walk down, a path with pros and cons.

Well written and I agree 100%. I would have added video games to the list of things that encourage violence. And I would have also added that it is up to the US to decide how to handle the issue, not well intending outsiders.