SkydiveMonkey 0 #1 June 1, 2002 I heard there was an accident at Hinton today, with a skydiver going through the wing of a glider. Anybody got more details?My condolences to the families and friends of all involved. Let's go play chicken with a planet !! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Milo 0 #2 June 2, 2002 The BBC story is: [link]http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_2020000/2020889.stm[/link]"Two people plunged to their deaths after a freak mid-air collision when a skydiver smashed through the wing of a glider. "BSBDmilo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jessica 0 #3 June 2, 2002 http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_2020000/2020889.stm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #4 June 2, 2002 If that's not a freak accident..."There's nothing new under the sun" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallRate 0 #5 June 2, 2002 This reminds me of a day at Richmond a couple of years ago. A glider pilot, apparently looking for some lift off our runways, flew straight through the jump run of an Otter load as people were deploying. The pilot made an immediate 180 degree turn after two or three canopies opened. Luckily no one was hurt. Our pilots always announce jumpers out, but apparently this idiot either wasn't listening or had his head up his ass. Do you suppose it would be a waste of reseources to use a Stinger missle on a Glider!? FallRate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #6 June 2, 2002 We have a glider outfit right next door to Elsinore as well... I remember about a month ago we descended past one that pretty close to our airspace at about 3500... It was a cool sight, but could've easily been more dangerous had we been just a little further out... So how do they coordinate that stuff anyway? Do the two airfields communicate as to when there is traffic and when there isn't? "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #7 June 2, 2002 An idiot private pilot had his head somewhere else over Perris yesterday as well! He first came over North to South, then turned and came over again West to East! By the time we were able to dial him in on frequency, he had canopies opening just a few hundred feet -over- him! Then the asshole said he wanted to do touch and goes on our runway! He was told a direct NO and was told to get the hell outta there. He did.One of the skydivers (who opened just 150 feet over the plane) was a videoflyer who got it all on tape! Scared the shit out of him, needless to say. He is a private pilot himself and turned, under canopy, to try and get the N number off the plane. Unfortunately the angle didn't afford him this pleasure.Now to find if there was a flight plan filed? How would you find an idiot like that, after the fact?ltdiver____________________________________________LightDiverCam Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Billy 0 #8 June 2, 2002 WTF is it with these guys,,had 2 over the DZ the other day and a "near miss" ...do they have a website I can vent my opinion on and maybe piss some of them off,, I have no problem with folks sharing the sky,, but if youre gonna be up there then ya better know who might drop in an take a wing off,, after our lil incident the pilot had an arrogant attitude like he couldn't check the freq of every lil airport he went over,, oh wait,, I'll do a search an see who does this in our area.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mccordia 73 #9 June 2, 2002 I heard this news over the radio yesterday while coming back from a DZ I was jumping (not my home DZ) and I was shocked.On the airport where I was jumping there is also a big glider (and other small aircaraft) operation. When coming down from my second jump, just after deployment, I looked down at the peas, and saw a glider pass directly over the landing area.After landing I heard the tow-cable had snapped, and the glider had to make a 360 at about 150 to 200 ft to make it back to the landing area. All the jumpers where still up at around 2000/2500 ft, but had this happened only half a minute later it could have gotten ugly.On my third jump, halfway trough jumprun the pilot suddenly yelled STOP because there whas a glider passing direcly below him (over the area where jumpers where coming down)Had the pilot not seen the aircraft, and jumprun would have continued there could also have a realy dangerous situation..The events I witnessed where definately errors on the glider-pilots hand (with them fying in area's where they shouldn't be flying) and the DZ nor the pilot did anything wrong (they both rule!) but it's something that could be really dangerous if it gets more out of hand one day..."We put the FUN in dysFUNctional"http://www.3dluvr.com/mccordia/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #10 June 3, 2002 If you are at a "non-towered" airport (as most DZs are) there is NO requirement for gliders to have radios on board and listen to any broadcast that the jump plane may have. That goes for all other General Aviation ops at non-towered airports. They don't have to listen or talk to anyone.Flying skydivers in the US is the ONLY VFR activity that is required by FARs to talk to ATC and be radar identified in controlled airspace. Everyone else is allowed to do whatever they want pretty much. Now, if an accident occurs then they might postumously be labelled as the culprit in the accident but what good does that do when your skydiving buddy is already dead?Think about it if you jump at a DZ with much other GA activity. Glider activity or not.Chris SchindlerATPD-19012www.DiverDriver.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallRate 0 #11 June 3, 2002 Ok, so with no requirements for the Glider pilots to monitor the local bands, would that mean that it is in fact OK to shoot them down in case of emergency? FallRate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IronMike 0 #12 June 3, 2002 I was one of the group at Perris that this guy flew through. My dumb ass, thinking I was in my Pitts, turned toward him to get his N number. By the time I figured out he was faster than me and turned back around, I was no way gonna make it back and landed off. He ALMOST hit that skinny RW guy with the cool Yellow Vette (can't remember his name for nothin). If you do get some a-holes N number that does something like this and he doesn't land so you can kick his (or her) ass, you can go here:http://www.landings.com/evird.acgi$pass*45945174!_h-www.landings.com/_landings/pages/search/search_nnr.htmland type in the N number. It will most assuredly be some school. Ask for the chief pilot and embellish the story if need be to make it sound really bad if it isnt. Then mention your cousin that works for the FAA and your other cousin that is Grand Dragon for the Hells Angels. The poor student will never do it again. If the chief pilot is a dick, call the FAA. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #13 June 3, 2002 I don't know about the US, but in the UK I'm pretty sure there is a 1.5 mile exclusion zone around dropzones in which only the jumpships are allowed to fly (BPA Ops Manual I think). Let's go play chicken with a planet !! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #14 June 3, 2002 No SHIT!!! I have video of a Cessna going over my head within about 10-15 seconds of opening. He came North to South so was on the opposite side of the plane when we got out. I never saw him until I was stowing my slider. He was a few seconds from getting a sun roof. Unfortunately he didn't land and since he was flying almost directly over me I couldn't get his numbers either. I just wanted him to land so I could proceed to beat his ass!!!! "Here I come to save the BOOBIES!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #15 June 3, 2002 The accident in Hinton is a sad thing... for both the skydiving community and the glider community, and for aviation sports as a whole. I don't know any details about this incident but I'd bet that it could have been avoided by either party with either better communication (on the air and/or in the ground) and/or better visual communication (heads on a swivel in the glider cockpit, in the jump plane prior to exit and in freefall).Instead of screaming about how other aviation sports participants are in the wrong, perhaps those of us who share airspace with them can do more to educate them about what we do and take some time ourselves to learn about what they do. If your dz shares the airspace with other air sports enthusiasts, maybe it's time to get in communication with them. Rather than asking who was wrong, perhaps the question should be how can we all avoid these types of situations in the future? The key to all of this, imho, is the phrase "share airspace." The airspace doesn't belong exclusively to any one group of air sports enthusiasts - skydivers, balloon pilots, glider pilots, ultralight pilots, student pilots in 152's, "country club" pilots in Mooney's, etc. It belongs to all of us and it's up to all of us to watch out for each other - and hard as it may be it's also up to all of us to support each other, even when we're in the right. If we don't, we could easily find our "right" to use certain airspaces revoked. My condolences to the friends and families of both victims of the accident in Hinton.pull & flare,lisa"Try not. Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda sez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #16 June 3, 2002 Here's the problem Lisa. We have a lot of general aviation in the area around my DZ. The biggest problem is pilots transiting the air space around the airport. I don't know what kind of idiot over flys an airport AT ANY ALTITUDE without at least being on the frequency. We give a 1 minute call and a jumpers away call. Of course people look for traffic before getting out but lets face it. It can be pretty hard to spot a Cessna at 2 or 3K when your at 14,000. In fact now that this subject has come up it's making me realize how many times I have been uncomfortable or even tracked away from an aircraft while in free fall. Whats the answer? Hell if I know....these guys should know how to find a frequency on a map and they should know to NOT overfly airports without being on the freq. It's a pretty big sky out there but I'll take deconfliction over luck any day. "Here I come to save the BOOBIES!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #17 June 3, 2002 Some DZ's are Grass strips with no tower or anything identifying them. Its the spotters job to be on the look out for aircraft in addition to the spot. Lots of VFR pilots out on a Sunday flight never check thier radios.... some don't even turn them on....If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny, consume you it will.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #18 June 3, 2002 Quote some don't even turn them on Which is FUBAR. You need to know what's going on around you. This is why shit like this happens Let's go play chicken with a planet !! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #19 June 3, 2002 Quotethese guys should know how to find a frequency on a map and they should know to NOT overfly airports without being on the freqContacting all of the flight schools in the area and educating their instructors about what happens at your dz would be a first step. Most airports have a pilot's group; contacting each of these groups and opening a line of communication might help to stop the overflights by licensed pilots. Get the word out to local GA that jumpers are open to communication with them. Education is the key. Make the effort.And while it may be hard to spot a Cessna at 2k from 14k, it's not impossible. I've done it and my eyesight isn't 20/20. imho, it's the responsibility of the person "spotting" to ensure that no aircraft that might interfere with the load are in the area - and to call for a go around if there are any that could possibly pass through the airspace during the jump. If the jump plane has GPS the "spotter" usually has plenty of time to do so before the green light comes on...pull & flare,lisa"Try not. Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda sez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #20 June 3, 2002 QuoteWhich is FUBARDefinately! The airspace here in Georgia is BUSY. We have Class B airspace at 15,000 right over the airport and at 8000 I think it is 1 mile north. We are only 40 miles south of Hartsfield International. One of the busiest airports in the world. Flying around above 1000 FT without radios is down right dangerous. I can see the guys in ultralights that fly at 500 Ft without radios but a Cessna at 3000-5000 over flying airports without any communications is just an accident waiting to happen. "Here I come to save the BOOBIES!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #21 June 3, 2002 QuoteSome DZ's are Grass strips with no tower or anything identifying themVery true and I could understand a little better if this were the case. However, the Thomaston/Upson County airport has a 5500 Ft paved runway, ILS approach lights on the East end, about 20 hangars, a taxiway, huge over run parking area, etc etc etc....."Here I come to save the BOOBIES!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Geoff 0 #22 June 4, 2002 Could someone please PM me the name of the deceased skydiver (or post here if it's public now)? I know a bunch of great people at Hinton.ThanksGeoff Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
