Canopy control and landing patterns

[LookUpHigh 0]

So I have 13 jumps now. And my landing patterns are pretty sloppy. My flare is good, i think i have 9 or 10 real nice stand ups, but almost never where I want to land. I'm tired of bringing corn and soybean back to the packers lol.

How long did it take you to get your canopy control dialed in? What helped you? Any advice?

My confidence isn't really shaken or anything, it's just getting old and I want to get better. Plus safety for myself and others around me is obviously important as hell. Thanks for any helpful responses.

[excaza 1]

Talk to your instructors and ask them to watch your pattern.

[LookUpHigh 0]

Yeah we talked about it and went over some stuff. But I gotta wait until next sunday to put the tools to use. Just curious about other jumpers experiences when they were starting out.

[LookUpHigh 0]

and thanks for the advice! Now that I think about it nothing was mentioned as far as having them watch my pattern, will definitely do that. Maybe get a couple hop-n-pops in at the end of the day just for canopy work.

[catfishhunter 1]

every DZ will have a "spot" that you need to turn at 500' to put you in the peas. Ask your insructor where that is and start practicing.

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

[NWFlyer 2]

Have you tried working with your instructors before the skydive to plan out your pattern? If you're a visual person (like I am) it can help to actually draw out a picture of the landing area and mark on it where you will be when you're in your holding pattern. Where you will be when you turn onto your downwind leg. Where you'll turn onto base. Where you'll turn onto final.

That was something I was required to do for every single student jump, and it helped me quite a bit. Of course, the picture would look different depending on what direction the winds were coming from, and how high they were. At least for me, the actual act of drawing and visualizing it helped quite a bit.

You can also get out to the edge of the landing area and watch a bunch of other people land. Watch how they set up their patterns. Figure out how you'll set up your pattern based on what the winds are doing that day. Again, it's all part of visualizing it and seeing it in your head before you do it.

Your pattern should involve as much (if not more) "dirt diving" as your actual skydive.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[LookUpHigh 0]

yeah we sat down sunday and talked about actually drawing out my landings. It was really helpful. Especially since I rushed into both my jumps that day, the first jump I was in the plane asking which direction the wind is coming from. Thats when I realized I need to check myself before I wreck myself. But from now on the first thing I'm gonna do is check the winds and go for the aerial photo of the DZ with a marker, and also before each jump if the winds have changed. It's tough finding the balance between socializing and getting ready for your next jump. Seems like in skydiving the madness can sometimes outweigh the method. I just need to get my shit together lol.

[JackC1 0]

The best policy is to plan your pattern in advance. Use a standard down wind leg, base leg and final leg left-hand box-pattern. Start by planning where you want to land then work back to exactly where over the ground and at what altitude your final 90 degree turn needs to be in order for you to land where you have decided. Then work back again to where your base leg turn needs to be in order to hit your final turn at the correct altitude and position. Then work back again to where and at what altitude you need to enter your pattern on the down wind leg in order to hit your base leg turn exactly right.

Once you've got the plan sorted out, go and jump and fly your pattern and see where you end up at each turn and where you land. On the second jump, you can correct your turn points so that you hit your landing point bang on. Altitudes are king here. If you find you hit your altitude too soon (or too late) correct your distance flown on the next jump so your turns are at the correct altitude in the right spot. Do not get tempted to make your last turn lower in order to hit your turn spot over the ground (unless it is more dangerous not to turn). Always think ahead to where this flight path will lead you and what obstacles will be in your way.

The most important turn is the last one onto final. If this one is in the correct position at the correct altitude you will land exactly where you decided. Each previous turn can be used to fine tune your way points so your last turn is in the correct spot.

Once you've figured out how much altitude your canopy loses over a given distance, you should be able to judge the required distances and put your turn points in the right place to fly a consistent box pattern every time and land where you want to. If the wind is coming from a different direction, it is easy to rotate your box pattern around so it works from any direction. You do not have to fly around on full drive all the time either. Use your toggle range to regulate your progress. But be careful here, suddenly going into deep brakes in crowded airspace will get you no friends at all.

Don't be tempted to rush this process, it can take a few jumps to dial it in especially as the wind conditions change but when you've got it down you should find your accuracy has improved dramatically.

Remember, the order of importance at flare time is to have your wing level, flying into a clear and open area, flare evenly and at the correct height, into wind.

And get coaching, preferably on a well regarded canopy course from a reputable instructor.

[DARK 0]

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every DZ will have a "spot" that you need to turn at 500' to put you in the peas. Ask your insructor where that is and start practicing.

-waiver-someone has already said talk to your instructors and if you think you want to follow my advice you should double check it with your instructors

Not every dropzone will have this 'spot' as mine dosnt and its not the spot that you turn onto final thats meant to be a constant. Doing it the way you describe dosnt account for the winds at all so it wont be very accurate.

having the altitudes you turn onto each leg as a constant is a more accurate way imo.

the more experience you get the more accurate you get because you build up more and more sight pictures so you know what is about to happen faster and therefore can react to it faster which improves your accuracy obviously.

pick the spot you want to land on and in your minds eye you draw a perfect pattern from that spot to were you are.

be aware that on a high wind day you will have a lot of push on your downwind and very little on final.

you should also keep trying to find that 'spot' on the ground that dosnt move up or down in your field vision. t they probably talked about it in your first jump course.

finally if on every jump you pick a very small area (dosnt have to be the peas in fact depending on traffic that might be the worst place to try and land) to land in and you put effort into making that spot safely using all possible inputs from the time you know you have a good canopy to landing your canopy skills and accuracy will progress way faster than most people with your experience who are usually just happy to plf somewhere on the dz

[LookUpHigh 0]

Thanks man, I like the way you suggested starting with the exact point you wish to land on, and then working back from there. I'm going to try that when I draw it out. That was a great response and I appreciate it! I will certainly be reffering back to that from time to time.

[LookUpHigh 0]

Yeah i've never heard of that. I will keep it in mind though for when I get better. I'm sure my instructors will immediately just say stick with the 3 point pattern for 1000-600-300.

I've read about that spot that doesn't move up or down, I tried a couple times but the wind was a different direction then usual so I was a little more nervous and tried to keep my focus on the pattern, but I'm really wanting to be able to find that spot. I need more practice.

[DARK 0]

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Yeah i've never heard of that. I will keep it in mind though for when I get better. I'm sure my instructors will immediately just say stick with the 3 point pattern for 1000-600-300.

I've read about that spot that doesn't move up or down, I tried a couple times but the wind was a different direction then usual so I was a little more nervous and tried to keep my focus on the pattern, but I'm really wanting to be able to find that spot. I need more practice.

you can see it from up high when you are flying straight and level so you dont ahve to only be looking for it on final. obviously the spot you see when you are up high is were you would land if you kept flying straight and level but it will help you know what to look for

[LookUpHigh 0]

yeah, i need to start looking way earlier then. all the things you need to do and look for can be somewhat overwhelming at first, so im sure this will get easier as i go. i really want to learn.

[JackC1 0]

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yeah, i need to start looking way earlier then.

That's the key. Good canopy control and accuracy starts much earlier then people realize. I always have a flight plan before I get on the plane, and as soon as I'm open I'm trying to put that plan into operation, judging where I am, where I need to be at each stage and where everyone else is. With a bit of practice, not only can you be accurate, but you can also figure out what the landing order is going to be and how you can fit into it safely. But only if you start thinking about landing at the earliest opportunity. Spiralling and goofing around is fun and all that, but it means nothing if you don't keep an eye on what's really important.

[LookUpHigh 0]

Good deal, i appreciate the helpful advice bud! It means alot and I'll be sure to remember how helpful you guys were when I'm an experienced skydiver giving advice to some newbie. This is a safe thing that can turn deadly very fast, so helpful advice without talking down to me is appreciated immensely!

[JackC1 0]

No worries mate. I discovered early on that accuracy was your friend, especially where I jump as it's often like a swamp outside the main landing area. I got pretty sick of scraping mud of all my kit. One big part of that for me was realising that the quickest way to get yourself in the shit is to make decisions too late. The earlier you make a good decision, the less likely you are to find yourself low, over a crappy landing area and running out of options.

I have to say the best money I ever spent in skydiving was on canopy courses. I would thoroughly recommend getting on a couple if you can.

[popsjumper 2]

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every DZ will have a "spot" that you need to turn at 500' to put you in the peas. Ask your insructor where that is and start practicing.

True enough for constant wind conditions.
Not true at all in reality.

OP needs to consider wind conditions, direction and speed. when evaluating turn points.

The effects of winds are covered in the SIM. The OP needs to review that with the instructors.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[Shredex 0]

You can spot your landing on your base approach. Just look for the spot that isn't moving and follow it's radius to your side(to the landing spot) and turn in when its on target. If you're a bit high, do some S-turns. If you miss, it's not a huge deal. You've landed 10/13 jumps, thats WAY better then most. My buddy didn't get a stand up landing till his 20th jump. Got his A-license on the 25th.

You can practice the approach and spotting at home on the computer if you play D3 BASE/Skydiving simulator.
http://www.flokas.de/baseforum/viewforum.php?f=50&sid=b255bcad60856cf59985bfef483eb375

NOTE: It is a game and not super accurate but you can learn how to spot that special spot in first person view while playing it.

[monkycndo 0]

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If you're a bit high, do some S-turns.

S turns are only to be used when you have screwed the pouch and have to land in a specific spot to keep from getting injured. Once you are in the pattern, fly a consistent and predictable pattern. Just like everyone else should be doing. By their nature, S turns screw up the pattern for everyone else because no one but you knows what the hell you are about to do. The jumper behind you now has to adjust to an obstacle that you have now become by flying S turns across the pattern. Never a good thing to do.

If you are going to overshoot your target and not get hurt doing so, overshoot and adjust on your next landing. But do not S turn.

50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

[Shredex 0]

Guess I'm just used to jumping out last and pulling the highest :P

[labrys 0]

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every DZ will have a "spot" that you need to turn at 500' to put you in the peas.

Not true.

At my home DZ, the "spot" is at 476 feet and it only gets you within 4 feet of the peas in wind conditions between 3-76 MPH on hot days.

Owned by Remi #?

[riggerrob 558]

IOW: S-turns work great if you 100 percent certain that you are last person landing at a single-Cessna (e.g. 4 seater) DZ.

OTOH S-turns can hopeless;y mess up the landing pattern when there are 20 - or more - canopies in the air at a large (e.g. Twin Otter) DZ.

[Remster 24]

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Guess I'm just used to jumping out last and pulling the highest :P

Learn not to use that crutch.

Remster

[DocPop 1]

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How long did it take you to get your canopy control dialed in?
What helped you?
Any advice?

To answer your specific questions:

1. I don't know yet - I am still working on it! Seriously - the variables (winds, traffic, density altitude, type of canopy etc) are infinite and it is constant work to be accurate.

2. Canopy coaching. Having a canopy plan BEFORE boarding the airplane including EXACT checkpoints for location and altitude and then debriefing myself about why I did not hit them and what I need to do next time to improve. Practice - lots!

3. Don't get disheartened. Pick a small target (eg. "I want to land on the patch of pale grass at x", rather than "I hope to land in landing area A"). Practice - lots!

"The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls."

~ CanuckInUSA

[adamhildreth 0]

Once you can tell where you will land (the spot that doesn't move) or where you're in the box, I found one of the keys was understanding what you can do with your canopy to 'sort out' the situation on downwind, base and final. It's great knowing you're going to be long or have committed too early but then doing something about it is even better.

I've found Brian Germain's book great for talking through all the concepts of canopy flight, but obviously I talked to an instructor before trying any of the methods.