freeflybella

like the lies about the 'killing floors' they are really more of a grate to allow for better drainage This is not one of those posts. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

to andyboyd and plfxpert: One thing I want be clear about, I'm not suggesting that NBC should've been barred from showing the video. I intended to let you have the last word - and hopefully you will

It's only a better comparison to you b/c it proves your point; they didn't show it for reasons of sensitivity. Osama (and pictures, etc. of terrorists who were "on the scene") was shown quickly after, thus I chose that instead to help illustrate my point. Bygones. It's a better comparison in my mind because it goes to the root of what I think is the reason why the video did not need to be shown. And it's apples to apples. No one who saw the terrorists on the scene lived. No one. Everyone saw the planes and the fireballs and the building collapses. And I addressed why I believe that images of bin laden and images of Cho cannot be compared equally. We are/were still hunting the terrorists - pictures of wanted criminals does have a place on TV, the video shown of the terrorists was not 'in your face' ranting that anyone could have immediately related to, etc. My earlier hypothetical about the rapist is the perfect picture of my point of view. You're free to have yours.

Nope. Still believe it's a bad comparison. But I'll bite a little: translating bin laden form arabic to english has a similar effect to a news anchor telling vs. showing the video; and although bin laden was the mastermind behind the attacks, he was not on the scene. A better comparison here would be NBC airing a bunch of plane crashes on Sept. 12. (which by the way, they did not - everyone self-censored to some degree. A commercial of mine was pulled from the air out of sensitivity.) I didn't say "why can't they just tell us instead of show the video". I know why - profit. I said "what is there possibly to gain - that outweighs what the damage that can (will) be done." Again, I can't think of anything other than profit - and it's titillating for the 'watchers'. Oh, and a measuring stick for determining nutty boyfriends. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Whew! In my opinion, that's another issue altogether...and kind of a red herring. (There are too many ways that scenario is different to really compare without multiple tangents.) Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I guess I could've been more clear. I believe that's why NBC showed the video. Ratings. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Here's another hypothetical: Your wife is raped. A few days later, after bringing her home from the hospital, and after the rapist has been caught - on the news you both see a video of the rapist yelling right into the camera "I'm going to get you! You made me do this. You had a million chances to prevent it!" (Even typing this scenario made my heart pound. ) edited in response to the Bin Laden question some posts below. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

That's what I'm to get at. And I wonder if the possibility that the "good" ?? that comes from seeing this sick violent video - outweighs the trauma it could potentially inflict on the victims families in mourning, the survivors still suffering, and even the survivors of all of the other school shootings, etc. Shit - even children lucky enough not to have been involved in a school shooting in the past few years - are afraid to go to school. Is there really something for 'us' - the watchers, the distant bystanders - to gain that trumps what those personally affected will experience. I'm not looking for a soft and fuzzy world. Trust me, I'm no polyanna. But I do believe in compassion and respect sometimes before profit. (I for one do not think the potential for copycats or glorification is a reason not to show it. Video or not, those people are out there.) Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

For those of you who voted yes - what do you think there is to learn by watching that video? (I'm talking about the random public, not law enforcement and/or those in the crime and mental health professions.) What should I have learned when I accidentally stumbled upon it - that I didn't already know? Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I voted NO. It added nothing. We all knew he was a nutjob. There will still be people who sympathize with him. NBC allowed him to have the last jab. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

that's why propellor beanies are so GREAT - once you just rip out the tag, you really can't get them on backwards I have an internet crush on you and most of your posts. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Yeah, I know. I guess I'm not suggesting that they shouldn't be allowed to play it. But where is the backlash? Everyone's reacting with horror that Simon Cowell allegedly rolled his eyes in regard to the shootings - but we're all happy to allow the actual killer to taunt us? If I had known what was going on - or what I was seeing in time, I def would've stopped watching. It wasn't that clear a situation in the moment. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Yeah - That part is clear. But when a news station makes an effort not to reveal the names of crime victims (the amish victims) and/or rape accusers (Kobe Bryant) or do stories on the president's children - to "protect" them, it makes you wonder how they make distinctions. What if one of your children was a victim and you happened to look up at the TV and see that video? They didn't talk on the news about the fact that Gary Heidnick ground up one of his victims in dog food and fed her to another victim. They only reported that he was found with 6 women tied up in his basement. Was the other part too gruesome? To me, showing that video was just as gruesome. Maybe it's just a different age. You're going to get it on YouTube or LiveLeak - why not show it on the evening news... Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I did and I can't believe they played it. Well, I guess I can, it's sensational. But for christ's sake...do we really need to see that? Isn't he just taunting us/the victims/the families from the grave? What good does it do to show those videos?! Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

You are a very bad guest. take care, space Some people are so used to having the TV on in the background, they leave it on constantly. My parents are like that. I always ask them to turn it down or off when they're/we're not watching it. It is TOTALLY annoying. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Your post reminded me of an episode of This American Life called "What I learned from TV". In one act, a writer, who hadn't watched TV since college, was asked to get cable and watch 29 hours of TV in one week (the average amount watched by Americans) and report his findings. A funny quote: "Upon telling my friend Jane that I had subscribed to cable - she replied, THANK GOD. Now we have something to talk about!" Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

"More than half of the raw chicken in the United States market has Campylobacter on it." -CDC Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Danny...10 years ago. My first skydiving family. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I backpacked around europe with a friend after college and met a couple on the train - we were heading from France to Switzerland and they suggested we stop in Annecy. Wow! We stayed with the cutest little old couple in their boarding house. That lake was un-B-lievable. Every photo I took looked like a postcard. I was so pleasantly surprised to see my favorite secret shared by someone else. Thanks for bringing back memories.

I almost posted the same question. And I almost posted that if y'all would just STOP EATING MEAT all of this would be moot. Then I just kind of deleted my post and went and had dinner. Big fat Porterhouse by any chance? Think I'm going back to wild game myself. Braised tempeh, sauteed baby bok choy in shoyu, carrot 3 pepper and tomato stew. Glass of Pinot. Wild game - next best thing. Stay away from that supermarket trash.

I almost posted the same question. And I almost posted that if y'all would just STOP EATING MEAT all of this would be moot. Then I just kind of deleted my post and went and had dinner. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

That's the debate I'm having. In no way am I debating the vax or non-vax issue. I want to keep that personal. Yup. Varicella zoster lies dormant in the nervous system for years and may develop into shingles. As I stated in my previous post, there is anecdotal evidence that shows repeated exposure to the wild virus over a lifetime may prevent to occurance of shingles later in life. You get this without the vaccine. You don't get this with the vaccine. Because of the vaccine, shingles is on the rise. But, again, Merck has recently introduced the shingles vaccine. Before 1995, Approx. 50 children and 50 adults out of 4 million cases died annually. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I'm pretty aware of all the varied reasons why people might approve of/question/disapprove of vaccines. Even if you believe vaccines are beneficial (if not necessary) - you don't have to believe they should be mandatory. Even if you believe they should be mandatory - you don't have to believe they should be a consumer product. Even if you believe HiB is no-brainer - you don't have to accept that getting the varicella vaccine is better than getting the wild disease. (when wild chickenpox is so hard to come by - the incidences of adults getting chickenpox may rise due to waning childhood vaccination. Additionally, contracting the wild disease reduces the chances of getting shingles later in life - AND it's speculated that repeated exposure to the wild disease as you get older (from children, grandchildren) acts as a booster to further reduce the incidences of shingles. As it is now, they are introducing a fucking shingles vaccine for those who get the varicella vaccine as children. Finally, the CDC added varicella to the routine schedule primarily for parental convenience/need - so that parents don't have to be out of work for a week with a sick kid.) Even if you agree that vaccines are safe and get them all - you don't have to start injecting your newborn. You can delay the vax schedule in any number of ways. You can wait to start vaxing until 6 months - until 3 years old - until school or preschool/daycare age. You can request only 1 or 2 shots per visit rather than 4 or 5. *Note to all parents: if your child is sick or has been sick within 1 week of a scheduled vax appointment, reschedule. Do not vax your child if s/he is ill. (This is printed on all accompanying printed warning/info sheets.) Also, learn what the *real side effects of each vaccine are and actively watch for them - and let your ped know right away AND again at the next scheduled appointment that your child had a bad reaction. Peds always tell you soreness and fever - but did you know (as stated in philh's post) that 1 in 100 children who recieve DtaP will scream violently for sometimes hours? I'm really not a fear-monger. I don't disrespect parents who choose to vaccinate. I just want people to know doesn't have to be black and white. Just like all things having to do with your child - it's your responsibility to know what's happening and why. Whatever your final decision is. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Again, we're not talking about the ability to do what's best for your kid. We're talking about having that ability taken away. The "real world" is more than blindly trusting institutions/systems/people (especially those who stand to make money from that trust). The "real world" includes recognition that those long revered institutions sometimes fuck up. And fuck up bad. It includes the understanding that most times, the right thing falls somewhere near the middle of a debate and not being afraid to look at all sides. I think I live in the real world, Bill. I think we might even be neighbors! Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

What if you had the clairvoyant knowledge that your child would be permanently injured or die from the vaccine. Would you fork over the $600 bucks for him to get the shot? Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi