billvon 2,434 #1 April 9, 2003 Kate Cooper, Dan BC and Tony Domenico will be running a big-way camp at Perris June 26-29. See attachements. I strongly recommend this camp for anyone interested in learning about large-formation skydiving. Kate is one of the best big-way organizers around and has organized a great many record attempts, and more importantly takes safety and education very seriously. Tony is a world-class organizer as well, and of course Dan needs no introduction. Big Way Registration.doc Big Way Announcement.doc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #2 April 10, 2003 Quote I strongly recommend this camp for anyone interested in learning about large-formation skydiving I just got this invitation sent to me by Kate. Do you think she's trying to tell me something?May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #3 April 10, 2003 Quote I just got this invitation sent to me by Kate. Do you think she's trying to tell me something? Hmmm... I got it twice. Does that mean she thinks I'm really good so she really wants me there? Or does it mean that she thinks I really suck and I need to be there? For anyone wanting to do bigways, I highly recommend this camp. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #4 April 10, 2003 I received no invitatipon, much less two! I know I suck, but do you have to rub it in???? My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jmpnkramer 0 #5 April 10, 2003 well if your profile is correct then at 15 jumps you need to work on some airtime first. Tunnel time would even be better. I know your not serious though about wanting to do a Big-Way at your level. You should come visit the Hill though b/c we organize lots of fun stuff. It doesn't always work but we have fun. That is the key. It also helps low-time divers learn a lot. Especially when it becomes a zoo. Too bad though because that is an awesome deal for the weekend. If I had the time and money I would be there. One of these days I will make it to the West Coast. It is hard to fit it all in. Blue Skies & Safe Landings!!!! The REAL KRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMER! "HESITATION CAUSES DEATH!!!" "Be Slow to Fall into Friendship; but when Thou Art in, Continue Firm & Constant." - SOCRATES Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
katecooper 0 #6 April 10, 2003 Consider this an open invitation to any person who meets the minimum skill requirements (listed on Bill Von's attachments). No personal invite required, but we are limiting the camp to 80 people. First come first served. It's a great experience whether you have 250 jumps or 7,000+ jumps, and we've had participants in both areas. If you can't play, please feel free to direct others to this posting who may benefit from this course. And you know what, we have FUN too! :-) blue skies kate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #7 April 10, 2003 Karen and I Would love to come Kate, but I started a new job, so taking the time off to travel all the way to CA is a no-no….. Next time perhaps…… RémiRemster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #8 April 10, 2003 Hello! I just have a few stupid questions. Will there be something like this offered again this year? How easy is it to find a ride to/from LAX? (I'm under 25, so getting a car will be pretty tough.)There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #9 April 10, 2003 Quote How easy is it to find a ride to/from LAX? Fly in/out of Ontario if you can; it's closer to the dz. Kim White will pick up/drop you off at LAX for around $50 each way (not sure of that price); check with Perris manifest for her contact info. Val, you would LOVE this camp! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #10 April 10, 2003 Quote Fly in/out of Ontario if you can; it's closer to the dz. I can get tickets from Spirit Air for $160 to LAX, though! Quote Kim White will pick up/drop you off at LAX for around $50 each way (not sure of that price); check with Perris manifest for her contact info. Okay! Thanks! Quote Val, you would LOVE this camp! That's what I'm thinking, too! This isn't the same one you went to last year, was it? Was that the Airspeed one? I had to miss that one this spring.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #11 April 10, 2003 Quote This isn't the same one you went to last year, was it? It is, just at a different dz. Worth every penny! I just may be there for this one too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,647 #12 April 10, 2003 QuoteKate Cooper, Dan BC and Tony Domenico will be running a big-way camp at Perris June 26-29. See attachements. I strongly recommend this camp for anyone interested in learning about large-formation skydiving. Kate is one of the best big-way organizers around and has organized a great many record attempts, and more importantly takes safety and education very seriously. Tony is a world-class organizer as well, and of course Dan needs no introduction. See the thread in the "Relative Work" forum on being cut from a load. Apparently many "experts" believe you can learn big way skills better by doing 2, 3 and 4-way jumps, and that big way camps are just there to make money. I disagree, but who am I to say?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Albatross 0 #13 April 10, 2003 No one says that you can learn all the big way skills frying 4-way or in the tunnel. I am one of the biggest proponants of body flight and flying the "Mantis". I will say to anyone that good 4-way fliers can fly their bodies anywhere and are capable of doing good big-ways. The argument was that a 4-way skills could be tranfered to big-way but that big way skills didn't translate back. Ask Kate, Tony and Dan about this. I am sure that they will agree that a good 4-way flier can fly their slot ina big way but that a big way flier might not be able to flya 4-way slot.Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
katecooper 0 #14 April 10, 2003 Actually, I've found that it's EASIER to teach a good 4 way flyer to do big ways than a good big way flyer to do 4 ways, but there is a learning curve none-the-less. I think this has more to do with the good 4 way jumper having had more time with formal training and coaching, and being more open to learning at every level than being "better" than the big way jumper. Even the GO FAST 300 way had a hell of a steep learning curve for some of the team jumpers who hadn't done big stuff before. There was a lot of "dive, float, exit" coaching going on in the tents between jumps. Again, it being easier made the dive succsesful. It's all good, it's all fun. Do it all. kate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,647 #15 April 10, 2003 QuoteNo one says that you can learn all the big way skills frying 4-way or in the tunnel. I am one of the biggest proponants of body flight and flying the "Mantis". I will say to anyone that good 4-way fliers can fly their bodies anywhere and are capable of doing good big-ways. The argument was that a 4-way skills could be tranfered to big-way but that big way skills didn't translate back. Ask Kate, Tony and Dan about this. I am sure that they will agree that a good 4-way flier can fly their slot ina big way but that a big way flier might not be able to flya 4-way slot. Nope - the word used in that thread was "better", nothing to do with translating back. BTW, I believe that being acceptable to the organizer of a big way involves rather more than just flying your slot.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #16 April 10, 2003 QuoteBTW, I believe that being acceptable to the organizer of a big way involves rather more than just flying your slot I think so too. Being known to the organizer as someone who can fly their slot is a big part of it - camps like this one can help someone accomplish that. Experience in other larger formations (i.e. 20-40 ways) is important, especially larger formations that are organized by either the people you're trying to get on big stuff with or by organizers whose opinion the people you're trying to get on with trust. Currency is a big thing; if you're only making 50 jumps a year you really can't expect to be invited on a triple digit skydive. And I'll bet there are some politics too. If a jumper performed well but was an asshole on the ground at the last event you were on, word will get around to other organizers. If you were cut and took it badly, you may not be invited to jump with that organizer again. If you're known as a "one trick pony" - i.e. able to fly only one slot or insisting that you will only fly one slot (diving short or long, floating short or long, base) - you may not be invited on a particular event where those slots are already filled. People who show a big way organizer that they have a burning desire to do big ways through their actions - attending camps, jumping hard, improving their skills, being "seen" - and back that up with discipline and a good attitude on the ground and in the air will be invited on the big stuff. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,434 #17 April 10, 2003 >And I'll bet there are some politics too. If a jumper performed well > but was an asshole on the ground at the last event you were on, > word will get around to other organizers. I wouldn't call that politics, more practicality. Every jumper has airskills, organizational skills, and personality. If his airskills are inadequate or too narrow, of course he gets cut. If his organizational skills are lacking (i.e. he can't get to dirt dives on time, he can't hear criticism or directions because of his ego, he can't accept getting cut) then he gets cut just because you need people who can perform on a dive, and he can't. When personality or other non-performance factors enter into it, then I would start calling it politics. Where someone is from, how they talk, whether they're "hurting the sport," whether they're assholes in general etc are political reasons. They are sometimes considered as well. There are people I just plain don't want to jump with, because dealing with their abrasive personalities takes energy that sometimes I don't have to spare. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
evilivan 0 #18 April 10, 2003 I did one of these a couple of years ago at Eloy and HIGHLY recommend it, it was brilliant experience. Wish I had the time and funds to make it over there for another......"If you can keep your head when all around you have lost theirs, then you probably haven't understood the seriousness of the situation." David Brent Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CDRINF 1 #19 April 12, 2003 Hey Kate! Thanks again for the great (and even the not so great) jumps in Thailand ("Don't hurt Kate!"). I'd love to do one of your camps, but I will have just got back from Korea and owe my wife and son some time after having been gone for a year. Maybe another time. Blue Skies! Chris Reed D-15996 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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