Did Clinton actually lie?

[SpeedRacer 1]

I was digging through my old emails. My Dad has often argued about politics with his friends thru email. Back in 2002 or 3 one of my Dad's friends sent him this email re. the Clinton/Lewinsky affair:
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Jim,
The frequency with which you mention Clinton lying about sex with Monica prompts me to speculate that I may be the only person in America who doesn't think he lied. Clinton and I come from the same geographical area but from opposite sides of the river. And in that area everyone frequently uses the term "going all the way". And they understand that going all the way means fornication, copulation, fucking. And nothing else. Doesn't mean necking or petting or heavy petting or French kissing or oral sex. Means fucking. Penetration of the vagina by the penis. "Finger fucking" is not fucking, is not "going all the way". I have known--alas, long, long ago--devout Catholic girls who merrily and with a totally clear conscious engaged in oral sex. Didn't even think that had to confess it because it didn't compromise their virginity, wasn't fornication, wasn't "going all the way". And in that place, incidentally, the word "cock" strangely referred to the vagina and more than one Southern boy, drafted into the army, raised lots of eyebrows by announcing that he was going on liberty to "get some cock".
And I suppose you at the time must have heard about the American and Aussie drinking beer at a pub down under and watching news about the Monica affair on TV. The American asks the Aussie what he thinks about it all and the Aussie replied: "Thank God we got all the convicts and you got all the Puritans".
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Speed Racer
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[StreetScooby 5]

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the Clinton/Lewinsky affair:

That question should never have been asked in the first place. It had absolutely no relevance to anything.

We are all engines of karma

[Skyrad 0]

I agree

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[happythoughts 0]

Standard political bs tactic.

If someone is hustling you at pool and losing with the current rules, they will try to change the rules. "No, everyone knows that you have to make the 8-ball where you made your last ball."

That is why Socrates said that he had no knowledge, but he had a method to find it. The initial part of the method would be to define the words being used.

This one doesn't qualify as even a thin rationalization.

Everytime that I hear this, I ask one question.

You walk into the living room unannounced and catch your daughter giving a sloppy bj to her b/f.
She looks up and says, "No, according to your definition, this isn't sex."

I ask them, "Based on your definition, you would agree with her, right?"

(edited to add: I am totally for BJs. I am glad he received them. The world would be a lot less tense place if all world leaders got them regularly. However, to deny it is a lie.)

[masterrig 1]

Depends on your definition of the word 'lie'!


Chuck

[happythoughts 0]

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Depends on your definition of the word 'lie'!

Chuck

"I did not have..."

Depends on your definition of the word "I".

I've done some stuff that are uncharacteristic of my regular self. It shouldn't be said that "I" did them.


(Unfortunately, popular opinion among women within groping distance is that this was typical.)

[slug 1]

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the Clinton/Lewinsky affair:

That question should never have been asked in the first place. It had absolutely no relevance to anything.

Hi SS

Sorry got to disagree.

Slick Willy held the highest office in the country. By getting his rocks off with a gov't employee and leaving a DNA trail. He opened himself up for blackmail by anyone who could prove anything happened.

Thats why Monica's best friend taped their phone converations, That why Slick Willy was looking at getting Monica a Federal Job $$$$ at the UN.

When the honeymoon is over theat when the shit starts to hit the fan. The higher up on the food chain the higher the price.

Monica could have qualified for the head of FEMA

R.I.P.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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Standard political bs tactic.

not political bs at all. the writer of the letter was talking about the local attitudes & terminology where he grew up in Arkansas.

Speed Racer
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[Gravitymaster 0]

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Standard political bs tactic.

not political bs at all. the writer of the letter was talking about the local attitudes & terminology where he grew up in Arkansas.

It is political BS. Clinton was what, in his 50's when this happened. Had traveled all over the world, college etc. You make it sound as if he was some little 16 year old hick from Arkansas.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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Monica could have qualified for the head of FEMA

I heard she was actually offered a seat on the Presidential staff, but she blew it.

Speed Racer
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[masterrig 1]

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Depends on your definition of the word 'lie'!

Chuck

"I did not have..."

Depends on your definition of the word "I".

I've done some stuff that are uncharacteristic of my regular self. It shouldn't be said that "I" did them.


(Unfortunately, popular opinion among women within groping distance is that this was typical.)

_____________________________________

Hmmmmm... All I see here is just 'hear-say'. Nothing substantial.


Chuck

[Andy9o8 0]

Old news.
Yawn.
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[lawrocket 3]

Lie? yes. He did have "sexual relations with that woman - Miss Lewinsky." I mean, how else would you characterize it? "Asexual?" "Father/Daughter?" "Employee/Employer?" "Friendly?"

He said he didn't. He did. Therefore, "lie."

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[jakee 1,260]

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Lie? yes. He did have "sexual relations with that woman - Miss Lewinsky."

I agree. Had he said "I did not have sex with that woman" he could have argued he was referring to full sex only. "Sexual relations" is surely much wider in scope, right?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rushmc 18]

How about charges of rape?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[lawrocket 3]

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How about charges of rape?

That one truly DOES depend on the definition.

Did he commit sexual harassment? You BET! He gave special access and privileges to a chick that granted him sexual favors. A President using an intern.

That's not rape in my book, though it is sexual harassment and discrimination - and entirely inappropriate. Trust me, if I was boinking my receptionist and she filed a complaint with the Justice Department, i'd be in some serious trouble with the DOJ.

Guess what? THAT was my main problem with what Clinton did. Then he lied about it, which was problem number 2.

Let's cut the shit about a consenting relationship and view what it was - a middle-aged man who happened to be the most powerful person in the world and a young female intern who lacked a security clearance in the oval office. The "affairs of state" took precedence over the affairs of state.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[rushmc 18]

You are right of course but I meant to be more clear in the fact that the Lewinsky episode never would have come up had there not been other charges made by other women. Charges coming from before he was president.

Those invesitgation are what got him in deep .....

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jpjc2000 0]

Since Clinton fucked over the two people he is supposed to love the most, Hitlery & daughter, is it reasonable to think he would fuck over the population he was supposed to be leading into the future?

[StreetScooby 5]

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Since Clinton fucked over the two people he is supposed to love the most, Hitlery & daughter, is it reasonable to think he would fuck over the population he was supposed to be leading into the future?

Have you heard about JFK?

We are all engines of karma

[speedy 0]

Bill Clinton said " I did not have sex with that women, Monika Lewinski".

Now I don't know which women he was referring to or why he was wanted to tell Monika Lewinski this, but my guess is that he was not lying.

Dave

Fallschirmsport Marl

[kallend 1,651]

Of course Clinton lied.

Just like Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Carter, Reagan and both Bushes have lied. (I expect Ford lied too, but I can't think of the specifics like I can with the others).

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[happythoughts 0]

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Have you heard about JFK?

1. JFK was involved with a woman who later turned out to be a German spy. He was quietly sent to the Pacific to avoid scandal.

2. JFK parked a boat capable of 60mph speeds and ineptly got ran over. (Probably a one-of-a-kind incident)
He was then welcomed as a returning hero for saving the men that he put in jepoardy by his ineptitude.

3. As President, he created the welfare policies that we still suffer from and try to reform.

Any affairs were just a continuation of his long line personal and professional mistakes.

[RippedCord 0]

Yes. And under oath.

AMDG

[Guest]

Hear, hear, hear.

He should have been attending to the people's business, not taking care of business, while he was on the clock.

That's my biggest problem with it - the unethical behavior. That he lied about it under oath just made it worse.

However, I wonder how much different everything would have been if he'd just came out and said "Yeah, I did - so what?"

mh

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[kallend 1,651]

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Hear, hear, hear.

He should have been attending to the people's business, not taking care of business, while he was on the clock.

That's my biggest problem with it - the unethical behavior. That he lied about it under oath just made it worse.

However, I wonder how much different everything would have been if he'd just came out and said "Yeah, I did - so what?"

mh

Did you have problems with Nixon's lies, with Reagan's lies and with Bush's lies about substantive issues, or are your problems restricted to Democrats' sex lives?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.