Safety star Reserve as water rig reserve

[rowland2747 0]

i am looking at building a water rig to jump. I have a reserve that is called a safety star built by Para-flight-inc I was wondering if anyone could tell me anything about it? It does not show what size it is or anything like that. It looks brand new with zero rises on it. Where they any good and anything else you could tell me would be helpful.

[skez 0]

Is it 5cell?

FTMC

[rowland2747 0]

YEs it is a 5 cell reserve canopy.

[pchapman 262]

Some old timer will know. This is what I've figured out as someone not all that familiar with that time:

Safety Flyer was the first square reserve, c. 1978. 160 ft sq someone said, but also seen 152 listed in Paragear as the PIA number which could differ from the manufacturer's. Doesn't have a standard brake system.

Safety Star came next. Paragear said 180 ft sq. as the manufacturer's number.

Swift was the next one from Para Gear, at least for the similar size range. 177 ft sq and a new airfoil. Weird brake system on it. Fine to use but pay attention to manual to pack.

So what was the brake system on the Safety Star??

I think the 'Star didn't had actual F-111 yet. Riggerrob once wrote of tearing one on a pull test at a low value.

Make sure the canopy is well pull tested. And if you have to land it, the water might be nice. Safety Flyer landings sucked, everyone said. The 'Star should be a bit better, but still it is a small, squarish 5 cell from the early days of skydiving....

Again, I don't have personal experience with anything before Swifts.

Hey, I found Andrew Hilton posted Safety Star specs on flickr, since he does a lot of vintage gear stuff:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43867826@N07/4096369568

[councilman24 36]

Doesn't matter if it's a water jump your reserve is the last chance to live. In addition in the event of a reserve ride you either may not be able to make the water or not WANT to make the water. If you wouldn't put it in your every day rig should it be in any rig? That being said none of us want to screw up a new Speed or Optimum. I would choose many other reserves before I chose a Safety Star. A Raven, Swift Plus, Tempo, PD. I've seen lots of crap jumped for water jumps (and landed on land) but there are too many Ravens etc around to get too antique.

BTW always be prepared to land on land off DZ. Means good gear AND FOOTWEAR.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[accumack 13]

The Safety Star was about 180sqft low aspect ratio. The ribs were made from a heavier fabric. The top and bottom from a Para-Flite proprietary 30/30 fabric that was actually a good bit stronger than F-111 until the vendor decided to reduce the thread count unannounced and it was then about the same strength as F-111. The ribs had rectangular reinforcing patches with 4 rows of stitching on the rib at line attachment points and on the tail. Same Lissamin 7808 Airfoil as the Swift.

[RiggerLee 61]

I will say this. I also saw one tear like tissue paper. Not saying that you shouldn't jump it, but you should test the fabric.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[skez 0]

If your looking for a cheap reserve get a raven u can always get them for cheap in very good condition i got one for $75 once that looked brand new... but usually there about $150-300

and what is the dom of the safety star I've always wanted to fly a 5cell for some reason

FTMC

[rowland2747 0]

The one I have taken out of the reserve free bag was made in 1981. I had a rigger pull test it and it was fine. From what I have found different years and lots were bad and some where good.

[rowland2747 0]

Lol you should have went to the FJC that I went to I flew a few 5 cells. There fun until you land its a little hard. Lol maybe my fault or just the canopy with a few thousand jumps on it.

[skez 0]

I should have a swift 5cell soon hopefully and yeh from what i hear they suck to land

FTMC

[JerryBaumchen 1,062]

Hi skez,

Quote

I should have a swift 5cell soon hopefully and yeh from what i hear they suck to land

Not in my opinion; and I've landed one in emergency conditions. I weighed about 170 nekkid at the time.

Now a SafetyFlyer, well that is a whole other story.

It is my understanding that a 5-cell Swift is almost an identical platform as the later 7-cell Swift canopy.

Jerry Baumchen

[gowlerk 1,923]

Quote

It is my understanding that a 5-cell Swift is almost an identical platform as the later 7-cell Swift canopy.

I've got a couple landings under each. At naked weights ranging from 175 to 190. All were ok, but of course you have to know how to flare them. The Swift plus has a somewhat more effective easier to execute flare. Probably because it's brake lines aren't arranged to be near impossible to stall like the original Swift.

I don't know anything about the Safety Flyer. But if I were advising the OP I would say you could jump with it if your rigger says it's airworthy. But I wouldn't myself, unless I was willing to land it on land. Like Terry said, there are much better choices available cheap. (although maybe not as cheap as the one you already have in hand) Good luck, have fun.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[wmw999 2,146]

I jumped a round for an additional couple hundred jumps because (at about 140 lbs) I wasn't willing to jump a Strato-Flyer. The Safety Flyer is based on it. Thumping landings. I wouldn't jump it unless it were over the middle of the ocean, and then I'd worry about landing on the boat

But then I was never very gifted canopy-wise either
Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rowland2747 0]

Yeah Idk what I will do, my rigger said it was in good shape and safe to jump. I have 3 of them and they cost me $40 for all 3. One of our local DZ's closed down and he was selling them cheap, they where in the student gear.

[RiggerLee 61]

His student gear?

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[councilman24 36]

He sold them for car cover prices because that what they are. Along with age the design is just not one you want to jump. When it was the only game in town they were okay. But lots of folks kept there round reserves, including me, until the Swift came out. Transverse construction of the swift, top and bottom skin panels went side to side so cell width wasn't limited to the width of the fabric, along with the Cirrus Cloud main I had at the time (and still have in a bag) allowed higher aspect ratios with five cells. We quickly learned more cells were better for airfoil performance.

While I'm sure your rigger may pack it, and it MAY be as airworthy as new (but may not), a some point there is design obsolescence, as well as the uncertainty that comes with age. No one can test the thread to see if it has weakened. Or the lines. Or the tapes. There comes a time when I don't want it on my back or anybody elses and won't put my name on it. Your rigger may vary. I have several 24' T-10 reserves that are much newer, including New Old Stock but I still wouldn't put anybody heavier than 100lbs under one and only if a diaper was installed. Too many better options.

Again, this is your last chance to live! How cheap is your life? Will you get away with it? Probably. Good luck.

Not to mention the thing is about the volume of a Raven III, more likely IV.

Sometimes I wish I was still young and foolish.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[rowland2747 0]

Yes in the DZO's student gear. I jumped the main that I plan on using in this water rig a few times it is a pretty decent main just huge.

[pms07 3]

rowland2747

Yeah Idk what I will do, my rigger said it was in good shape and safe to jump. I have 3 of them and they cost me $40 for all 3. One of our local DZ's closed down and he was selling them cheap, they where in the student gear.

I'm well familiar with this reserve, having reserve rides with one on several occasions in late 70s/early 80s, probably a dozen jumps on one setup as a main, and also have many jumps on the main it was based on (Strato Star).

Am I the only one amazed that someone put a Safety Star in student gear?

[gowlerk 1,923]

Quote

Am I the only one amazed that someone put a Safety Star in student gear?

Yes and no. Yes for the obvious reason, no, because I've been to that DZ. Nice guy but......

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[councilman24 36]

No, your not the only one. But I've seen worse. Like home made, non-tso'd harnesses for students.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[riggerrob 558]

I would not waste money on that Safety Star reserve.
And I have hundreds of jumps on a Strato-Star main.

The first problem is finding the manual.

The second problem is finding a rigger who remembers how to pack the Strato-Star's funky brakes. I vaguely remember that there were two different ways to set Safety-Star brake toggles.
Swift reserve brake toggles are simple in comparison.

Fabric strength is questionable.

Some riggers refuse to repack reserves older than them.
Hint: Safety-Star production finished in 1981 when the 5-cell Swift reserve was introduced (33 years ago). The 5-cell Swift was the first decent square reserve.

Bottom line: Para-Flite's 5-cell, square, reserve canopies were the best on the market, but that was 30 or 35 years ago. Much better reserve canopies have been built since.

I would never wear a reserve that I was not willing to land on terra firma.

[Skydivesg 6]

riggerrob

I would never wear a reserve that I was not willing to land on terra firma.

I not only want my reserve to "save my life" - I want it to "save my lifestyle"

Be the canopy pilot you want that other guy to be.

[jimjumper 25]

But the video would be so awesome!

[riggerrob 558]

Skydivesg

***

I would never wear a reserve that I was not willing to land on terra firma.

I not only want my reserve to "save my life" - I want it to "save my lifestyle"

..............................................................................

A "great deal" on an old reserve is only a "great deal" if it saves you more money than the cost of a broken ankle.

What does a broken ankle cost in the USA these days?