Shoulder Pain From Hand Deploy

[kkeenan 13]

I've recently had shoulder surgery to repair torn Rotator Cuff on the right side. Prior to the surgery, I was doing a lot of RW jumps and a lot of CRW. I'm having trouble seeing what would cause the stress that would result in this injury. Usually, it is caused by repetitive upward / outward pushing. All of the forces on the arms in CRW seem to be downward pulling of risers and toggles. The only force in the problem direction seems to be deploying a pilot chute from a BOC pouch. I'm wondering if very many folks have had issues from this. All jumpers, regardless of discipline, deploy pilot chutes. So, it would seem that more would have problems if this were the cause. It may be that carrying gear bags through airports causes more damage.

When I showed my Physical Therapist the motion used to deploy a pilot chute, he thought that was the dumbest thing he could imagine, and said that some kind of handle on the front of the harness would make more sense. That cracked me up, and I told him that the method he described had been discarded years ago and the current method was considered a revolutionary improvement.

Everyone has different physical makeup, and maybe I just have crappy rotator cuff muscles.

Kevin K.

_____________________________________
Dude, you are so awesome...
Can I be on your ash jump ?

[ufk22 32]

torn rotator cuff is pretty common, especially for someone who is OLD.

This is the paradox of skydiving. We do something very dangerous, expose ourselves to a totally unnecesary risk, and then spend our time trying to make it safer.

[parachutist 1]

It's common, but usually the person in pain is a TI with thousands of drogue pitches. Maybe those fat CRW pilot chutes in BOC pouches + stuffed containers required as much force as a drogue to toss

Chris

[PiLFy 0]

"I'm having trouble seeing what would cause the stress that would result in this injury. Usually, it is caused by repetitive upward / outward pushing."

That's not the only cause. This Sport is hard on shoulders. For example, I very rarely do linked exits for this reason, & won't even attempt free fly. Rough tumbles on the ground from the occasional bad landing. Colliding w/other Jumpers in freefall. Calcium deposits on the Acromion. It all adds up, over time. Young Guys in their Twenties get them, too. It happens.

Follow your P/T exercise regimen, & strengthen that joint. That will be your best protection.

[airtwardo 6]

I think there's something to that and have been saying so for years.

Back in the early 80's I had a BOC pull-out on a 1st gen wonderhog...'seemed' like a good idea at the time, but I could tell I was putting strain on my shoulder I never had before.

Back then I was pretty athletic...I boxed & played football in college, I fought tournament Karate on a national level.

I knew my body & knew what was hurting - when & why.

Body mechanics kinda dictates that reaching, twisting, grabbing & pulling motion was never considered when the blueprints were drawn up on humans...Even though 'some' things CAN be done as far as sports goes - they tend to wear out the machinery pretty fast.

Had a coach in college always preach about 'natural motion' being faster & stronger with less injuries...natural motion isn't what comes naturally - it's using the body in the way it's designed. Some guys had to learn how to run all over again...best example is reversing your hands and swinging a baseball bat.

You CAN do it, but your wrists & elbows won't last too long - same thing with the BOC. - IMO- anyway.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[jonstark 8]

Tore up my shoulder by getting thrown into the doorframe of a stalling Lodestar in 77. Then shredded it by holding onto a borrowed pullout too long in 81. Went BOC but prefer bellyband. Finally destroyed shoulder by shoveling snow in 08. Wingsuiting makes it feel like it's on fire. Youch! Funny though... shoveling snow is the exercise that now makes it feel strong and stable. Wanna come up and see how good it makes your shoulder feel Kevin? Good PT and I won't charge you... much.

jon

[ryoder 1,391]

PiLFy

For example, I very rarely do linked exits for this reason, & won't even attempt free fly.

I was on a dive immediately behind a woman who was part of a linked 4-way RW base. On exit, her right shoulder was dislocated, so she had to use her reserve. For whatever reason, she didn't take both toggles in her left hand, and landed the reserve no-flare, breaking her femur.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[jimmytavino 16]

The shoulder is the MOST complicated and amazing joint in our bodies. but CAN wear out and dislocate or tear.
Could it be from all those earlier years, of closing Pin and cone containers??? or from all the years of door jambin and climbing in and out of planes???

Suddenly we can find ourselves " on the other side of 30 "
Recovery will come... with time. Do the stretches and flexibility excersizes...
You still have ALOT of "toggles and risers " that YOU need to be pulling

[NWFlyer 2]

As others have said... linked exits seem to be my shoulder bugaboo, and you did say you've been doing RW. I only do RW and most of my exits are linked. I organized a fun little six-way at the Eloy boogie this year and we chunked the exit. It sailed out of the Skyvan so beautifully that I was shocked that I had to think about whether I wanted to key it on the hill. When I came down I was raving to everyone "My shoulders didn't hurt, so I knew it was a pretty exit."

I've jumped with a number of organizers who won't do linked exits with random groups because of the potential for shoulder strain, and I can't say I blame them. Chunking an exit is really nice, but if you're not confident in the skill set of the group to do it, freeflying the exit may be better for everyone's arms, and for the success of the dive.

I have some damage in both shoulders, but none of it bad enough to do anything about surgically. My left shoulder had a torn labrum that was repaired surgically 10 years ago (injury happened before I started skydiving, from a blunt force trauma situation). The repair was very well-done, and that shoulder held up beautifully for years, but lately has started to give me some grief - MRI shows a lot of minor breakdown in the various connector points in that shoulder (and that's not my pull arm, so I suspect exits have been a contributing factor there).

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[D22369 0]

***shredded it by holding onto a borrowed pullout too long in 81.




I did the same thing except it was my own rig somewhere around 300 jumps or so.

Shortly after that I changed to a throwout when I purchased my first elliptical canopy and went to a smaller rig with a higher up the back reach
I found the throwout in a spandex pouch to be less strain to pull.

another decade or so I can see using a rol deployed pc.

Roy


getting old sucks

They say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it.

[tkhayes 134]

Put a double pocket on your BOC so you can pack it left or right hand pull. I did it 10 years ago. very simple to do.

[erdnarob 1]

I have had the same problem with my right shoulder, I tore 3 ligaments which took a two hour surgery. After 6 months of physiotherapy I was ready to jump. At the beginning, like in your case, it was a bit painfull to flare in freefall and to throw away my pilot chute but as I continued to do my physiotherapy alone with specified exercices, after a while, my shoulder condition returned to the normal with no pain at all. Just let the time doing the complete healing. It can take a year or two. However I agree with your physical therapist that the move in order to throw away a pilot chute is awkward though it doesn't require a lot of force (about 2-3 lbs). Be patient. I am suprised anyway with your physical therapist attitude since you need to adapt to your rig. Probably if you had seen a physical therapist in a sport medecine clinic, you would get more understanding.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[Croc 0]

I agree--it is an unnatural motion that begs for an injury.

"Here's a good specimen of my own wisdom. Something is so, except when it isn't so."

Charles Fort, commenting on the many contradictions of astronomy

[kkeenan 13]

I'm wondering if modifying my pull technique would reduce the load on the shoulder. If, after grasping the handle, I put my elbow against the side of the container and then pull the pilot chute by bending the elbow rather than rotating the shoulder. I guess I need to try different methods to see what works. I don't want to go in because of doing some goofy thing to save wear on my shoulder.

Kevin K.

_____________________________________
Dude, you are so awesome...
Can I be on your ash jump ?

[ryoder 1,391]

kkeenan

I'm wondering if modifying my pull technique would reduce the load on the shoulder. If, after grasping the handle, I put my elbow against the side of the container and then pull the pilot chute by bending the elbow rather than rotating the shoulder. I guess I need to try different methods to see what works. I don't want to go in because of doing some goofy thing to save wear on my shoulder.

Kevin K.

I've heard TI's promote that method.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[faulknerwn 36]

Also where is your pc on your body? Being vertically challenged as well as jumping Racers which seem to be longer and skinnier than many rigs, my BOC is down more at my hip. I see a lot of the tiny rigs especially on taller guys where the BOC is farther up their back and would seem to be far more difficult to pull.

And I don't think its a CRW pc problem - we can just leave it mostly hanging out because we aren't worried about a premature :-)

And I have known other jumpers who seem to think that the location of the BOC is problematic for their shoulder.

[grue 1]

faulknerwn

Also where is your pc on your body? Being vertically challenged as well as jumping Racers which seem to be longer and skinnier than many rigs, my BOC is down more at my hip. I see a lot of the tiny rigs especially on taller guys where the BOC is farther up their back and would seem to be far more difficult to pull.

Huh, that's an interesting point. Just another reason for me to enjoy my bigass rig.

cavete terrae.

[flyingdrinkard 0]

I partially tore my rotator cuff in high school and never had it repaired, just went through PT to strengthen the remaining two cuff muscles I have. After a long day of jumping mine will sometimes be a little sore. This sport definitely puts strain on it. I'm 22 by the way.

[jdobleman 0]

With over 10K pilot chute deployments, at least 1k drogue throws, I keep waiting for the eventual rotator cuff surgery to come around. One thing I do when working out at the gym is to get some of the rubber stretch handles and practice the throw gesture, since it's not a normal human movement. Seems to keep me going. Also use two and lean forward when I want to stay toned up for the occasional wing suit flight.

madjohn

Main goals in life: Be on the "Jumpers Over Eighty" (JOE) World Record and attend the Lost Prairie Boogie once after I'm gone.

[erdnarob 1]

I highly recommend you to have a surgery. Time could not be able to fix the problem. Before my shoulder problem (including 3 torn ligaments), I thought that the most fragile part of the human articulations was the knee. I was wrong since I discover that in a shoulder, there is no hollow/ball bone connection like hips and knee. That allows the shoulder to move and rotate in about all directions. Only the rotator cuff (including different muscles and ligaments) hold the shoulder in place. You can reinforce the muscles but if one or more ligaments are torn off or extended, time, physiotherapy or exercices will not help. Try to locate a good shoulder specialist surgeon (using Internet or else) and contact him.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[theonlyski 3]

ryoder

***I'm wondering if modifying my pull technique would reduce the load on the shoulder. If, after grasping the handle, I put my elbow against the side of the container and then pull the pilot chute by bending the elbow rather than rotating the shoulder. I guess I need to try different methods to see what works. I don't want to go in because of doing some goofy thing to save wear on my shoulder.

Kevin K.

I've heard TI's promote that method.

I used it as much as I could, helps with hard pulls too.

Both of my shoulders have gone to the point that I was in extreme pain and very worried about the possibility dislocation, so I quit doing tandems, started physical therapy and slowed my jumping. They were fine for a while but have started to give me issues again, so I'm going to get back to the PT exercises I had been doing. Doc said it'll probably be something that I'll have to do forever and I didn't believe him...

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[ALS8 0]

I'm sure your physical therapist has recommended so, but after a jump definitely put a cold compress on your shoulder. You want to reduce any inflammation that may have been gained and it will also help ease the pain. I know of a shoulder wrap called BFST (blood flow stimulation therapy). It promotes blood flow to the injured area, bringing nutrients and added elasticity/lubrication with it. Post op it will speed up the recovery process and will just make the area less stiff and sore. Circulation is always beneficial. It's actually good to use something like this before the jump.....get lots of blood flow. This will prevent further damage. Hope this info helps. I use the back one myself and it works wonders for me.
http://www.kingbrand.com/Rotator_Cuff_Treatment.php?REF=46PV5