skydiverek 55 #51 January 22, 2003 Quote I will never pencil pack my reserve for one reason only, and that's my kids. Yes, I realize that it would probably be ok for my reserve to go past the repack cycle once in a while. But, I think it would be terrible if something happened to me because my reserve didn't work properly and someone had to say to my children, "Sorry kids, your mom decided that saving $40 was more important than her life. We could have caught the problem with her reserve if she would have gotten a repack." No way is that going to happen. Ok, but this argument brings the question "who is gonna check the checker"? The second packer can mess up, not only the first one (i.e. second packer can leave the molar strap in). Just logical reasoning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #52 January 22, 2003 I haven't been around this sport long enough to know whether or not I should even contemplate pencil packing. And ironocally my rig is at Hooknswoop's pad right now going through my very first (oops beer ... it's a good thing Derek isn't much of a liquor pig) reserve repack. I'm sure my rig would be fine right now without a repack (heck it's only got 106 jumps on it), but I'm still having Hook do his typical thorough inspection on it just for my own piece of mind. In the future, if I became a rigger (I really can't see that happening) then maybe I would pencil pack my own rig. But I'm happy to pay whatever it is it will cost me to know that someone who's supposed to know what they are doing say that my rig is airworthy and ready to rock. Just my two cents ... Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rgoper 0 #53 January 22, 2003 Quotemy rig is at Hooknswoop's pad right now at least it's at the right place! mine will be there in a couple of days.--Richard-- "We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazerq3 0 #54 January 22, 2003 Something else to think about, and please excuse me if I didnt catch it in an earlier post but what about Life Insurance. I you have ins that covers you in jumping, you die and then they investigate and find you pencil whipped your repack, thats all they need to void that policy!! Now youve not only hurt your family emotionally but finacially,, ( In most cases that is) jasonFreedom of speech includes volume Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #55 January 22, 2003 Geez you guys - I have to wait behind all of ya?Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freebird 0 #56 January 22, 2003 If one can afford to skydive then one can afford a re-pack by a trusted and good rigger. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1freak 0 #57 January 22, 2003 Yea, i have had times when a pencil job was needed... do i make a habit of it? No.... But, i'm not worried the times i have. i trust the rigger had done a good job...HAVE FUN... ...JUST DONT DIE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sarge 0 #58 January 23, 2003 Quote I was down in Eloy and needed a reserve repack Was that Goose? .-- I'm done with the personally meaningful and philosophical sigs!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazerq3 0 #59 January 23, 2003 Heres my thing though and please dont take this as aan attack on anyone... but for every one saying "I trust my rigger" yeah I trust my riiger to, but once the reserve is packed the riggers job is done!! what about all the movement that takes place when jumping , moving in the A/C, the pounding it takes when one PLF's, the movement while packing ( and I've seen some pretty rough packers,, my concern is that something could get loose or moved around or damaged.. I mean I'm not a rigger but please tell me ...Am I wrong in this thinking?.. Thats why I feel its important to keep up on the repack....but again these are just my feelings!! Its your skydive so make it a good one!!jason Freedom of speech includes volume Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1freak 0 #60 January 23, 2003 Personally i check things on the rig quite a bit. i mean if i were worried i would have it repacked right then...HAVE FUN... ...JUST DONT DIE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazerq3 0 #61 January 23, 2003 QuotePersonally i check things on the rig quite a bit. I do the same myself however you cant inspect whats under your reserve flap whenever you want for any kind of shifting or damage ..thats all I'm getting at...I'd like to here a riggers take on the movement issue though...is there concern there?? jasonFreedom of speech includes volume Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1freak 0 #62 January 23, 2003 It's funny, i was having this conversation with a rigger this weekend.... In his opinion "personal" modern sport gear could be moved to yearly repacks, but student gear he was solid an the 120 day cycle.... I tend to agree with that...HAVE FUN... ...JUST DONT DIE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fasterfaller 0 #63 January 23, 2003 I pack my reserve once a year and pencil it the rest of the time . Most riggers I know pencil their own rigs but never a customers rig . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ernokaikkonen 0 #64 January 23, 2003 Quote Ok, but this argument brings the question "who is gonna check the checker"? The second packer can mess up, not only the first one (i.e. second packer can leave the molar strap in). Just logical reasoning. Your logic is flawed, and therefore that's not an argument: Assume a 1% possibility of any rigger packing a reserve mal(it's too high, but for the example); Regardless of the repack cycle, at any given time, there is a 1% possibility that the last rigger has packed a reserve mal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #65 January 23, 2003 Quote >I will never pencil pack my reserve for one reason only, and that's my kids. Hmm. So if we go to a 6 month cycle will you still get it repacked every 4 months? Dont you thrust USPA FAI and so on?They make the standards,if they say 6 month instead of 4 month,then its becours they say its okay.. What about the rigger?He still have to live of this,do you think it then gets cheaper in repack?Nope..They now have to be more sure than ever,and that will cost you.. And it migth be a good idea to get gear chek by seccond hand,some times,rigth LollieAlways rember that riggers dont (only)do this for them self,they also try to make it safe as posible.Thanks for that and keep up the good work Stay safe Stefan Faber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1freak 0 #66 January 23, 2003 So, what kind of small wear probs? and did you repack the reserve the time before???? I mean I have NEVER had a problem found with my gear.....HAVE FUN... ...JUST DONT DIE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #67 January 23, 2003 Where I live it's a real pain in the rear to get a rigger to repack your reserve. I don't mind paying for a repack, but traveling a couple hundred miles to drop your rig off and then return a couple weeks later to pick it up is sometimes a real hassle. I'm not real proud of this, but I have put my seal (I still have a chest pack rating) on my back reserve and then put a ficticious name on it. I have only done this in a real pinch when it means the difference between jumping or not. I wouldn't feel right signing another riggers name to it. And I've always popped it a month or too later. I want to be safe, but I also don't want to miss out on any opportunities to jump. A month or two longer shouldn't affect things any. But I may also not get into heaven, for cheating. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #68 January 23, 2003 and the rigger says when he see your signature? Stay safe Stefan Faber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #69 January 23, 2003 I usually make up another name in another state. I guess I'm a real scum bag. And again I've only done this on my own rig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #70 January 23, 2003 30 days, 60 days, 120 days, 180 days, once year, when the airplane gets a 100 hour inspection, ... those are all educated guesses at when wear problems start to get dangerous. Unfortunately everybody's gear wears at a different rate. Heck! I believe it is unwise to let student or rental gear go beyond 100 days. The FAA/CSPA/BPA, etc. had to set a standard somewhere and most of them settled on 120 days. CSPA was forced by CAPS to shift to a 180 day repack cycle, but now that CAPS is defunct, does that mean that CSPA will revert to a 120 day repack cycle? Not likely, considering that it is a struggle convincing Canadian skydivers to get their gear inspected once a year! Remember folks, the inspection is the most important part of "inspect and repack." The number of days a reserve has been packed rarely changes the speed of inflation. As far as main inspections go ... When I inspect and repack a reserve, I check the main risers, d-bag and pilotchute for common wear points, then re-connect the main risers. If a customer wants a more thorough main inspection, he can pay me for an extra hour of my time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflycracker 0 #71 January 23, 2003 Ive enough things out there for Karma to kick my ass. Lying about my repack is just NOT one of those places I want bad Juju! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #72 January 24, 2003 I'm really shocked nobody has said anything about the wear and tear on your reserve during repack time. Using a canopy (other than UV or bad opening, ect) for the most part doesn't wear it out it's the packing that does. I love my rigger and she treats my reserve like her own baby. Repacks more than age will doom the reserve. what do you think? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #73 January 24, 2003 To get certified to pack back reserves I need to pack at least 20 reserves under another riggers supervision prior to going to a master rigger for a practical type exam where you repack another reserve. It would be nice to practice on an old beater of a reserve that is ready for the trash bin. I would imagine reserve repacks by an unskilled person are even tougher on fabric etc. I'd hate to wear out my new reserve just in practice. Have you ever watched an experienced rigger wrestle around with a reserve? Imagine how tough this is for a beginner. If they're only good for 40 repacks or so, this may not be good. Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #74 January 24, 2003 QuoteMost riggers I know pencil their own rigs but never a customers rig . I've been staying out of this thread since I got flamed bad in a previous thread on the same subject... but anyway. I have a rigger's ticket, and I've been known to pencil my rig. I don't repack it ever though; when I feel a repack is needed I pay someone who's work I trust to do that for me. I wouldn't pencil anyone else's pack job without that person's permission though, regardless of the fact that once I put my seal and signature on it anything that might be wrong with it is my problem. Before I had a Cypres in my rig I'd get it packed about once a year and pencil it the other two cycles. Now that there's a Cypres in there I'd rather it be opened and inspected at least every other repack cycle - Cypres batteries have been known to leak. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peckerhead 0 #75 January 24, 2003 I would never forge someones signature.... I just change the date Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
