suit selection

[vandev 0]

Hey all, I would like to get some input into suit selection. I am looking to birdman when i get current again. The cost though ,to go threw classic, skyflyer and so on is a factor in gettiing into it. I would be curious to know if any of you guys have skippped a suit..i.e...gone strait to say a skyflyer? When i was jumping regularly, i was freeflying and skysurfing and a little camera so i am quite familiar with things that can screw the pooch. I am very confortable in the air and am never in a hurry to learn faster than my ability. I have done allot of tracking dives and would like to get into this. Any comments and advise would be great. I am asking as i can pick up a skyflyer 2 in my size at a great price. "I never see classics" Would like to know if this would be a waist .

Thanks all for the time... Chris

In the end...the universe has a way of working itself out.... "Harold and Kumar go to White Castle"

[bodypilot1 0]

PM sent



Keepin' it safe!
Ed

www.WestCoastWingsuits.com
www.PrecisionSkydiving.com

[vandev 0]

sorry , the suit is a skyflyer 1..if that makes any difference..

In the end...the universe has a way of working itself out.... "Harold and Kumar go to White Castle"

[TomAiello 25]

If it's the one in the classifieds (and on ebay) I don't think it is a SF1. I've worn that suit,and it's a SF1+ prototype (hence, I suppose, the seller calling it a SF2).

As I recall, the major difference from the SF1 is a larger leg wing.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[DaGimp 0]

my reccomendation, is first starting not to go any larger then the GTI, it is the medium wing, which can fly easily with SF3's but yet it dosent take as much work to control......relating them to canopys......gti would be like your saber while the sf3 is like your HP canopies. it takes more strength to fly and its more twitchy in the air.


hope this helps.

"Professor of Pimpology"~~~Bolas

[vandev 0]

Thanks DaGimp, I really appreciate the advice. Thanks..... How would the matter suit or s-fly compair to the birdman suits in ability?

Thanks again all...... chris

In the end...the universe has a way of working itself out.... "Harold and Kumar go to White Castle"

[KrisFlyZ 0]

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Thanks DaGimp, I really appreciate the advice. Thanks..... How would the matter suit or s-fly compair to the birdman suits in ability?

Thanks again all...... chris

The S-Fly requires more leg strength than the S3. I am able to get almost the same performance out of the S3 and the S-Fly.


Kris.

[SCARYPERRY 0]

And then there is Vampire

Only he can be happy,who can make his the present hour,for today he has lived

[KrisFlyZ 0]

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And then there is Vampire

He is talking about beginner suits . Like the GTI and the S-Fly. Even though the S-Fly has a big performance range, it can be flown as a first suit because it is easy to fly.

Are the beginner suits from PF called Vampire also?

Kris.

[Tonto 1]

The Vampire V1 owners manual recomends a minimum of 50 wingsuit jumps prior to its use.

But I'm sure you know this - which begs the question, why did you post?

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[KrisFlyZ 0]

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The Vampire V1 owners manual recomends a minimum of 50 wingsuit jumps prior to its use.

But I'm sure you know this - which begs the question, why did you post?

t

May be he meant the beginner suits from PF. I don't see anything wrong in someone pointing out another option.

To say it in your words.......

But I'm sure you know this - which begs the question, why did you post?

Kris

[SCARYPERRY 0]

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The Vampire V1 owners manual recomends a minimum of 50 wingsuit jumps prior to its use.

But I'm sure you know this - which begs th question, why did you post?

t

Hmm...on a mission to Fl to learn to fly wingsuit...probly buy one in next month..what are his options?We have 4 mfg's with suits in production..mabe to tempt the man with candy down the road?? I put all my students out on GTI! And have demo fleet of same,never had any problems starting them on that model!We all want top end in performance,and it sure is nice to window shop while we learn. I know when I was under a Manta 300, I was looking at sabre info....

Only he can be happy,who can make his the present hour,for today he has lived

[TomAiello 25]

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He is talking about beginner suits...

Actually, in his first post he asks about a SF1+ prototype suit that is currently for sale. That's hardly a beginner suit, in my opinion, and I think that question set the context for the discussion (at least in my mind).

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[SCARYPERRY 0]

Has anybody looked at his profile? It shows he has 40+ wingsuit jumps already....Sorry!! will go fishen for a bit,enjoy the day

Only he can be happy,who can make his the present hour,for today he has lived

[Tonto 1]

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Has anybody looked at his profile? It shows he has 40+ wingsuit jumps already

Well - Not really. It shows he has 40 Skysurfing jumps already. He has yet to jump a suit, dispite him looking at a SF1 in his opening post.

If this were the Swooping and canopy control forum, and someone suggested the highest performance canopy yet produced to someone who has yet to jump - they'd be crucified. While I understand your and Kris's open view to all manufactures suits - I find your push on them irresponsible, particularly since the origional poster mentions that he has yet to get current.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[Tonto 1]

I posted because he recomended a "Vampire" which he knows has a 50 wingsuit jump minimum to someone who is both uncurrent and who has never jumped a wingsuit.

At best, I find that socially irresponsible. At worst, criminally negligent.

But maybe that's just me!

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[TomAiello 25]

Regardless, back to the original question (sort of), do have a look at this thread, where the Phoenix Fly beginner suit is discussed.

Honestly, I think I'd look into that suit for a lead-in, because after you "outgrow" (in terms of flight skills) the suit, it'll still be useful (hence salable) to lots of BASE jumpers who want to be able to control the risers immediately after opening. I think we're going to start seeing suits like that (and like the Access, which I'd also recommend you investigate) serving dual purposes--as "intro" suits, and as high end BASE tracking suits, where people want to have instant arm control.

In terms of skipping suits, with what is currently on the market? I'd probably do a FFC with a rental classic, then buy a GTi, fly that a whole bunch, and then buy a top-line suit. Getting into a GTi after your instructor signs you off as safe is probably going to be ok, and moving from a couple hundred jumps on the GTi straight up to SF3 (probably SF5 by then) or V-1, or some other high end suit, ought to be equally reasonable. That way you only need to buy 2 suits to get to the top end. Note that I am not a BMI or any other kind of wingsuit instructor, so take this advice with a largish grain of salt.

Definitely investigate the Access and PF beginner suit, though, as options.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[KrisFlyZ 0]

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I posted because he recomended a "Vampire" which he knows has a 50 wingsuit jump minimum to someone who is both uncurrent and who has never jumped a wingsuit.

At best, I find that socially irresponsible. At worst, criminally negligent.

But maybe that's just me!

t

I got that part, I was asking if you failed to acknowledge the possibility that he may be talking about a beginner suit as I had mentioned in the preceeding post

I am editing this post so we get back on topic. My opinion on the S-Fly is different than most other people on here have about mono wingsuits. I think the S-Fly has excellent glide.

Kris.

[TomAiello 25]

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How would the matter suit or s-fly compair to the birdman suits in ability?

That's a giant can of worms.

Short answer: borrow or buy each suit, fly them for yourself a bit, and see which works best for you.

Long answer? Do a search of this forum for all the discussions about it. Everyone's got an opinion. For what it's worth, my opinion is that the big monowing (Matter, Sugar Glider, S-Fly) suits get lots of float, but not so much drive, resulting in worse overall glide angle (but longer flights and quicker starts from dead air exits) than the multi-wing (Birdman and Phoenix Fly) style suits.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Pendragon 1]

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Quote

How would the matter suit or s-fly compair to the birdman suits in ability?

...my opinion is that the big monowing (Matter, Sugar Glider, S-Fly) suits get lots of float, but not so much drive, resulting in worse overall glide angle (but longer flights and quicker starts from dead air exits) than the multi-wing (Birdman and Phoenix Fly) style suits.

I agree with that from a more theoretical standpoint. My take on it is that the "mono-wing" suits appear to have a much lower aspect ratio than the "multi-wing" types so the glide will be lower as the wing is less efficient (greater induced drag).

Don't confuse wing-loading with glide - the two are not interdependent. Although the mono-wings have (or appear to have) a larger wing area, this may result in a lower min-sink rate but not a better glide. The analogy is think of yourself under a 150 sq ft 9-cell canopy vs a 265 sq ft 7-cell... Yup, you'll get down quicker under the 150, but you can glide further as the angle of descent is not as steep (glide angle).

So, a Matter suit might outfloat an S3, but it'll never cover as much ground.

Lastly, with regard to Scaryperry's earlier post, he was (at least, it was clear to me) initially responding to a further question on how different types of suits compare, rather than recommending a V-1 to a beginner... Time to fly!

--
BASE #1182
Muff #3573
PFI #52; UK WSI #13

[KrisFlyZ 0]

I guess the can of worms has been opened .

I cannot get the same flight times(about 5-10 secs less on a flight from 14K for same pull altitudes) from the S-Fly but I seem to cover the same amount of ground as I can in the S3. Remember the S-fly is made of a different material that is semi-rigid. I have not had the opportunity yet but I have been planning to get actual GPS numbers from S-fly and S3 flights and post numbers. Ofcourse there are a lot of variables and the numbers may not mean much but I intend to compare if my seat of the pants feel of Glide ratio I am getting with the S-fly is close to what I get with the S3.

Kris.

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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Hey all, I would like to get some input into suit selection. I am looking to birdman when i get current again. The cost though ,to go threw classic, skyflyer and so on is a factor in gettiing into it. I would be curious to know if any of you guys have skippped a suit..i.e...gone strait to say a skyflyer?

That's a bad idea.

I own an original birdman suit and skyflyer.

The skyflyer is pretty twitchy which is not good if you're the least bit tense or are a bit off on opening. It would be much easier to get an uncontrolled spin. Get a classic or GTI.

Like Tom said your first suit won't necessarily be wasted. You really want people to fly with, and loaning my original suit to people was enough to get people to buy one. I'm thinking about taking the original off a cliff for the stability although there's no way I'd do that with the skyflyer because of stability issues and the bigger wing sometimes getting near the pilot chute handle.

[SCARYPERRY 0]

Looks like flock n dock will have everything in the air!! Be interesting to compare,exchange idea's,suits if they fit,ect!! Looks like Thanksgiving will see all suits as well as heard of bigway/70+ in Deland.But not to start rumor, was just passing info along that I heard

Only he can be happy,who can make his the present hour,for today he has lived

[LouDiamond 1]

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I'd probably do a FFC with a rental classic, then buy a GTi, fly that a whole bunch, and then buy a top-line suit. Getting into a GTi after your instructor signs you off as safe is probably going to be ok, and moving from a couple hundred jumps on the GTi straight up to SF3 (probably SF5 by then)

Very good advice that I often recommend to those looking at getting into wingsuiting. Some progress faster than others but you can never go wrong by systematically progressing. Those that do, end up flying their suits more efficiently in the end.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[vandev 0]

Thanks Tonto, kris, Tom, Lou and anyone i forgot to mention. I had no idea i would get this much feedback. I really appreciate the input. I agree with renting a classic is the best idea. I know i will be able to drum one up at Deland. Im in Miami but would rather make the drive and do it right. I will only after at least 50 jumps in a week to get current again. It's been a year since my last jump..."family , kids and work" no time. "you know the story" ..well i wake board allot thou... And No i will not be jumping my crossfire 109 on my recurancy jump even know i would not have a problem with that. I did the "build a custom skysurf board" when i was first getting into it and over sharpened the edge too sharp. "Kicked my ass and a few board cutaways from hell". I agree with advice comming from seasoned flyers and thats how i am still walking and talking today. Anyway...Thanks all and blue skies!!

In the end...the universe has a way of working itself out.... "Harold and Kumar go to White Castle"