9-11 Parachutes

[SpeedRacer 1]

I remember shortly after 9/11 there was a news story about this, where the inventor of the parachute had an assistant try to put one on. Right there on TV she attempted to put it on & couldn't figure out how to do it.

It was NOT good PR for the inventor.

Speed Racer
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[wildblue 4]

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Again, I think this is the same old "The general public can't be trusted--They're not as smart as us." attitude that has reared its ugly head throughout history. People who have never used a parachute before are not going to nonchalantly clip in and jump at the first sign of danger. But they might like to have the option if they run out of breathable air or can no longer stand the heat.

But again, the usefulness of it. I have never done a base jump, and I wouldn't want to attempt my first one out of a smoked-filled, panicked office with a round into a landing zone I've never seen with winds that I'm unfamiliar with past a burning building. It sounds great in theory - hey, just strap this on and jump out the window. In practice, I think I would rather climb to the roof and wait for rescue.

But I do also think there would be too many people jumping at the first sign of danger - and it really would only take one person getting themselves killed by jumping for no reason. Hell, the other day we had someone around here call 911 in Wal-Mart because they though the roof was collapsing (a water hose sprung a leak in the ceiling)

If I'm ever stuck near a window above the 20th floor of a burning office building that's about to collapse, my last thought will be "Dammit, Douva was right!"

it's like incest - you're substituting convenience for quality

[wildblue 4]

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If the rescue system we're talking about involved pushing a "rescue me" button, I'd agree. The guy involved would have no idea of the risk he was taking.

But just about every whuffo I've ever met has an extremely strong natural aversion to jumping off buildings.

Bill -

Don't you think the uncanny ability we have to rely too much on "Things that are supposed to save us" would cause people to look past that a little easier? We've all heard the stories of the student who did nothing because "... I knew I had that ADD thingy" (ok, so exaggerated argument, but you get the idea) Hey, I have safety gear, so I can do anything!

I do agree that it would probably never be legitimately used. Again, 9/11 being a special case.

it's like incest - you're substituting convenience for quality

[smiles 0]

In 2004 I was hired by canadian aerosports inc.
http://www.canadianaerosports.com
to do graphics for instructions re: use of emergency parachutes for high rises. Chris Stevens had filled a huge order (selling to company in china.) The instructions were all that was needed to attach to the back of rigs along with the warning symbol.......he wrote the instructions and explained how he wanted the pics drawn. My understanding they were placed in rooms on 8th floor and up, (they were tested with dummies not humans...)

one set drawings for static line, one set drawings for emergency handles.......then he required set for tandem system so small children could be harnessed...........?????????

examples of drawings i made attached....
hmmm....how to attach static line, how to don,
(nothing on how to break window open!) 22 ft. rounds without risers/steering, how to keep your knees together and elbows protecting head......
wwweeeee--------

SMiles

eustress. : a positive form of stress having a beneficial effect on health, motivation, performance, and emotional well-being.

[smiles 0]

never heard anything after-
re: he figured all it would take was to save 1 person and he was in business for sure..
think he is now more into building rounds for para sailing....

SMiles

eustress. : a positive form of stress having a beneficial effect on health, motivation, performance, and emotional well-being.

[jtval 0]

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(they were tested with dummies not humans...)

SMiles

So, did the dummies figure out how to wear these properly?

My photos

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[normiss 643]

did their eyes bleed like in the graphics???

[jtval 0]

I thought that they had to pull the red thing on their chest and ram it into their eyes. Maybe so they wouldn't see the ground?

I guess either way thier eyes would bleed.
Same product, different process.

My photos

My Videos

[smiles 0]

halarious!




SMiles

eustress. : a positive form of stress having a beneficial effect on health, motivation, performance, and emotional well-being.

[smiles 0]

you bet their eyes were bleeding just like the graphics!

none of us needed any training how to pull our handles in freefall- just needed a quick look at #7

SMiles

eustress. : a positive form of stress having a beneficial effect on health, motivation, performance, and emotional well-being.

[NickDG 23]

>>that even when faced with imminent death, a good fraction of them would choose death over jumping out a window, rig or not. Our primal instincts are too strong.<<

Bill, the fear of fire trumps the fear of falling. People have been leaping from burning buildings (to their deaths) to escape smoke and flame throughout history. It's the very reason some began experimenting with parachutes as early as the 14th century.

Leaving aside the use of a parachute, look at the Triangle fire of 1911.
http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/trianglefire

And the World Trade Center where it's estimated 200 jumped rather than burn up.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/sept11/2002-09-02-jumper_x.htm

There are hundreds and hundreds of people that have done this. When the choice is live another 5 seconds or burn alive right now, most will choose the five seconds.

When I wrote the Instruction Book for use of the Hope system the hardest part was coming up with an acceptable way to say, "Don't jump unless the flames are licking your ass." And the fact that most won't jump unless its life or death works in our favor.

I would, of course, rather see engineers come up with a completely fireproof building or a totally failsafe built in escape system, but that day is not here yet.

And someday, somewhere, someone will use a Hope or similar system and survive when staying would have killed them, and even if they break major bones that's fine with me . . .

NickD BASE 194

[kingbunky 3]

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of course, its silly to spend $1500 on something that you have about a .000001% chance of using.

...kinda like a cypres?

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[bch7773 0]

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of course, its silly to spend $1500 on something that you have about a .000001% chance of using.

...kinda like a cypres?

lol. thats kinda close.

although we spend only $1200 on something we have .0001% chance of using with a cypres. thats much better math

MB 3528, RB 1182

[billvon 2,473]

>Don't you think the uncanny ability we have to rely too much
> on "Things that are supposed to save us" would cause people to
>look past that a little easier?

Not when looking past it involves breaking a window and jumping out yourself. That's way too much stuff the guy has to do for himself. I mean, we get students who refuse to jump on occasion, and these people have paid to jump, want to jump, have taken hours of instruction on how to jump, and have practiced jumping out of an airplane designed for easy exits.

[NickDG 23]

>>we get students who refuse to jump on occasion, and these people have paid to jump, want to jump,<<

Liight a fire under their butts and see how fast they jump . . .

NickD BASE 194

[billvon 2,473]

>Bill, the fear of fire trumps the fear of falling. People have been
> leaping from burning buildings (to their deaths) to escape smoke
> and flame throughout history.

Right. But when you look at those accidents, far more people burn to death than jump. I strongly suspect that even with a potential aerial rescue system (a big net, a rig, a massive wind tunnel placed under them, whatever) a good fraction of them would still choose to remain in a burning building hoping for ground-based rescue.

As I mentioned before, look at the number of AFF or SL students who refuse to jump. And these are people who have already decided they are going to do it, not a 55 year old secretary who hates flying and heights and who hasn't left the ground in 20 years.

[mnealtx 0]

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did their eyes bleed like in the graphics???

Frickin LAZER BEAMS in their frickin HEADS!!!!!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[TomAiello 25]

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...a good fraction of them would still choose to remain in a burning building hoping for ground-based rescue.

Which, in 99% of incidents, would actually be the correct response.

I wonder why we don't drop firefighters via parachute onto the roofs of those buildings. Or heck, why not just bring in a helicopter to pull those people out?

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[funks 1]

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a good fraction of them would still choose to remain in a burning building hoping for ground-based rescue

Which, in 99% of incidents, would actually be the correct response

So now not only are skydivers the masters of their own universe but we are also masters of what peoples responses should be in the event of a burning building emergency.

Jesus Christ people. I wish I was as smart as you fucking brainiacs.