DB Cooper

[FLYJACK 654]

3 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Hahneman was one of the more high-profile hijackers. He pulled off his crime just seven months or so after Cooper. He carried a gun, and wasn't afraid to threaten people with it. He put a noose around the pilot's neck at one point. His favorite cigarette was Benson and Hedges, and he demanded and received two full cartons of them along with the ransom. Unlike Cooper, he was pretty loose-lipped and gave away several details about himself which made it easy for the FBI to identify him. 

When a passenger would get up to go to the bathroom, he would shove the gun right into their stomach as a warning. Unlike Cooper, he wasn't quiet about what he was doing on that flight and some of the passengers said later they were scared shitless of the guy. 

Hahneman sounds like a league and a half away from Cooper, if you ask me. In fact, he was so high profile, with embassies getting involved and even the director of the FBI at one point...it seems inconceivable they would fail to identify him as Cooper...if in fact he WAS Cooper. 

If he did a completely different M.O. as Cooper and got away with $200,000 in the Great Northwest...why would he return to Easton, PA and do a completely different M.O. on another hijacking just a few months later? There is no evidence he was ever in the Northwest USA, and he had a job as an engineer in Pennsylvania. He also had a wife and children. 

It's a stretch. 

Your info is not contextually accurate.. very incomplete and some just incorrect.

This lack of accurate, complete and comprehensive info is why Hahneman was ignored and footnoted as a Cooper copycat for almost 50 years.

 

[FLYJACK 654]

6 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I don't think he was a Cooper copycat. I think he was downright dangerous. He was fairly ruthless during the one hijacking that was successfully attributed to him. 

What is not accurate? I got this information from several sources. 

His entry at Wikipedia, newspaper articles, and the entry on him by Brendan Koerner. 

Cooper and your suspect seem very different in personality. Your guy was very threatening, and held the senior stew with a gun to her head in the back of the plane. Cooper chatted with the stews and lit a cigarette for Tina Mucklow. When a passenger went to the rest room, Cooper just kept an eye on them. Your guy shoved a pistol to their stomach to remind them not to try anything funny. Cooper didn't want the crew up front to see him. Hahneman barged right in with a gun and didn't care if anyone saw him or not. Cooper gave detailed instructions on how he wanted the plane flown. Hahneman just told them to slow down. 

Lots of differences in their approach and their personalities here. It's either that or Hahneman was a multiple personality or something. I liked the part where he puts a noose around the pilot's neck and makes the crew shield him all around when they switched planes. This guy does NOT sound like Cooper. He sounds like a pissed off guy with a gun who is on a mission. 

"I'm on a mission from God..." 

What about an accent? He was born in Honduras and had only been in the United States for 12 years at the time of his hijacking. Yet all the descriptions of Cooper said he had no accent? Or if he had one, it was from the Midwest, which is pretty far and away from Hispanic. 

But there is one inescapable thing about Hahneman that is difficult to get past, if you are trying to link him to the Cooper case. Hahneman was SO high profile, seen by SO many people, including a court case and reporters from all over the US descending on his wife and kids in Easton, that he became pretty famous for a while. You have to believe that the FBI made at least a cursory check to see if he COULD have been Cooper, due to the basic similarities of money demands and a jump. They had his prints, his pictures, his whole life story. If there were a shred of evidence he was Cooper, the FBI would have been all over it like white on rice. 

I actually believe that the FBI made a deal with Hahneman. He eventually told them where the money was, and they made a recommendation he not serve his entire life sentence. He was released after twelve years, and dismissed from supervision just six months later. To this day, the FBI has never said how exactly they got back the money, even after inquiries from the media. 

I did like the part where he moved to Costa Mesa, CA after he got out. Nice place. My grandmother lived there for many years. 

I have done a lot of research on Hahneman including obtaining exclusive FBI files, trust me here, you know virtually nothing, some is half truths, some completely wrong and some out of context. An incomplete blend of facts, assumptions and falsehoods. A big job to unwind it all.

I am not sure if it is worth it to explain and correct everything. It would take a lot of work and no upside.

I don't like misinformation out there but I don't want to get bogged down straightening it out composing a 5000 word essay.. It gives me a headache just thinking about it.

 

[ParrotheadVol 70]

7 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

About the only thing that Cooper and Hahneman seem to have in common is maybe a good tan.

C'mon now Robert, we've been through this before. No one ever said Cooper had a tan. You have said that Kenny had a tan at the time (which is impossible to know), but no one said that Cooper had a tan.

Merry Christmas everyone!

[CooperNWO305 146]

2 hours ago, ParrotheadVol said:

C'mon now Robert, we've been through this before. No one ever said Cooper had a tan. You have said that Kenny had a tan at the time (which is impossible to know), but no one said that Cooper had a tan.

Merry Christmas everyone!

The closest resemblance to the witness sketch I’ve seen is William J. Smith. Cary Grant and Rod Serling look like it too, but they are not good candidates for the crime. 

[FLYJACK 654]

10 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I presented pretty much everything that is available on Hahneman. Just writing every historical record on him off without an explanation makes little sense. What FBI files? How is the historical record on him wrong? What about his almost-certain Hispanic accent? Those are key points, along with the differences in both hijackings. They are like night and day. 

Nice guy and bad guy. About the only thing that Cooper and Hahneman seem to have in common is maybe a good tan. Their modus operandi were certainly different. And I didn't even bring up the Tina Bar money, which might be hard to explain for Hahneman, since he was sent to Federal prison in late 1972 for a dozen years. 

 

You presented everything you know which is virtually nothing...

Hahneman's MO was very close to Cooper's.

About the only thing you got right was a difference in behaviour, but there is a good explanation for it. The environments were not comparable.

For Cooper the pilot's asked him if they should inform the passengers of the hijacking, he said no. The passengers were unaware and Cooper only had to deal with compliant stews. Cooper had it easy.

For Hahneman, there are four big differences.

First, The media had run stories about ramped up security including air marshals.

Second, The pilot immediately announced that the plane was hijacked to all the passengers. An aggressive passenger confronted him and Hahneman pulled his gun on him. Cooper was never put in a comparable situation. The perception of the passengers was completely different.

Third, Hahneman had COMPOZ tablets, the original version which had serious side effects. It was reformulated.

Fourth, They were messing with Hahneman, the money was not given in the correct denominations, it was too heavy and had to be swapped out for higher denominations. Hahneman was getting very nervous. Then, they faked a mechanical problem to delay forcing him to move across the tarmac to another plane. He used the crew as a shield from snipers, there is no mention of a noose in the detailed FBI files. Hahneman was put in a vulnerable position that Cooper was not. We don't know what Cooper would have done in that situation. We don't even know if Cooper had a concealed weapon or not.

Other than the above the FBI files do not convey ruthlessness, he engaged in casual conversation with the stews. 

 

What you have wrong..

Hahneman indicated aviation and radar systems knowledge and gave precise instructions.

Hahneman was estranged from his family, he sent them money and worked/travelled all over the world.

Hahneman was not an engineer in PA.. he used his family address but did not live there. 

Hahneman spoke english with NO ACCENT, he was not in the US for only 12 years.

Hahneman did not have a tan, he was swarthy, olive complexion, Latin American. Honduran mother and  US born father of German background.

Hahneman threatened to blow up the plane with a briefcase bomb. 

Most of the detailed info he gave was BS, he was id'd by a tipster for a reward.

Hahneman previously flew into Seattle on Northwest Airlines. (He travelled a lot by plane and ship)

Hahneman did not cut a deal for a reduced sentence in exchange for money, I know how the money was recovered. IMO, a deal was cut for another reason.

Hahneman demanded 2000 Benson & Hedges but had Viceroy's on him.. they are nearly identical to Raleigh's 85mm filtered, both made by B&W the difference is marketing and the coupons.

 

The FBI did investigate Hahneman, for many years. I can't find anything that indicates he was eliminated.

Cooper/Hahneman behaviour was different but it is in the context of their radically different environments.

Besides the addition of the gun the MO is virtually identical.

Hahneman was dressed in a dark suit, white shirt, overcoat, thin black tie, brown shoes and sunglasses.

He got military chutes. He left an opened chute behind. He sat in the back and used the interphone. He stayed in the lav for a bit. He kept a stew with him. He requested his demand notes returned. He even left a tie behind. He had pills for the crew. He demanded to fly to MEX. He was military on an aircrew.

 

The biggest one, he actually hijacked a 727 and successfully jumped over a jungle at night from 9000 ft out the aft airstairs. That alone puts him at the top of the suspect list. 

 

That is just a start.. I have much more..

[FLYJACK 654]

Here are some publicly available media quotes.. these give a sense of Hahneman and the similarities to Cooper's profile.. it doesn't prove he is Cooper but should cause any rational researcher to look into it further and I did.

 

A sample of public media quotes. RE: Hahneman

A swarthy gunman hijacked an Eastern Airlines jet over Pennsylvania today, picked up $303,000 in ransom and six parachutes during a stopover at Dulles International Airport

the hijacker who parachuted into Honduras with $303,000 had penetrated the airport screening system required by the Federal Aviation Administration.

Passengers first got word on the hijacking when the pilot announced over the intercom, "We are going to Dulles. Someone else is in charge of the plane."

The pilot said the hijacker handed the crew a three-page list of demands

A source said the hijacker sent out a detailed list of instructions which indicated he had flying experience.

An Eastern official said, "from what we get here, he is calm and calculated, not easily perturbed." The gunman commandeered the 727 using an intercom telephone line to the pilot from the rear of the plane

collected about $300,000 in cash, eight parachutes, two cartons of Benson Hedges cigarettes, food and fuel.

Passengers described the hijacker as well-dressed, well-spoken and business like

"He said he didn't, care If the plane crashed because he had only six months anyway," Confalone said. Stewardess Madeleine Willet said the man "spoke English without an accent, but he looked Latin American.”

As I walked toward the hijacker, I became so involved in trying to study him up close, but the sight of his gun turned my attention from him. The hijacker seemed middle-aged, about 5-feet 10-inches, black hair specked with traces of gray, a pointed nose and a dark complexion that seemed twice as menacing behind a pair of deeply tinted sunglasses.

described the hijacker as middle-aged, about 165 pounds, 5-feet-10, and wearing dark glasses.

Then, 2 1/2 hours after landing Passengers described Thursday's hijacker as about 5 feet 10, inches tall, well-dressed, well-spoken and business like.

The hijacker seemed middle-aged, about 5-feet 10-inches, black hair specked with traces of gray, a pointed nose and a dark complexion that seemed twice as menacing behind a pair of deeply tinted sunglasses.

The gunman commandeered the 727 using an intercom to the pilot from the rear of the plane and forced it to land twice at Dulles

Colovos said the hijacker had "set up shop" in the plane's lavatory
An Eastern official said, "from what we get here, he is calm and calculated, not easily perturbed.

described by an Eastern official as "calm and calculating, not easily perturbed," used an intercom to hijack the plane.

The man carried a gun and claimed he had explosives in a briefcase, the FAA said.

"I think he has this thing pretty well figured out." Martin referred to the deft maneuvers by the hijacker and the specific requests he had made, some of them "couched in language indicating he knew how to fly the jetliner himself. ... Among other things, Martin cited the way the hijacker gave specific orders for flying at a particular altitude "and direction and when he "boarded the second plane, the first move was to pull down shades he could not be seen.

"He evidently studied our flight schedules," said Robert Martin, a spokesman for Eastern. "He was supposedly a pilot in the Vietnam War. He had flown and knew all about airplanes." The hijacker threatened to blow up the plane

The man, believed to be a former Vietnam war pilot an Air Corps radar technician during World War II

as a radar operator and a flight crew man......and that his occupation had been radio, electrical and communications engineer.

Frederick William Hahneman who had served in the Army from April 19, 1943, to March 19, 1946, as a radar operator and a flight crew man

In recent years, the FBI said, he has traveled in a number of foreign countries.

born at Puerto Castilla, Honduras, of a Honduran mother and a father of German extraction, had been trained as a radar operator and flight crew member with the U.S. Army Air Corps in World War II

The Federal Aviation Administration said that the gunman told authorities he could fly the Eastern Airlines plane himself and would do so "if there was any hanky-panky.”

Crew members said the man told them he didn’t want the extortion money for his own use and indicated it might be used by a foreign power. “He talked like there was another country and he wanted the money for a cause,” said the 52-year-old Hendershott.

The hijacker also had six parachutes, two bush knives, two jump suits, two crash helmets, food, drink and cigarettes delivered to him when he freed the 48 passengers and one stewardess in Washington.

Transmissions overheard on airport radio frequencies indicated the hijacker had asked for evening newspapers and five stimulant tablets.

The hijacker was said to have asked if the 727 was equipped with X-band radar and spoke knowledgeably of radar and aircraft as well as the geography of Central and South America.

The man had demanded the ransom be paid in bills of $100, $500 and $1,000. But Eastern Airlines paid it in $100 bills because the larger ones are scarce, and couldn’t be found on short notice. After releasing 48 passengers and a stewardess at Dulles, the man forced the plane to take off. But he then renewed his demand for larger-denomination bills, and forced the plane to circle the Washington area for almost 5 hours while airline officials rummaged through Eastern banks to find enough of the big- denomination bills.

Although men were seen with suitcases or bundles entering and leaving the hijacked plane, in a remote corner of a Dulles runway miles from the main airport building, it was not immediately known whether the hijacker received a substitute ransom bundle or an additional $300,000

"He says he wants the airplane empty," the relay plane said of the demand for a new plane. "He says to remind you that he has a satchel full of high explosives with detonators, and if anything happens he will ignite it and both planes and all parties involved will go." "You can assure him we have no hanky panky planned." the tower told him.

An Eastern official, who asked not to be identified, admitted later that the change of planes was designed to perhaps give authorities some opportunity to overtake the hijacker. Before he left the first craft, he warned the watching officials,

He then flew south to Merida, Mexico and on to Honduras.

FROM NEW ORLEANS the plane flew south, landing at Merida, Mexico, a city on the coast of the Gulf of Mexico. After refuelling it continued south over Central America.

After a change of planes in New Orleans, the hijacker jumped out through the rear door of the plane at a low altitude and a comparatively slow 200 miles an hour, just as Cooper had.

The plane was flying at 9,000 feet over the mountains of British Honduras when the man walked to the rear section of the plane and drew the cabin curtain closed behind him.

The hijacker leaped from the trijet at 9,000 feet as Hendershott reduced speed over the highlands of Honduras.

he stayed away from the second floor apartment where his family lives for months — even years at a time Hahneman, 49, has been charged by the FBI with hijacking an Eastern Airlines jet just after it took off from the Allentown - Easton - Bethlehem Airport on May 6.

Mrs. Hahneman's father, described the hijacking suspect as "a cocky fellow" whom he didn't approve of. The father- in-law said he threw Hahneman out of his house in Easton 17 years ago.

Small said Hahneman “never had any friends here, and no one ever knew him. He’d go away again.” Another neighbor. Mrs. Richard Mettes, said, “I hardly even saw the man. But I always thought it strange that he would allow his wife to raise those two kids by herself ”

A spokesman said the suspect had traveled widely and lived in a number of foreign countries. His last known employment was with Philco in Vietnam.

Hahneman's next-door neighbor, said Hahneman was "brilliant, well versed on technical things." Small said he talked with the accused hijacker a great bit eight years ago and found that Hahneman didn't socialize much and didn't care lo talk about "Mundane" subjects, like baseball. He did talk about foreign trips, like to Cambodia, Honduras and Guatemala, Small said.

Hahneman entered the guilty plea in U.S. District Court here Monday. Three other charges— kidnaping, extortion and interference with an airline crew were dismissed. 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

3 hours ago, CooperNWO305 said:

The closest resemblance to the witness sketch I’ve seen is William J. Smith. Cary Grant and Rod Serling look like it too, but they are not good candidates for the crime. 

It is an amazing likeness, especially the eyes..

credit for using the CORRECT suspect image. 

 

Hahneman image 1972, his weight fluctuated greatly causing his face to change so much that he looks like different people, he did have that turkey neck, curly/marceled hair. I have a pic of Hahneman where he has his hair slicked back,, a witness thought Cooper had his hair slicked back and Mitchell thought there was something unnatural about his hair.

Edited December 22, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

3 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Well, one thing is certain. He pulled off the hijacking to Honduras. That is proven. There is a good likeness between the Cooper sketch and Hahneman. Anything else, I'm just not sure. One of the problems with the Cooper sketch and the description of Cooper himself is that it could fit so many people. And no one spotted any distinguishing features such as scars, tattoos, a mole, something unique. Frankly, it could fit tens of thousands of people. Probably more. 

Anything else, not sure,  - are you serious?

Did you read my posts...

 

Hahneman,

matches the crime.

matches the physical description and clothing.

matches the profile, an intelligent loner estranged from his family.

ex-military with aviation experience.

an electrical (radar) engineer.

smoker.

and more... I am keeping the good stuff

 

That is just a start, it doesn't prove he was Cooper but I don't think we can put any suspect on the plane without the FBI forensics. We can only get a suspect close.

 

Edited December 22, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

6 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

What will you do with the 'good stuff'? I'm as open minded as the next guy, and sure...I have had to hold back a few things myself. But you aren't presenting much beyond a resemblance. 

Your guy lived on the east coast. Cooper smoked Raleighs, while your guy demanded two cartons of his favorite cigarettes, a different brand. 

The possible accent is a tough one to get around. Your guy was born in Honduras and lived there until he was 38 years old before coming to the United States. This implies he almost certainly had a Hispanic accent anyone would have noticed. Maybe that's how the FBI knew right away he wasn't Cooper. 

Clearly you didn't read my posts..

Stop wasting my time.

[FLYJACK 654]

9 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

What about the Hispanic accent? It was the first thing I thought of when I heard Hahneman was from Honduras. You want to name him as possibly Cooper. Okay, fine. Tell me how someone who was born in, and lived in Honduras for 38 years before he moves to the US doesn't have a Hispanic accent you can spot the second he speaks. 

This is a very large strike against your suspect. 'No discernible accent'. 'Possibly from the Midwest'. Ticket agent heard him speak. Stewardesses. The crew through the interphone. 

The official language of Honduras is Spanish. Garifuna is also spoken, but that is a mixture of Carib, French, Arawak, about five percent Spanish and ten percent English. Less than three percent of the population speaks any other language exclusively. And you are going to try and convince people that Hahneman sounded like he was from Kansas City or something? 

No wonder the FBI wrote him off, or didn't bother to investigate him beyond a cursory fashion for Cooper. They undoubtedly spoke to him a few times after his arrest, and realized he was as far from Cooper as Fidel Castro is from a Valley Girl.  

I can buy that Cooper was possibly a Canadian. I can't buy the idea that he was from Honduras and managed to bury an accent almost anyone would recognize as Spanish/Hispanic. He was already nearly 40 when he came to America. It's hard to convince people that after only 12 years in the US he managed to shed his entire national identity by that time. He probably spoke like Cheech Marin. 

Really,,

You have no clue what your talking about, your information is 100% wrong..

I posted the correct info, you didn't read it and continue to post false information.

 

It seems you are more interested in posting misinformation than learning the facts.

 

Here is a hint, READ MY POSTS and get your facts straight. You look like a fool posting this nonsense.

I had assumed you would just ignore the facts but figured they are a good primer on Hahneman for others, I know few post here but there are significant (new) views.

Edited December 23, 2019 by FLYJACK

[CooperNWO305 146]

The accent is one of the pieces of "evidence" that sent this case down a path that is hard to come back from.  Early on the narrative became that he was Canadian, due to "no discernible accent" and the whole "negotiable currency" bit.  Parts of the USA have very heavy accents, Boston/NYC/the deep South come to mind.  Others have accents that are not what I'd call heavy, but that do stand out, Chicago, Minnesota, etc.  Then there are parts of the country that just have plain accents, these are often the places that produce newscasters.  These accents are pleasant and easy to understand (I definitely do not have one of those).  These come from states like Kansas, Maryland, Colorado.  But these accents can also come from rural areas in populous states like NY, MA, NJ, IL, etc.  Not everyone from Illinois has a Chicago accent.

If Cooper had an accent, then he certainly would have done as much as he could to hide it, maybe even practicing what he would say, or purposely disguising it.  I think he could have done this with Dennis Lysne the ticket agent, and with Flo.  However, it would have been a lot harder with Tina.  That leads me to speculate a few possibilities.

1.  Tina was in on it somehow, and it was planned for her to say she did not hear anything or see anything.  For someone who spent all that time with him, the amount of info she gave is pretty light.

2.  Tina was from the same area of the country as Cooper, and therefore his accent did not stand out to her.  It just sounded normal.  This happens a lot.  I don't pick up an accent so much when I go back to places where I've lived, and it's only after I've been gone a  long time that I start to hear it when I meet someone from those areas.

3.  Cooper was a gentleman.  How does one get described as a gentleman? By the way they dress, how they are groomed, how they speak, and what they say/do.  I could walk you into The Bronx, New Jersey, etc. and introduce members from the same family, one who will have a heavy accent, and one who has no accent.  Someone who speaks calmly and has made a point of speaking intelligently could easily not have any accent, even if they were from the Northeast or deep South.

4.  Cooper was actually foreign, and when he learned English, he learned it the perfect way, not through growing up using slang or hanging out on the street.  I don't worry about pronouncing English words perfectly, but in other languages I've studied, I always made sure I sounded out the words the best I could.  Frankly, there are foreigners who speak better English than some of us.  But, it is still very hard to hide a foreign accent.

[FLYJACK 654]

It is Christmas,, 

Merry Christmas to all Cooperites... even Georger.

Here is my gift,,, to put Robert out of his misery.

Hahneman came to the US young and HAS NO ACCENT. I already posted this info. READ MY POSTS. His father was a US born American citizen so he gained US citizenship at birth (via declaration and naturalization process in effect at that time). 

He lived in Easton PA with his family 50 miles from Tina. At the time of NORJAK Hahneman was estranged from his family for many years and no longer lived there but he paid the bills.

I DO NOT believe Tina was "in on it" per se, but she is hiding something, even Flo said that.

Stewardess Madeleine Willet said the man (Hahneman) "spoke English without an accent, but he looked Latin American.”

 

FBI files. Hahneman

Edited December 23, 2019 by FLYJACK

[ParrotheadVol 70]

On 12/14/2019 at 12:37 AM, RobertMBlevins said:

 

Robert, when did Lyle provide you with this picture?

[FLYJACK 654]

34 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

About Hahneman:  Okay...I see Flyjack has a witness saying that Hahneman didn't speak with an accent. I also see no witnesses in news reports saying he DID. So, okay...maybe he did not. 

There is conflicting info on him that is hard to reconcile. He doesn't show up in WW2 enlistment records, yet some reports say he was in the Army. You can usually get the enlistment record, sometimes even the DD214 publicly. But...(there's always a 'but', huh?) it's possible his records were destroyed completely in the 1973 St Louis fire. Still...you can usually get the enlistment record or something due to the ongoing restoration effort. 

Another conflict is that some reports say he came to the US in 1960. Some don't seem to know WHEN he showed up in the US. That could probably be discovered through Ancestry.com searching on his father's name, William Frederick Hahneman. 

I keep wondering why the FBI never looked at him for Cooper, though. He seems so obvious that they would look, and they had a great many dealings with him, even the US State Dept to an extent due to his surrender in Honduras. Jury is still out with him. 

It isn't just a witness, it is also the FBI that claims NO ACCENT. End of discussion on that matter.

As a child he moved back and forth between the US and Honduras with his family, he permanently moved to the US as a teenager and went to college before entering the US military for WW2. He was on an aircrew for a troop carrier division. His records were destroyed in the 1973 fire.

He rented the Easton Pa home in 1960 for his family, that is not when he came to the US.

The FBI did look at Hahneman for years.

The State Department got involved to get him back from Honduras... he was also a Honduran citizen and there was no legal extradiction at that time, he could have stayed there. However, he volunteered to return to the US.

 

The public info out there on Hahneman is very very poor and misleading, half truths, incomplete, contextual distortions and misinformation.. maybe that is intentional.

 

BTW.. the dumbest question I've had was if Hahneman had any parachute experience from Eric Elvis Ulis. Now that is hard to top.

Edited December 23, 2019 by FLYJACK

[CooperNWO305 146]

The 1973 fire in St. Louis really wiped out a lot of history.  However, the remaining records are not all digitized yet, and certainly were not in the 80s or 90s. It’s not like the FBI could have cross checked a lot like prints or airborne training unless they had a specific suspect in mind. Maybe now it is easier. DNA is a different story. If there were no restrictions, the DNA from the tie could be fed into a number of systems, military and civilian (23 and Me). Maybe there would be a close match. Those cigarette butts may still be out there too. 

[FLYJACK 654]

39 minutes ago, CooperNWO305 said:

The 1973 fire in St. Louis really wiped out a lot of history.  However, the remaining records are not all digitized yet, and certainly were not in the 80s or 90s. It’s not like the FBI could have cross checked a lot like prints or airborne training unless they had a specific suspect in mind. Maybe now it is easier. DNA is a different story. If there were no restrictions, the DNA from the tie could be fed into a number of systems, military and civilian (23 and Me). Maybe there would be a close match. Those cigarette butts may still be out there too. 

The FBI did look up Hahneman's military record in 1972... before the fire

I may get those files from them.. within 2 years.

Hahneman claimed WW2, Korea and Vietnam, but he may have been a contractor later.

He did re-enlist after his service in WW2.

Edited December 24, 2019 by FLYJACK

[ParrotheadVol 70]

9 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I will answer. But you have to tell me why you want to know first. Then I will do as you ask. 

Try to understand...I get these folks sometimes who drop by from the Cooper Forum occasionally trying to play 'gotcha' with me. I'm not going for that anymore. Just give me a reasonable reason you want to know the exact date and I will look in our mailing records and tell you, no problem. 

Robert, I don't need an exact date and you pretty much provided the answer anyway. It didn't need to be that specific, and just so you know, I'm not real concerned about being on anyone's "trusted list". 

As far as why I wanted to know, it's pretty simple. My understanding is that you were told by a witness that KC smoked Raliegh cigarettes. I was just curious as to why Lyle didn't show you this "evidence" early on. It just gives the appearance of "manufactured" evidence on the part of Lyle. Seems he would have shown you these things at the beginning, if he had them. That's all, not a big deal at the end of the day.

[Andrade1812 51]

Fly-- Which of the FBI FOIA files deals specifically with Hahneman?

[FLYJACK 654]

On 6/4/2019 at 12:48 PM, FLYJACK said:

Dan Cooper comic research….

I dug deep into the Dan Cooper comics and found some amazing things… 

Albert Weinberg was in Seattle and Florida in the mid 1960’s. He was researching stories for his comics.. his method was to draw from reality so he took many many pictures..

He did write a comic based around Seattle, not the well known L’AFFAIRE MINOS but it was OBJECTIF JUMBO that took place all around Seattle. There are many Seattle images in this comic.

I also found an airplane that matched a real plane which belonged to an American pilot on the east coast. That plane was kept in Europe. I investigated that  pilot and his circle for any possible connection to NORJAK but didn’t find anything.

One idea was that the hijacker may have met Albert Weinberg while he was in the US researching his comic, I didn’t find anything there.

But the most interesting thing I found was an image in another Dan Cooper comic of Lake Tipsoo in Wa State.. Albert Weinberg was there, took a photo and used it in one of his comics. Notice it matches Bruce’s Mountain News banner…. of Mt Rainier.

 

Finally, I discovered that the Dan Cooper comics were published in many languages including Spanish. 

There was a Mexican/Spanish publication of the Dan Cooper comic.. Considering there was a legitimate hijacker Spanish/Mexico connection this may be significant.

Conclusion, was the hijacker inspired by the Dan Cooper comic,, NO.. was he aware of them… maybe?

Last two Comic page images are the Mexican/Spanish Dan Cooper comic edition from 1967.. 

The last image is Lake Tipsoo Wa... from another Dan Cooper comic.

I already posted this..

DAN COOPER Comics were published in Mexico in Spanish by a Mexican publisher. 

The focus was a French Canadian with no accent.. now a Spanish Latin American with no accent is in play. 

1967 Mexican/Spanish version on LEFT, Belgian/French version on RIGHT.

 

 

Edited December 27, 2019 by FLYJACK

[CooperNWO305 146]

I personally was never a fan of the whole Dan Cooper comic book theory, but I guess you never know, and when following a trail, sometimes it opens your mind up to other things, and you find something else you did not know you were looking for.

My thoughts on the Dan Cooper comic:

The comic came out around 1954, outside of the USA.  We suspect that DB Cooper was in his 40's or even 50's in 1971, which means he was born between say 1920 and 1930, so at the youngest, he would have been around 24 when that comic came out, still kind of old to be reading comic books (unlike today where a lot of ages are into comics due to the movies).  And, he would probably have been non-American, because an American would likely have picked an American comic book hero.

It was an FBI agent who came up with the idea.  Maybe he used info that the public did not have and that's where he got the idea for the Dan Cooper comic book connection.  However, I think it is just grasping at straws.

The comic book connection does make me think of Leonardo DiCaprio's character in Catch Me If You Can and how he used comic book characters as aliases.  (That was in the movie, but I don't remember it being in the book).

There are so many little things that may be lost to history, like "Why did you choose Dan Cooper?"

My guess is he knew what name he was going to use, so therefore he planned it in advance.  Dan and Cooper could be from totally different parts of his life and could be two different people, or parts of others.  I believe he knew someone in his life named Dan Cooper.

 

 

[FLYJACK 654]

I have researched the Dan Cooper comics extensively, one thing to understand is that they weren't just for children. They became increasingly sophisticated, very technical and political. The author was well connected and respected in military circles globally. A big audience was non-english active military and ex military. Don't assume it was only read by children because it was a comic.

Having said that, I do NOT believe "Cooper" was inspired by the Dan Cooper character. He may have read it, been aware of and maybe even used the name. 

 

There was a F W Hahneman who worked for the IGY program in Guatemala, he was an electrical engineer. Herge the publisher of TINTIN and Dan Cooper (which also ran in TINTIN).. was a sponsor of the IGY and created the logo for the antarctic expedition. They covered many of the IGY themes in their publications. This may be just a coincidence. The IGY was a big deal... it was the future. 

 

I have also found two connections between the name "Cooper" and another, a person named "Daniel Cooper" to Hahneman.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

11 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

EDIT: I have a response from the admin at that Facebook page, regarding any Spanish version of the Cooper comic. Yes...some issues were translated for the Spanish buying public starting in 1968. For sale IN Spain. There is nothing about the comic being sold in Mexico or South/Central America. That's all I know. 

Robert,

Again, you didn't read my post.

Go back and READ IT.

DAN COOPER COMICS WERE PUBLISHED IN MEXICO IN SPANISH BY A MEXICAN PUBLISHER... 

 

Front page.. back page

 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

Tie particles...

"Mrs. Hahneman and the sons indicated on occasion that Hahneman was "involved in electronics.", "He would always take apart the toaster or the TV when he was home and put it together again," she said."

"Her husband apparently maintained his passion for working abroad on electronics projects. "He went all over. I think he's been in Vietnam and Korea," Jane Albus claimed. She also said that Hahneman maintained a bank account for his family."

"Mr. Hahneman, born July 5, 1922, at Puerto Castilla, Honduras, was an American citizen who served as an aircraft radar technician in the Air Force in World War II In recent years, the bureau said, he has traveled in a number of foreign countries."

"The witnesses reported that the hijacker said during the flight that his father was of German extraction and was buried in New Orleans, that his mother was Honduran and that he was employed by the Philco Corp. The hijacker was said to have asked if the 727 was equipped with X-band radar and spoke knowledgeably of radar and aircraft as well as the geography of Central and South America. On the basis of this information, the FBI found a Frederick William Hahneman who had served in the Army ..., as a radar operator and a flight crew man. The records noted Hahneman's father died in New Orleans. Passport office records showed Hahneman was born July 5, 1922, at Puerto Castilla, Honduras, and his occupation had been radio, electrical and communications engineer. Five of the Eastern crew members picked him out positively as the hijacker when shown Hahneman's photograph along with those of other while males.”

Edited December 29, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

The grocery store break in was "roughly" 10 miles S of the dam.

 

 

 

This yellow line ends exactly 10 miles S of the dam. It is about 1.5 miles E of the flightpath (black line). I can't find any stores close to that spot at that time. These are estimates, there are stores a few miles away.

 

 

Edited December 29, 2019 by FLYJACK

[FLYJACK 654]

The Mexican Spanish Dan Cooper comic was printed in Mexico, had a Mexican distributor and notes classification tariffs for "Correo Argentina" that is the State owned Argentinian postal Co...

That indicates the Spanish Dan Cooper comic was distributed throughout Latin America.