Gee... I wonder if obesity is becoming a problem.

[ACMESkydiver 0]

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I suggest we encourage others and support them in attaining a healthier lifestyle, instead of stereotyping "fat people" and laughing at them, while doing nothing to help remedy the situation.

That's an excellent point, Sarah. I absolutely agree.

There's a very large woman who goes to my gym. She gets up on the elliptical machine and huffs and puffs along with the fitter people next to her for 40 minutes.

It's all I can do not to go up and high-five her. It takes a lot of courage to get out there when you're not already in half-way decent shape.

That is a healthy attitude to have. I wish we could see more of it.
I felt horribly embarrassed every time I walked in the gym at school this past year. I couldn't hide anywhere.

If it was aerobics, all the girls are 19-22 and size 3 with bare tummies and tiny outfits. -More power to 'em, but I feel like such an outcast in my sweats and oversized shirts to try to cover all of me...

If it was weights, I have the 20-something guys that are buff and have been lifting since infancy and here I am again...the overweight 30-something in the weight room.

Dammit I should have a higher self-esteem than that to let it bother me. I saw the stares. I saw the looks. I wanted to shout out "Would it make you feel better if I was sitting on a bench eating a cupcake?!" I mean f*ck I was trying to get healthier none of their stares will make me better, so ignore it...at least that's what I had to tell every minute of every workout.

If I keep going some day they won't stare any more.

Man I wish there were more people like you Rebecca! I bet that in itself would be enough to get many people to put on those sweats and head off to the gym, knowing they wouldn't get those looks. I'm a tough woman but there are some things even I can't keep from eating my self-image.

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[stallboy 0]

There is a lot of "blah blah" about this debate, on both sides. The truth is that this is (in virtually every case) a self inflicted condition. When I read stories about people, especially children with diseases that have no cure it is a bit difficult to sympathise with someone who is by choice eating themselves to death!

The problem is one of personally responsibility, if someone thinks their condition is "genetic" or "glandular" and not in their control they will do nothing about it.

Before leaping to the defence of the morbidly obese, I seriously suggest people stop and think are they really helping these people? In most cases this "help" reinforces the view that "it's not my fault I'm fat".

One day, I'm gonna grow wings, a chemical reaction, hysterical and useless...

[feuergnom 22]

there are simply way to many lard assed kids out there brought up by ignorant dimlit lard-assed parents to dumb to care for their breed

when i went to school some 20 years ago there where two "fat" kids in my class, compared to what i see on the streets every day now they would be called slim today

The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle

dudeist skydiver # 666

[NWFlyer 2]

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Man I wish there were more people like you Rebecca! I bet that in itself would be enough to get many people to put on those sweats and head off to the gym, knowing they wouldn't get those looks. I'm a tough woman but there are some things even I can't keep from eating my self-image.

Jaye, it's an incredibly tough thing, and when I was over 300 lbs it was really hard for me to want to go to the gym. Fortunately, I found a gym with a relatively small pecentage of snobs... just lots of people of varying fitness levels who were trying to get (or stay) healthy.

One of my best moments was after I'd lost over 100 lbs and one of the regular gym rats that I would see a lot (we'd never met, but would smile and say hi in the way that strangers who see each other a lot do) blurted out "You look like a completely different person." He sat there for about 5 minutes and told me how he'd watched me for the time I'd been coming to that gym (about 2 years at the time of the conversation) and was so impressed with the changes.

This wasn't someone I'd ever felt judged by as he always had a friendly smile for me and everyone at the gym, but was the type of person that could be seen as very intimidating in the gym - the hard-core bodybuilder type who is only there to maintain an already amazing body.

[NWFlyer 2]

I'm not leaping to anyone's defense. I've said before that I don't think it's a healthy, happy way to live, and I strongly disagree with anyone who argues that it is. What I am trying to do is help people understand how hatred doesn't help the situation either.

[Lindsey 0]

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There is a lot of "blah blah" about this debate, on both sides. The truth is that this is (in virtually every case) a self inflicted condition. When I read stories about people, especially children with diseases that have no cure it is a bit difficult to sympathise with someone who is by choice eating themselves to death!

The problem is one of personally responsibility, if someone thinks their condition is "genetic" or "glandular" and not in their control they will do nothing about it.

Before leaping to the defence of the morbidly obese, I seriously suggest people stop and think are they really helping these people? In most cases this "help" reinforces the view that "it's not my fault I'm fat".

In my mind, it's less an issue of whose fault it is than how incredibly mean people can be. If a person is obese, then that's a difficult problem all on its own...THAT person's problem. Lack of compassion today is at least as big of a problem, imho.

It is alarming that morbid obesity is so commonplace nowadays. Regardless of the cause, denigrating people who are obese won't solve the problem. So how about live and let live if you can't be kind? Or better yet, offering some encouragement to the person who's trying to lose weight.....or to someone who has and is trying to keep it off.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[NWFlyer 2]

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Or better yet, offering some encouragement to the person who's trying to lose weight.....or to someone who has and is trying to keep it off.

To people who've never really struggled with food and weight issues, it's hard to comprehend how difficult they can be. I get it. I never, ever want pity or sympathy (what a way to make things even worse), but empathy goes a long way.

This goes against my better judgment, but fuck it, I'm already knee-deep in this debate, so I'm going to include a blog entry I wrote, just two months ago. This sounds like something I could have written *before* I lost the weight I did, but sadly, I wrote it after. It gives (maybe) a small glimpse into the daily battles I have with myself and my own addictive behavior.

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Anatomy of a Binge

It starts off innocently, as many do… a stressful afternoon, and a brownie as a reward. A cookie, a bagel, dessert after the expensive dinner with your work teammates. It ebbs and flows, staying mostly at bay through the weekend though there are indulgences here and there… a waffle at the breakfast buffet, a slice of sweet potato pie after BBQ. And then it’s Monday and a renewed commitment to stay on your food plan comes in. Until the afternoon, when suddenly one cookie doesn’t seem like such a bad idea even though you know, intellectually, that it is. You know that one cookie leads to two, which leads to three and four and five, furtively consumed away from others, to maintain the illusion that you eat in any kind of controlled fashion.

There’s no shortage of food available; it doesn’t even take any effort. Between the plates of cookies and brownies at the office and the well-stocked hotel evening hospitality hour buffet, getting three, four, five slices of cake isn’t that difficult. Of course, there’s the matter of seeming casual about the multiple trips to the buffet, the careful use of one styrofoam plate to cover another as you take two slices of chocolate cake up to the room. You wonder if everyone else assumes they’re just for you or if you’ve got others up in the hotel room waiting to enjoy the slice. After a while you don’t really care any more.

Late at night already full you pad down to the front desk in your socks hoping they’ll have popcorn at the mini-market. After sweet upon sweet upon sweet your body demands savory and salty now to feed the need… whatever it needs, and needs now.

Inside the binge, there is no past, there is no future, there is only now.

If there were a past, then you would remember the pain, you would remember what it is like to be constantly in the clutches of compulsive overeating. You would remember the past and not want to return. You would remember the pain of not being able to do the things you love, the pain of being so out of shape and sick, physically and mentally, that you could barely get through a day, let alone fly free. But there is no past, only present.

There is no future. If there were a future, then you would know what it will feel like. You would know the pain, mental, physical, and emotional that this binge will bring on. You will know what it will feel like to go to sleep with tears in your eyes, your body spent and exhausted from processing the vast amount of food you’ve shoved into it, angry at yourself and your lack of self-control and emotionally spent from the energy of bingeing and yet feeling no closer to peace than you were before. If there were a future, you would know that the binge does not solve the problem and that in fact it creates others. But there is no future, there is only now.

There is only now. And now it is about the food. It is about eating without consciousness, almost willing yourself to eat more and more, with a tiny thought gnawing at your mind that “this isn’t right.” A small voice says “Stop” and yet you don’t, you can’t, you won’t… you will just feed. And yet, you know you can’t really feed your soul, you know this doesn’t work and yet you try, aware, still that it is futile.

And you wake up the next day… and you write about it. You hope that it will help to heal you. Because you are sick again.

[wmw999 2,148]

That was really nice and well-written. There are cookies at my office, too. Donuts, and a whole filing cabinet full of cheaper junk food. Fortunately, it's farther away than the water.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[ccowden 0]

This is exactly the attitude I have. I absolutely applaud those who choose to recognize the problem obesity has become for them for many reasons and then choose to do something about it. I tried to be very clear that it is NOT all obese or overweight people I have a problem with, it is the ones who DON'T care and make it clear that they don't care and basically say fuck it because they know the rest of America will accommodate them and HAVE to put up with them because it is a right they have. But someone always need to make it seem that this attitude blankets ALL obese people and that you "hate fat people" if you voice these opinions.

When I got out of the Army and settled back into civilian life back in the early 90s, I started a very unhealthy lifestyle simply because I didn't care anymore. I drank heavily, probably to the point of what I would consider to be an alcoholic, I began smoking, I ate junk and alot of it, and I sat around like a lazy fat ass. I got up to 215lbs, which is about 35lbs overweight for me. Then one day I looked in the mirror and realized what I was doing to myself. I couldn't walk up the stairs without losing my breath, I had to buy new clothes to fit me, and I overall felt like crap most of the time. So, I decided to change it. I began to eat right, exercise, and give up the lifestyle that got me there. It wasn't easy, but I did it and I got my weight and health back to where it should be.

My mom has struggled with obesity her whole life after having 2 children. She was a very skinny girl up to that point, but then started letting herself go because that was the easy thing to do. Then she got to the point where she just didn't care anymore. When she decided she wanted to change it, she asked me for help. I was supportive the whole way and gave her guidance and ideas. I even got up every morning to go on her walks with her so that she could stay motivated and not feel alone. I did this because I care.

I understand the struggles and the different body types and the disorders, etc. I am compassionate and supportive to those who struggle with obesity and are trying to change it. It is the people who throw up their hands and allow themselves to get to a point of what they consider no return and believe that it is the rest of society who needs to accommodate them, rather then themselves doing anything about it.

I am not stereotyping "fat people." In fact, I have stated very clearly the difference. There are the people who know it is a problem and choose to correct it, and there is the people who don't care and feel it is the job of others to adapt to them. There is a clear difference between what my original post and my opinions are about, but I am sure some will refuse to see it and just say I am a fat hater and have a bad attitude or that I am prejudice or whatever. That's fine.

[stallboy 0]

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... If a person is obese, then that's a difficult problem all on its own...THAT person's problem. Lack of compassion today is at least as big of a problem, imho

It is also the problem of their family and friends when they are standing around the grave of a person who ended their life early.

As for denigration, hmm is it unreasonable to criticise those who eat vast quantities of food, do no exercise when they know it will knock decades off their lifespan? Isn't that reason enough to put the fork down, are these people really waiting for my understanding and empathy before they do something about it?

It is not hatred, it is disgust that the precious gift of life is wasted on people who have such little regard for it.

As for compassion.... do you want fries with that?

One day, I'm gonna grow wings, a chemical reaction, hysterical and useless...

[ccowden 0]

Excellent points!

When I was watching my mom having trouble catching her breath, getting up from sitting, having knee surgery, and hurting herself, I felt compassion and wanted to help her. I didn't want my mom to have a poor quality of life or die early because of something she can change. I got on her case sometimes and stated my opinions and she sometimes would get mad and say i wasn't accepting her for who she was. And she was right. I wasn't going to accept it. But it wasn't because of who she was. it was because of how she was hurting herself, and I couldn't just stand by and watch her do it.

When you see a friend who is doing drugs and killing themselves with the problem, you don't pat them on the back and say it's ok. You do everything in your power to help them. Being compassionate and being enabling are two entirely different things. And a person who has a problem and wants to change it and a person who thinks it is everyone elses problem to deal with their choices, are two entirely different people. The easy way out is never the best way when you have a problem, and the easy way out with obesity is to just say this is who I am and you need to accept it because I have. Drug addicts will say the same thing.

My opinions are not formed from hatred or prejudice. They come from seeing a problem and not accepting it and speaking out against it. But it is much easier for people to label it as hatred and prejudice than to see it for what it is and take the first difficult steps to changing their lifestyle.

[lawrocket 3]

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started a very unhealthy lifestyle simply because I didn't care anymore. I drank heavily, probably to the point of what I would consider to be an alcoholic, I began smoking, I ate junk and alot of it, and I sat around like a lazy fat ass. I got up to 215lbs, which is about 35lbs overweight for me.

I have a similar story, only I got up to 245. I became obese (at least according to the generally bullshit BMI standards where I could be 145 and be a "normal" weight). As a result of my own personal struggle, I find myself less tolerant of those who make excuses, including my brothers.

I think that part of it is the desire for gratification. While we know that eating those donuts is destructive, we do it anyway. I have a donut for breakfast 2 or 3 times per week. It's cheap and easy to stop by the place on my way to work. 55 cents for a devil's food. And you know, I love those. I could eat ten of them.

But I have ONE donut. Back when I used to drink (last month) I would have a beer or two - no more. I used to drink to much, and I found out that once I got beer that I really enjoyed the taste of, I tended to nurse it.

Go to Taco Bell for lunch? I get A burrito.
Go to McDonald's for lunch? I get A burger.
Donut shop? I get A donut.
Gonna have a soda? I get a 22 ouncer.

I don't exercise the way I used to. I quit running five years ago because my torn ACL just gave me too many problems afterward. But I'm not in bad shape - I rollerblade when I can. My son takes me on walks daily (yes, he takes me). So I am not running 40 miles a week anymore. It's fine, because I also eat less than I did back then.

Everyone recognizes the problems. Everyone recognizes the issues. It IS easier for guys to lose weight - I do not deny that. It's not only our metabolisms and muscle mass, though. It's our mentality. We don't expect to lose 30 pounds in time for summer. We don't get down on ourselves for splurging on a sundae. We just say, "Mulligan" and continue where we were.

Especially with a group like skydivers, it's tough to say, "Put your personal pleasure aside and start acting reasonably and with moderation." There is nothing reasonable or moderate about what we do for fun, and the only reason we do it is that it's fun - it gives us pleasure.

People - moderate your behaviors. All of them.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[LouDiamond 1]

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My opinions are not formed from hatred or prejudice. They come from seeing a problem and not accepting it and speaking out against it. But it is much easier for people to label it as hatred and prejudice than to see it for what it is and take the first difficult steps to changing their lifestyle.

Very well put. I don't think anyone involved in this thread hates fat/obese people the way it has been portrayed. We live in a society where no one wants their "rights" violated or to be inconveinenced. Be it from a person smoking a few tables away to some one saying something that isn't "PC". From the examples given early on in this thread, I can see how this might be considered hate.

However, you pay your hard earned money for an airline seat, you expect to be able to sit in your seat without someone else on top of you. Having stood in the aisle by the bathrooms for 4 hours because the person sitting next to me was in fact sitting in 1 1/2 seats, I can see how people would be mad. Realizing that the person next to me was already uncomfortable, I raised the arm between the seats and excused myself to the bathroom and never came back until it was time to land. I could of bitched and moaned about the situation to the flight attendants, to the airline but when your sealed in a metal tube on a full flight there isn't anything you can do but make the best of it. I think that the flight attendants realized this as well and didn't hassle me about standing there for the whole flight.

Now, most people wouldn't consider standing for 4 hours and giving up a seat they paid for to accomodate a person who is obviously occupying more space than normal. It is in these siutations where as Ccowden and still boy have mentioned that people that are overweight are expecting those around them(society) to accomodate them at the expense of someone elses comfort. Personally, I don't care how overweight you are or why, but if your size takes up more than your seat allows, then buy 2 seats, don't expect some unwitting person/society to accomodate you at their expense. I think that is more what this entire thread is about than simple finger pointing at obese people.

As for people staring at others in the gym, I think most people are thinking to themselves that at least that person is doing something about their situation and not giving in to it. Genetics and medications aside, I think a vast majority of the overweight people in our society have a choice and unfortunately, many choose to do nothing about it. To those who choose to do something about it and fight that uphill battle, my hat is off to you as I know it isn't easy.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[Jumpah 0]

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There's a very large woman who goes to my gym. She gets up on the elliptical machine and huffs and puffs along with the fitter people next to her for 40 minutes.

It's all I can do not to go up and high-five her. It takes a lot of courage to get out there when you're not already in half-way decent shape.

Tell her what you think...at least give her encouragement. She might be wondering why the hell she's doing it...

This guy is an inspiration relative to weightloss and achiving goals: http://www.waswayfat.com/

[windcatcher 0]

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I didn't want my mom to have a poor quality of life or die early because of something she can change. I got on her case sometimes and stated my opinions and she sometimes would get mad and say i wasn't accepting her for who she was. And she was right. I wasn't going to accept it. But it wasn't because of who she was. it was because of how she was hurting herself, and I couldn't just stand by and watch her do it.

Excellent point Chris! . She tells me that I am skinny, because I was born that way ( which I always did have a fast metabolism growing up.) She brings lots of junk food to eat for lunch, and she doesn't like when I point it out to her that she's not eating healthy. It frustrates me when she thinks that I am skinny, simply because this is the way I was born. Nope! I am at a healthy weight because I sweat at the gym and eat lots of fresh produce every day, and stay away from fast food and junk food.
Unfortunately, she doesn't admit that her eating habits are very unhealthy and she makes excuses as to why she can't workout. I have seen numerous health issues surface, which I would have no problem attributing them to her being overweight.


It's really sad to me, because I don't want to appear to be judging her, but I want to help her. People who eat right and exercise have more energy, sleep better, feel better about themselves, and look better. Why would I want ANYONE, especially my loved ones, to have to live life without all those benefits? I don't.

I am on a quest to try and help my family and friends take better care of themselves. As far those who are obese ( which if I'm not mistaken are those 30 pounds or more overweight), it is never too late to start changing.

Mother to the cutest little thing in the world...

[stallboy 0]

My Dad used to get annoyed with everyone banging on about his smoking. One day I took him for a cup of tea at a Cafe and had a long chat to him about it. I told him that if he died from smoking and I had not done everything I possibly could to help him quit, then I would feel guilty for the rest of my life. He thought for a few moments sipped his tea and asked if those nicotine patches were any good...

Anyway practical advice.
Cook a nice healthy meal for her
Go for a walk together

One day, I'm gonna grow wings, a chemical reaction, hysterical and useless...

[ACMESkydiver 0]

If anyone ever had a doubt that it is a fight, you've laid that to rest.

It can be as tough an addiction as smoking. Or alcohol. Or drugs.


40 days without sugar was harder on my body and mind than any other 'addiction' I have conquered.

I had a bunch more on this post, but I changed my mind about posting it. This is a public forum and my private struggles don't need to be scrutinized by the masses just to lend credibility. I will leave this with 'I know from whence I speak'.

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[bmcd308 0]

>>The "Big and Tall" section is larger than the regular section. <<

That department never has anything for tall people, which pizzes me off, since I am tall. Every big and tall men's store that I go into assumes that because I am there I must need size 50-30 pants and a XXXXL Hawaiian shirt. When I tell them I need 34-36 pants, they look at me like I am an idiot.

Brent

----------------------------------
www.jumpelvis.com

[lawrocket 3]

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40 days without sugar was harder on my body and mind than any other 'addiction' I have conquered.

I think this explains why weight loss is so hard. Why go for that long without sugar? It's hard. It's tough. It's miserable. And it makes the thought of _healthier_ living intolerable.

I'm more than 30 days into "No Alcohol April." I started on March 22. It hasn't been easy, but it's not something that has been a part of my existence, considering that I did not drink every day, and I did not have more than 2 beers when I did drink.

In making a lifestyle change, any sustainable change should be gradual. Instead of cutting out all sugar intake (which will not be a permanent part of your life) why not try cutting it by an average of 25 percent for a couple of weeks. Then cut it another 25 percent.

Sure, the results you see are not as immediate. But it's more sustainable, less stressful (so long as you can expect to see changes in two months instead of two days) and your sugar lust will become a mere enjoyment of sugar.

Look at it this way - go from homogenized milk to 2 percent. Do it slowly - mix them at first. Then get yourself on 2 percent. Whole milk won't be as palateable any more - it'll be too rich.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Lindsey 0]

As for compassion.... do you want fries with that?

As far as your compassion. Who cares how you feel. It's wrong to treat people badly. It's wrong to be mean. If you don't think so, then I'd personally rather be acquainted with the fat chick.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[stallboy 0]

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Who cares how you feel.

That's a bit harsh.

For the record I too think its wrong to be mean, as I also think its wrong to selfishly eat oneself into an early grave without a thought to family that's left behind.

If my flippant one-liner distracted you from that message, then I apologize.

One day, I'm gonna grow wings, a chemical reaction, hysterical and useless...

[NWFlyer 2]

Chris, I appreciate you sharing the experience with your mother. Gives me a bit more perspective on where you're coming from on this issue. Don't kid yourself that hatred isn't out there, because trust me, at various weights throughout my life, I've been the target of some very hateful and hurtful behavior... just because of how I looked. I've been pleasantly surprised by the turn of this discussion today... it's stayed away from the worst of the "ewww, gross, fat people" mentality that often permeates this site, and there's been some truly thoughtful debate. Rare.

I don't know what to tell you, or anyone else, who is trying to figure out how to help someone who is really, really struggling with their weight. Reminders of it don't really help. I assure you they're well aware of their weight.

People can get into very very deep denial about the depth of their problems. It's a coping mechanism, it's a way to get through the day, it's a way to numb some of the pain. You look for an excuse, any excuse for the rest of your health problems, anything besides your struggle with food.

As with anything, the desire to change, and the COURAGE to change has to come from within. I wasn't ready to make lasting change until I was ready. Nothing (and I mean nothing) anyone could have said to me would have made a difference. It came from within, and it was sustained from within. Once I started making change, I had an amazing support crew, but until then, I didn't want to hear it.

[Shotgun 1]

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When you see a friend who is doing drugs and killing themselves with the problem, you don't pat them on the back and say it's ok. You do everything in your power to help them. Being compassionate and being enabling are two entirely different things.

Very true, Chris. I commend you for your efforts in helping your mom.

Man, as humans we face a lot of problems... Compassion is certainly something that we need to have... but as you pointed out, sternness may also be a blessing...

[ACMESkydiver 0]

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40 days without sugar was harder on my body and mind than any other 'addiction' I have conquered.

I think this explains why weight loss is so hard. Why go for that long without sugar? It's hard. It's tough. It's miserable. And it makes the thought of _healthier_ living intolerable.

Absolutely, I agree. If I was attempting a true diet program which I could stick to and see continued progress, I would take a more realistic approach, which thankfully, I am doing now!
-But the point of the no sugar was not actually weight loss. The whole point was to be deprived and feel it. It was a spirtual demonstration of commitment, not an actual health regimen, and it felt good to do. I don't intend on doing that in particular again until next spring though.

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[MarkM 0]

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There is a lot of "blah blah" about this debate, on both sides. The truth is that this is (in virtually every case) a self inflicted condition.

I can't help but think that the environment doesn't play a role though. Otherwise, why is this more so a problem in America than in other countries?