dropdeded 0 #1 April 28, 2009 ...compass and map? New hiker, did Mt. Whitney last year (simple as far as established trail..), have a good start as far as gear, lots of mountain trails around my home. I like the solo thing for the most part and want to get into some "off the beaten path" areas. But I dont want to get lost I like the idea of old fashioned compass and map, maybe gonna find a class(?) for that but whats up with the GPS? Use one? Suggestions appreciated. Thanks.------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluesilver30 0 #2 April 28, 2009 i do a lot of solo backpacking/hunting too. i usually just use a compass / map. just make sure you study the area you plan to be in first. learn the elevations on the map, how it works and all. you have to be able to translate what you see on the map to what you see when you look around the mountains. i do keep a simple gps with me though just in case. it just gives me coordinates, so i can reference on the map where i am. these things are so cheap and light, you might as well get one to be safe. you can get one for under $100 easy. also, make sure you have a decent survival pack you keep in your pocket (especially when away from camp and all). don't want to be caught out there without anything. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icon134 0 #3 April 28, 2009 in today's day and age I would probably use a GPS as a primary but would still want to have a solid understanding of how to work with a compass and map as a backup since GPS batteries/electronic devices do sometimes fail... and you don't want to get out in the middle of nowhere and suddenly find out that your GPS device is no longer working and not be able to get back home. This is one of the things that I'm glad I learned as a Boy scout when I was a kid...Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluesilver30 0 #4 April 28, 2009 yeah, to piggy back on what icon said. a gps is fine to use if you want to, but always have a map with you. don't rely on your gps. assume it will fail at any moment, and you'll be fine. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #5 April 28, 2009 Compass and map every time ... remember technology can fail and should only be used as a backup. There are no excuses for not learning proper navigational skills if you are venturing out into the wilderness. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropdeded 0 #6 April 28, 2009 Quote Compass and map every time ... remember technology can fail and should only be used as a backup. There are no excuses for not learning proper navigational skills if you are venturing out into the wilderness. Exactly my thoughts..just got off the phone with the local ranger station a few miles up the road and all's I got was "uh, I dont know.." I told em that they better find me when I get lost------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #7 April 28, 2009 That said, my 'backup' is currently an Garmin Vista but I'm planning to move up to a Garmin Oregon 400t (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropdeded 0 #8 April 28, 2009 QuoteThat said, my 'backup' is currently an Garmin Vista but I'm planning to move up to a Garmin Oregon 400t I bought the wife a Garmin last christmas, guess I could just steal that for a few days. I thought it would need to be some kinda hiking specific but I would imagine as long as it has elevation and coordinates it'll work eh. Now to find a compass etc...------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #9 April 28, 2009 GPS and map. Many GPS have compass built-in. I have the Oregon 300, but I would recommend the 400t, which has a lot of good feature for hiking. It has a pre-loaded topo map, so you can pull both out and cross-reference them. Once you have GPS, you won't spend time with a map and compass much anymore. Always bring a spare pair of AA batteries, though.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #10 April 28, 2009 Quote Quote That said, my 'backup' is currently an Garmin Vista but I'm planning to move up to a Garmin Oregon 400t I bought the wife a Garmin last christmas, guess I could just steal that for a few days. I thought it would need to be some kinda hiking specific but I would imagine as long as it has elevation and coordinates it'll work eh. Now to find a compass etc... The Garmin Vista is NOT a car SAT NAV (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropdeded 0 #11 April 28, 2009 I dont know what the hell kinda garmin I bought her, I just know it was like 4 hundred freekin bucks ------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
regulator 0 #12 April 28, 2009 I've got the thing for you. Join the army and then take the LAND NAV course. You'll know your way around so well after that the GPS will be asking YOU for directions! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #13 April 28, 2009 Quote I've got the thing for you. Join the army and then take the LAND NAV course. You'll know your way around so well after that the GPS will be asking YOU for directions! Only if you're in Iraq Navigation courses are a great idea, and are sometimes very inexpensive ($50 or a donation). A lot cheaper than a tour of duty, and less likely to get shot. Here's one by the Mountaineers that costs $35: http://www.mountaineers.org/seattle/navigation/Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #14 April 28, 2009 If you rely solely on a GPS for navigation, you're asking for trouble. Get the USGS 1:24,000-scale topo maps of the area in which you'll be hiking. You can order them in advance online, or most park offices will sell them on-site. Learn how to match up the contour lines with the geography you're seeing, that you know exactly where you are. Make mental notes about landmarks along the way, including turning around and looking backwards, so that you'll recognize the way back. These could be things like an odd-looking tree, or an unusual shaped mountain peak. I keep a small ball compass hanging on the front of my backpack, so that with just a glance at any time, I know exactly which way I'm heading. It's sometimes easy to get turned around, in flat desert, or heavy woods. The compass will keep you straight. I have a better compass in the pack, which can be used to orient the map on magnetic north, with proper declination. If that's Greek to you, read up on it and learn. I also carry the GPS, and I start a big hike by capturing the location of my truck, so that I always have a reference point to get back home. I like to navigate by seat-of-the-pants dead-reckoning and map reading, and the large majority of the time I can find what I'm looking for without using the GPS. Consider GPS as a backup only, to your other navigation skills. Have a spare set of batteries in your pack for it, because they'll go dead out in the field sooner or later. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
regulator 0 #15 April 28, 2009 That sounds to be a much more reasonable course than what I took in the army back in 1996. I'm sure its much easier to get a good reading of your position when mortars arent flying above your head. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,122 #16 April 28, 2009 John knows his stuff on hiking. Wendy P.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #17 April 28, 2009 steal it then, she wont know where to find it anyway.. “Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropdeded 0 #18 April 28, 2009 Quote I've got the thing for you. Join the army and then take the LAND NAV course. You'll know your way around so well after that the GPS will be asking YOU for directions! lets just say the army dont want me(to old), that would be a whole 'nuther threadLooked around (googled the shit out of) and still not sure which compass is appropriate. I thought like sport chalet had basic classes etc for wilderness crap but cant find anything Im not done....I got to put that crap I bought last year to use------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #19 April 28, 2009 QuoteThat sounds to be a much more reasonable course than what I took in the army back in 1996. I'm sure its much easier to get a good reading of your position when mortars arent flying above your head. My first nav course was combined with a week-long survival course. Went something like this: What's our current bearing? Man, I'm hungry ... Any idea how far to the next cairn? I think I hear a beaver ... Ever eaten beaver? No, but they probably taste pretty good ... If you pick up those red ants and pinch their heads off, put them in water, it tastes like lemon-aid Or we can boil tree-bark and eat it ad infinitumTrapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #20 April 28, 2009 Okay, what John said. But in case you didn't catch it the Garmin you bought your wife, if it was for the car, will not work for hiking. I don't think it will work without an accessory plug. Anyway, a bottom level hand held GPS is only a $100. I'd use one now, but can't go very far with my bad leg. Before GPS I though I knew how to use a map and compass. But I got into the rockies with the USGS map and a compass and couldn't figure which the hell high point of the ridge was which on the map! I wan't 'lost' because I knew how to get back following the trail, but I sure didn't know where on the map I was. Between trees, too many points of reference, the precision of the compass etc. made it a whole lot harder than I thought. That and I was carrying too much and was a flat lander not ready for the altitude.And a lot of the hand held GPS's can 'act' as a compass. I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #21 April 28, 2009 Quote And a lot of the hand held GPS's can 'act' as a compass. Only if they are powered up and working!! My main reason for getting out into the hills is to get away from technology. As in my earlier post - the proper use of map and compass is my choice way of navigating (although I do use my Vista on my Paraglider for nav') ..... only because I can't use a sextant and the stars (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #22 April 28, 2009 Quote Quote And a lot of the hand held GPS's can 'act' as a compass. Only if they are powered up and working!! My main reason for getting out into the hills is to get away from technology. As in my earlier post - the proper use of map and compass is my choice way of navigating (although I do use my Vista on my Paraglider for nav') ..... only because I can't use a sextant and the stars fucking pussy you are, i knew it!!! “Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #23 April 28, 2009 QuoteBefore GPS I though I knew how to use a map and compass. But I got into the rockies with the USGS map and a compass and couldn't figure which the hell high point of the ridge was which on the map! I wan't 'lost' because I knew how to get back following the trail, but I sure didn't know where on the map I was. Between trees, too many points of reference, the precision of the compass etc. made it a whole lot harder than I thought. Yes, and the GPS can be very valuable at times like that to pinpoint exactly where you are and eliminate the confusion. I'll use mine for spot-checking now and then, just to be sure. But leaving it on all the time just eats the batteries too quickly. I used mine to help me out once just like that too. I was making a round-about hike, not doubling back on my own path. I figured I'd climb over a ridge, and from the top I'd be able to see down into the flat desert where my red truck was parked 3-miles away. But upon reaching the top of the ridge, what was on the other side was... another ridge. Uh-oh. The GPS gave me assurance that I was really where I thought I was, and that my plan was still good. And to get those pinpoints, if they don't have a GPS with a built in map display, they'll need to know how to find that pinpoint on their paper topo map. Learn how to read and plot latitude/longitude or UTM grids on the map. Same thing with canoe trips. I watch a compass in my boat, and match my direction to the meanders of the river on a map in a waterproof case, in order to keep up with my location. That's usually good enough for me to know accurately where I'm at. But if I have an attention lapse, or there's a long string of horseshoe curves and I've lost count of how many, then the GPS can help out. I like to use my GPS to pinpoint locations of things I find, that aren't marked on my topo maps. I make notes of the readings, and then draw them in on my maps later. This can be old abandoned stone homes, old cemeteries, Indian pictographs, caves, etc. The government conspires to remove those things from maps so that nobody knows they are there. That's their way of protecting them - by preventing anyone from knowing to go see them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #24 April 30, 2009 Quotein today's day and age I would probably use a GPS as a primary but would still want to have a solid understanding of how to work with a compass and map as a backup since GPS batteries/electronic devices do sometimes fail... and you don't want to get out in the middle of nowhere and suddenly find out that your GPS device is no longer working and not be able to get back home. This is one of the things that I'm glad I learned as a Boy scout when I was a kid... Make sure you also know your "pace count" what good is a map and compass if you don't know how far each step will take you.... (accuracy)Leroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropdeded 0 #25 May 1, 2009 This'll be good for a start. Seems appropriate. Do some day hikes in my local area for some learn'n. done dropped his compass in the woods..... ------------------------------------------ The Dude Abides. - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
