Gee... I wonder if obesity is becoming a problem.

[karenmeal 0]

No.. I read what you were saying.

Edited to add: I just read fast.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[Amazon 7]

IT was an attempt... to put a little bit of perspective into the decision to judge people based upon size.. and I have seen it thruout the thread. (AND an ongoing theme that perhaps you might not see unless you are aware of that prejudice)

AS people age.. it aint so easy to get rid of weight....

As people face health issues where they may not be able to exercise as easily as they did when they were 20 years old it makes it far harder to burn off anything extra...

Portion control works great if your metabolism has not slowed down......

Young guys are usually the greatest offenders at judging people based on looks.

My 30 year reunion was interesting... some of the biggest assholes.... in HS.... were not lookin so good now. I wonder if they are as quick to judge others now.

[ccowden 0]

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No.. I read what you were saying.

Edited to add: I just read fast.

Well then, if you don't know me and you didn't take the time to read all my posts and understand my views, then why call me an asshole.

If you DID take te time to read my posts, you would know that I APPLAUD the people who truly are struggling with obesity and trying to do something about it. I AM compassionate to the people who have health issues or genetics that contribute. I have personally fought being obese and had fallen into a very unhealthy lifestyle earlier in life. I have gone through the struggle with my mom and stood by her side and supported and helped her through her struggle with obesity.

There ARE plenty of obese people in this country who have said "Fuck it." There ARE plenty of obese people who don't care and don't want to change, who also have the attitude that society needs to adapt to them and accommodate them. It is those people whom I am talking about and whom I have the problem with. Obesity is a problem in America, and we ALL need to get ahold of it. It just continues to get worse. And THAT is not arguable.

[stallboy 0]

Ah, ok Chris, here we see the real problem, some don't like to think there are people that actually don't try. Everything is really ok, we're all doing as much as we can to solve the obesity problem. Lets stick our head in the sand, and simply sweep away valid points with accusations of being an asshole or mean or whatever.

Shall we reconvene the discussion when the country reaches 70%, 80% or 90% obesity levels?

One day, I'm gonna grow wings, a chemical reaction, hysterical and useless...

[wmw999 2,130]

The other thing is that people do have different priorities. Most of us in the US have it very easy. We're used to it. The lights work when you turn them on; the water works when you turn it on; your car works when you start it up (well, usually); if you get sick you can get fixed most of the time with medicine or a shot; etc. We've built whole areas that require cars to get around, so that walking is what you do from the parking lot into the store.

Food is just there. The crap food is easier to access, easier to prepare (just unwrap) and easier to eat than the good food. Why is it surprising that people with real lives will eat the easy crap food most of the time?

A lot of us do. But many of us are still in phases of our lives where it's easy to make time to exercise, or we're doing physical jobs.

I work a 40-hour week. When my son was younger, it was harder to take time to exercise. Because the choice was between "me" time (which exercise is not for me -- reading is) and exercise, or sleep and exercise, etc. I'm aware enough of nutrition stuff, and lucky enough in my choice of parents, that I didn't eat out of control. But I was heavier and in much worse shape than I am now.

I'm appalled at the average size of Americans. As a group. As individuals, it's easier to work with them than to call them lazy fat porkers, or just talk about how easy it is to lose weight. Yes, it costs me more. So does smoking, and people who skydive without insurance.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[karenmeal 0]

You seem to think that there are plenty of fat people who don't care that they are fat.. I completely disagree. I don't know a single person who is obese who is content with staying the way they are. If that were the case, why would the diet industry be so large? Why would almost every other commercial on TV be directed towards people trying to lose weight?

Perhaps you misinterpret a hopeless and depressed attitude as someone saying, "Fuck it" and not caring. I think there is a big difference.

My point is, no obese person is happy with their weight. It is just a really hard thing to change. The solution sounds easy, but go find someone who has smoked their whole life and go berate them for not quitting smoking, I mean, how hard is it to not smoke? Just don't do it, right? What is so hard about that?

I don't think that intolerance is ever a solution. I think that one place to start to cure our country's problem with obesity is education. Why do highschools make kids take calculus and physics, but not a nutrition class? What is more important to learn about than how to properly take care of your body? I think that misinformation about human anatomy and physiology is a big problem in our country (and probably the whole world). It leads people who are obese down the wrong paths for weightloss. If more people understood the basics about metabolism and how the body processes foods, what nutrients we need and why, then I think that would be a great place to start for helping people to lose weight.

Right now, people are misinformed and waste a lot of time and energy pursuing things that are destined to fail. That sets them up to have a hopeless attitude and to feel that they will never be able to obtain a healthy (and happy) weight. If instead these people understood basic body chemistry then they may try things that actually make scientific sense and find that their success rate is higher. It still wouldn't be easy considering the lifestyle changes that must accompany any successful weight loss, but it would be a hell of a lot better than what is currently happening.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[karenmeal 0]

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Shall we reconvene the discussion when the country reaches 70%, 80% or 90% obesity levels?

No. Read my post. I discuss a solution. What do you do to help? Nothing.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[ccowden 0]

Guess I am just an asshole then.

[Amazon 7]

Gee was that a self PA???

[McDuck 0]

Not to stir any burbling pots here, but I'm intrigued by how the cogent points that Chris and Mike are making are being turned into age/gender/weight-based hatred. Skimming posts is not the way to approach this particular topic.

I agree with Chris and Mike and their observations regarding the lackadasical obese. The original vein of this thread was pointing out that, while there ARE people who berate themselves each and every day over their obesity, there are at least as many people who expect to be catered to in their corpulent state because that's the America they're used to: "deal with me regardless of how it inconveniences you".

I find a mentality that caters to an unhealthy lifestyle because it might hurt someone's feelings to indicate in any way that they have something to correct about their health to be far more careless than one that forces people to look and see that change is necessary for continued existence without special caveats.

Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28
"I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC
Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

[wmw999 2,130]

I have a feeling that many of the "deal with as I am" people also berate themselves in private.

When you're having a bad day do you tell everyone about it, or do you just deal and move on, trying to be just like everyone else?

I'm sure there are fat assholes. I'm sure there are skinny ones, just as there are beautiful and ugly ones. There are handicapped assholes with chips on their shoulders.

But each person should be approached as an individual, with no assumptions that they are just like you, that their good days look like yours, or that they're smug just because they're riding on a cart in the grocery store.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Amazon 7]

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"deal with me regardless of how it inconveniences you".

And how does someone being overweight inconvienence you.. other than cluttering up an other wise "perfect" world??

[ccowden 0]

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If that were the case, why would the diet industry be so large? Why would almost every other commercial on TV be directed towards people trying to lose weight?

Yet, at the same time, the market for larger clothes, shoes, furniture, caskets, wheelchairs, hospital beds, toilets, doorways, bathtubs, stretchers, etc, gets larger and larger as well, at an alarming rate. Did you read ANY of my post?

And while those diet companies get rich off the obese, the companies and businesses who offer larger food portions, bigger drinks, more fast food places, drive thru everythings, endless choices of candy bars, tons of junk food, get rich right along with them.

It's not about helping the obese for these diet companies, it's about making money off them without really helping them with their struggle.

[karenmeal 0]

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I find a mentality that caters to an unhealthy lifestyle because it might hurt someone's feelings to indicate in any way that they have something to correct about their health to be far more careless than one that forces people to look and see that change is necessary for continued existence without special caveats.

I don't cater to people with an obese lifestyle. But I don't criticize them either. I know that my obese friends dislike their weight. Instead of pointing out to them that they are fat and really should just lose some weight or something, I try to be helpful when they bring up their weight with me. I have some background in nutrition and science and usually feel qualified to give people advice about a particular weight loss program.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[skymama 35]

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Why do highschools make kids take calculus and physics, but not a nutrition class? What is more important to learn about than how to properly take care of your body? I think that misinformation about human anatomy and physiology is a big problem in our country (and probably the whole world).

Actually, schools are starting to do something about it, at least in FL. A class called "Life Management" is one of the graduation requirements. They learn about nutrition, exercise and the food pyramid in that class among other things. I've also been reading about schools taking out the soda machines (it's about damn time) and changing the lunch offernings to have more healthy selections. It isn't much, of course, but it's a start. The only bad part is they still only need 1 year of PE to graduate. It's the only exercise that some of the kids get.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[Lindsey 0]

I find a mentality that caters to an unhealthy lifestyle because it might hurt someone's feelings to indicate in any way that they have something to correct about their health to be far more careless than one that forces people to look and see that change is necessary for continued existence without special caveats.

I think a mentality that supports people in their attempts to live a healthier life and that gives people a break for their shortcomings is more productive. I'm sure that there are people who have struggled with obesity and the attitudes of others who do eventually say, "Fuck it.....deal with it and with me as I am." When faced with people who are so unforgiving, demeaning, and often just downright vicious, a person would have to find SOME way to cope and salvage some self-esteem.

As far as forcing people to look and see that change is necessary..... Do you really think that anyone needs to force obese people to recognize that they're fat???? I promise you, you're not enlightening them in any way by being hateful.

I think that self-hatred is part of what perpetuates obesity for many, many people. Feeling the anger and hatred from skinny and fit people only makes the problem worse. If a person has done no more than expect to be dealt with as they are, then they really don't deserve the degree of hatred that people spew out at them.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[McDuck 0]

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I have a feeling that many of the "deal with as I am" people also berate themselves in private.

I would imagine they do. That wasn't my point. My point was that if you have "deal" mentality in a physical state that requires others to modify interaction parameters to cater to your unhealthy lifestyle, you're expecting people to assist you in remaining at least as unhealthy as you currently are.

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When you're having a bad day do you tell everyone about it, or do you just deal and move on, trying to be just like everyone else?

When I'm having a bad day, I'm not expecting society to make changes to accomodate me.

Quote

I'm sure there are fat assholes. I'm sure there are skinny ones, just as there are beautiful and ugly ones. There are handicapped assholes with chips on their shoulders. [/reply

Again, skinny/beautiful/ugly people aren't asking society as a whole to make modifications to accommodate them, as Chris indicated with his initial post is happening with the rising levels of obesity in America.

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But each person should be approached as an individual, with no assumptions that they are just like you, that their good days look like yours, or that they're smug just because they're riding on a cart in the grocery store.
Wendy W.

Again, off the original point. Accepting someone at face value, and accommodating them in an unhealthy, dangerous lifestyle are completely different animals.

Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28
"I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC
Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

• Quote

[karenmeal 0]

Diet companies generally propogate misinformation. If we took away all of the diet companies that were based an faulty science and only left the diet companies that offered healthful and realistic solutions, we would see many more people who have success with losing weight. But with so many companies who feed off our societies ignorance of basic nutrition, people waste their time and effort on weight loss "solutions" that will never work. This sets them up with a hopeless attitude that cripples them.

How about some nutrition education so that people can be more educated consumers and not waste their time and money on various routes that are destined to lead them to failure?

This won't cure everything, obviously we have a culture that propogates obesity but it could be one big step.

Other big steps would be to have restaurants serve meals that are designed for one person.


And.. Yes I read your posts. I just disagree with your mentality that there are lots of obese people out there who are fine with their weight. That did seem to be the core message in a lot of your posts.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[McDuck 0]

Quote

Quote

"deal with me regardless of how it inconveniences you".

And how does someone being overweight inconvienence you.. other than cluttering up an other wise "perfect" world??

This was all in the context of Chris' original post, which examined the changes that are being made in various industries to accommodate the rising levels of obesity.

Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28
"I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC
Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

[Amazon 7]

OK I am off to the DZ to throw my fat ass from the plane.

[Shotgun 1]

This is not directed at anyone in particular... But I see the obesity problem in our country as part of the problem that we have with addictions in general. I don't think that it has much to do with lack of education on how to eat right and exercise to stay healthy. We have a pretty big problem in this country with psychological illness, especially depression, that causes people to partake in other bad habits (I am all too familiar with this myself). I don't really know what the answer is, but it's something that I think about a lot... We need a lot more research on depression and addiction, and on how our brains work in general... Also, I think that children's mental health should be checked regularly in school, the same way that they get their eyes checked and such. Most mental problems would be significantly easier to treat if caught at a younger age... But again, we really need more research because we don't have very good treatment options at the moment.

[ccowden 0]

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When faced with people who are so unforgiving, demeaning, and often just downright vicious

I am NONE of these things. It is some of the people on here who have made me into those things, as well as being called other names and personally attacked. It is funny how the discussion is brought up and the opinions are voiced, and it always gets turned into this. I have been attacked and judged, been called an "asshole", and made to look "vicious, demeaning and begrading." All by the same people who criticize ME for judging others.

I have done nothing but bring the topic up for discussion and said it is a problem. I have never said I hate fat people or been how it is being portrayed. In fact, I have been the opposite. Just because I feel that there is a problem where some feel there is not and may have a different opinion about where that problem lies and how to fix it, does that really give you the right to attack me? I am not attacking "fat people" or being hateful in ANY way. I am simply attacking the problem, much like I would attack the problem of drugs in America.

This is a joke! You people want solutions, yet you just want to attack the people who have different views on the problem.

[karenmeal 0]

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I have done nothing but bring the topic up for discussion and said it is a problem. I have never said I hate fat people or been how it is being portrayed. In fact, I have been the opposite. Just because I feel that there is a problem where some feel there is not and may have a different opinion about where that problem lies and how to fix it, does that really give you the right to attack me? I am not attacking "fat people" or being hateful in ANY way. I am simply attacking the problem, much like I would attack the problem of drugs in America.

I don't think that anyone argued that there was not a problem. Maybe you should go back and re-read every post. So you have a different opinion about where the problem lies and how to fix it? Why don't you share? I don't think that you have.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[NWFlyer 2]

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When I'm having a bad day, I'm not expecting society to make changes to accomodate me.

You're confusing businesses that see a market opportunity with "societal" change. The companies making larger clothes, caskets, hospital beds, furniture, booths in restaurants are seeing an underserved market niche and filling it. That's just smart business. "Society" still hates them, but the businesses don't because they're making more money.

I had no expectations of society "making changes to accomodate me" when I was obese. To the contrary, I would just avoid (where possible) situations where I didn't "fit" into society. That meant flying as little as possible, and when I did have to fly, getting upgraded if I had enough miles/status to do so, working with gate agents to try to get an empty middle seat next to me. It meant avoiding restaurants that only had tight booths as a seating option. It meant if I was invited over to a person's house, carefully scouting out the chairs to pick the one that looked the most sturdy. It meant that when I needed to go to the doctor I'd deal not only with the indignity of gowns, but I'd deal with one that didn't fit, if I had to.

But that's just one person's view. I've never expected much out of society, though... I've always been all about personal responsibility. I know not everyone shares my values. That, I think, is the bigger issue in our society.

[ccowden 0]

IT'S ATTITUDE!!!!!!!!!

I don't know how much clearer I can be.

It is America catering to the problem.

It is accepting it as not a problem.

It is not practicing self-control.

It is what we are being taught.

It is what is made available to us.

To change this problem, we all need to put our foot down and stop what is happening. Everywhere you turn, it is becoming easier and easier to lead an unhealthy lifestyle and easier and easier to be obese and fit in. We have to stop that. We are accepting it, not fighting it, contrary to what people want to believe. It starts with yourself. We all have to change this. Fuck the diets, it is personal choices that cause this, and America doing everything we can to make sure it doesn't go away.