bigway 4 #26 November 21, 2007 But you can against someone who has bought their land with their hard earned money and who has probably been paying land rates and taxes all these years. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jewels 0 #27 November 21, 2007 Yep. So, the lesson is, protect your rights. Don't sit there and watch your neighbors use your land while you don't. Give them a LICENSE to use it, if you wish--because then it's use by permission. That doesn't lead to adverse possession. Tell them they CAN'T use it. Put up a fence, post no trespassing signs. Consult a lawyer to discuss what you need to do because those things may not be enough. They might be, but maybe you need to do something more as well, depending on the circumstances. As I said, it's a very fact-intensive area of the law. Or, talk to your legislators and do something to change the law. In any event, I think we've gotten distracted from the main post. Derek's post is obviously pointing at another possible reason that WFFC was canceled. The property dispute may have nothing to do with it.TPM Sister #102 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #28 November 21, 2007 Man, MY neighbours are free to use my land whenever they want. As long as they dont let the puppies out they can come and go as they please. I dont even know their names. People dont do stupid shit like that in most countries. I am willing to bet that you would be suprised to hear that you can not even 'sue' a person in New Zealand. Anyway as you say, it is hijacking a thread, but i guess whoever is in the thread the most owns it right? .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jewels 0 #29 November 21, 2007 LOL--Permission is a good thing. Just let them know they have your permission. Not a tough thing to do. Anyway, the point was just that someone wondered about the other side of the story. There are always two! TPM Sister #102 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcandalysse 0 #30 November 21, 2007 Quote Freakin colorado hippies I assume you are joking...I wouldn't call two lawyers with an expensive house a 'hippie'..... "The reason angels can fly is that they take themselves so lightly." --GK Chesterton Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcandalysse 0 #31 November 21, 2007 In Brasil if you have vacant land you need to have a housekeeper living in a small shack on the land or at least stopping by and doing cleanup a couple times a week....otherwise once a squatter starts living on it, not much chance of getting it back.... "The reason angels can fly is that they take themselves so lightly." --GK Chesterton Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davedlg 0 #32 November 21, 2007 Quote Quote Freakin colorado hippies I assume you are joking...I wouldn't call two lawyers with an expensive house a 'hippie'..... Well, that's the Boulder brand of hippie. Lots of money, big house, drives an SUV with a "Free Tibet" bumper sticker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cderham 0 #33 November 21, 2007 Quote I think Don should look into having parties on his vacant lot every weekend till this is resolved. I think the skydivers would come. Have a Party like this??? http://www.dailycamera.com/photos/galleries/2007/nov/18/kirlins-support-picnic/ Go Don!! Just where your Team FAF shirt when you go to mow!! .. Chris It's Jimmy Time!! http://www.facebook.com/pages/Team-Fast-As-Fuck/6099474213 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowwhite 0 #34 November 21, 2007 I am writing this to everyone who has been kind enough to support Don and Susie, but I am responding to BigWay, since he obviously OWNS this thread! Thank you everybody, and I am sending a link to this to Don, since I know he rarely has time to scour the forums, and may miss this thread. I know he will really appreciate all of your thoughts and good words.skydiveTaylorville.org [email protected] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2fat2fly 0 #35 November 21, 2007 Yeah, we may not know how to fix the problem but we are the people to ask how to get even I am not the man. But the man knows my name...and he's worried Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dougjumper 0 #36 November 21, 2007 QuoteIf they tried to take part of my land I would build a gun range and a wind tunnel on the rest of it. They would regret the day they fucked with me. That just all depends. You think you own your own land right. Think again. If the Govt wants it they can take it. Ever heard of Eminent Domain. Thats right you really don't own shit in this Country like you think you do. So try fighting the US Army for your land. Believe me they will get it. But in this scenario its a whole different legal battle with the Kirlins. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peek 20 #37 November 21, 2007 Thanks for pointing out that link. I just got off the phone with Don and he told me that a skydiver (whose name he did not catch) came to the picnic just to show his support because of what Don has done for skydivers at the Convention all these years. The skydiver recalled to Don the "biplane story". The owner of the N3N biplane, Bud Fuchs, had no insurance on the inverted biplane jumps and was getting nervous about flying it. So Don "bought it" from Bud by writing a check for the full value. Since I knew Bud because I was his parachute rigger, I held the check and the paperwork for both of them for the entire week, and at the end of the week Don got his check back. Damn, the things we did to make stuff happen at the Convention. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broke 0 #38 November 21, 2007 Is some judge and his lawyer wife about to be disbarred?Divot your source for all things Hillbilly. Anvil Brother 84 SCR 14192 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 34 #39 November 21, 2007 QuoteIs some judge and his lawyer wife about to be disbarred? I dunno, but that would be a step in the right direction."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #40 November 21, 2007 <> Actually no.... there are some shocking land grabs in Spain. Lots of folks loosing land over there. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jewels 0 #41 November 21, 2007 QuoteIs some judge and his lawyer wife about to be disbarred? Again, I don't know the factual details. There could be other factors at play that make their actions wrong, but just on the face of it, the judge and attorney neighbors were within their rights to bring that kind of suit. We don't have to like it OR like the outcome, but it doesn't sound like a frivolous suit in that there was apparently legal basis for it--enough so that they won. That doesn't mean they should be disbarred. It's like saying that the quarterback on an opposing football team should be banned from play because they ran a play that your team wasn't expecting but still worked well enough against you to win the Superbowl. You probably wouldn't like the outcome but it doesn't make the player in the wrong. You have to have defensive players helping out as well--and that includes practicing plays and learning what to expect before you get to the game.TPM Sister #102 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broke 0 #42 November 21, 2007 Well from what I remember about the adverse posesion law they shouldn't be able to grab that land, because they had permission to use the land from the owner. Until that is the poaint to where the owner overheard them planning to make the grab and tried to put a stop to it. Seeing as how the judge put a stop work order on a piece of property where someone is trying to sue for, "Quiet Tital." That is the unethical part of it. Also I know that adverse posession varies from state to state, but until you have the new title in your hands the real owner can say get out and you have to leave. For instance If I were to find an abandoned house, move in start paying th taxes on it without the owner realizing. Be obviouslly occupying the property, as well as improving it. If the owner comes up to the porch one day before I can gain the title I lose the property and all it's improvements that I have made.Divot your source for all things Hillbilly. Anvil Brother 84 SCR 14192 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jewels 0 #43 November 21, 2007 I don't know that I follow all of what you're saying, but again, I'm really not following this one in the courts or in the media so I'm not opining on the "permission" the neighbors may have had or not had with respect to the use of the property. They're still entitled to bring the case and have the court determine whether they satisfied the elements of their claim. A "quiet title" action is just an action to determine who owns the property, and they can do that. It doesn't guarantee that they will win their case, but neither does it mean that they should be disbarred for bringing a case they are allowed to bring. One of the great things about our legal system is that we're entitled to bring causes of action before the court to have matters like this legally resolved. On the whole, I think we treasure our rights and privileges in this country and part of having those rights means that others have them, too. Just because they choose to exercise them does not make them inherently unethical--even if there are good reasons that they might lose their case. Let's face it; if we all agreed about how cases should be resolved, there would be no need to go to court in the first place. Let's say, just for the sake of discussion, that this couple had permission to use the property but still thought they had a good claim for adverse possession so they asked the court to resolve it by bringing their case. Let's even suppose that the court objectively reached the wrong conclusion and the plaintiffs shouldn't have prevailed, but they did. That doesn't mean THEY should be disbarred. It means that we should look at what happened in the court and take the case up on appeal if the outcome wasn't what it should have been. If it's really aggregious and the judge on the bench just decided, "Hey, I like these two--it's another judge and an attorney and we're tight because we chose the same profession," we should look at the judge deciding the case. I still haven't heard a reason why the couple bringing the case in the first place should be disbarred because they exercised their right to bring a non-frivolous case before the court.TPM Sister #102 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #44 November 22, 2007 Thank you Snowwhite, Now can you please get the fuck of my landHow are you Beth? Is it on again this year? Any word on that yet?, i mean next year. I have taken a year of jumping and am starting to crave for a big boogie. I must say it has been nice spending weekends with my girlfriend for the first time in our 5 year relationship .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdfreefly 1 #45 November 22, 2007 Hey, how about a life time pass to the WFFC for the guy who posted the story? I actually found it here: http://reddit.com/info/6126e/comments/ So all you skydivers can read comments and vote up the story if you want to get it back on the front page of reddit. Methane Freefly - got stink? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hangarbeyach 0 #46 November 22, 2007 Hi, I posted earlier from another thread, not sure where but it had to do with Don Kirlin. Yes it is the Kirlin family who put on all the fun times for us all. I have worked for Don and Susie since 1992 as a volunteer, then 1996 as a year round employee. The only full time employee. I still work for him as the full time employee. So I know what I am talking about. He and his wife Susie stopped doing the convention for mainly one reason. $$ They put out several thousands of dollars each year to support the WFFC. And they loved doing it. The continued to do it for a couple of years in hopes things would pick up. The last year after almost losing their daughter in a skydiving accident, the decision was easier. So about the property being stolen. They bought the land 23 years ago. Then about a year ago the last child went away to college, and they decided it was time to start building the retirement home they had worked so hard to have. Well the rest of the story is pretty much on this thread. The attorney and her live in Judge, stole it. Read all about it at: landgrabber.org. I know how strong the skydiving community is after living with them 3 weeks out of the year for the last 15 years. Anyway drop the Kirlins a line. Whether or not you like what happened with the WFFC, stealing property, especially by the god damn authorities is just bullshit, and you know it. Happy Turkey Day All, Ellen aka hangarbeyach Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bolas 5 #47 November 22, 2007 Quote The last year after almost losing their daughter in a skydiving accident, the decision was easier. What happened? Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #48 November 22, 2007 QuoteHe and his wife Susie stopped doing the convention for mainly one reason. Is this confirmation that the WFFC is now finished? .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hangarbeyach 0 #49 November 22, 2007 Don and Susie's daughter had a really bad landing. She lived but has a lot of metal in her back. They were not sure for a while if she would live, much less walk. She just graduated from Boulder University. Thanks for askin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,393 #50 November 22, 2007 Take a look at the video found on the www.landgrabber.org site: http://www.myfoxcolorado.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=4844534&version=1&locale=EN-US There seems to be a lack of any evidence the claimants ever used that land."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
