The future of EVs

[SkyDekker 1,123]

5 hours ago, kallend said:

Disagree.  Sales tax even gets trust-funders with inherited wealth and crooks with illegal income.  There are too many loopholes in income tax.

Who remembers that Mitt Romney made nearly $22 Million in 2010, but paid less than 14 percent in taxes, a smaller % than his secretary.

How much does sales tax have to rise to replace income taxes? This will disproportionally benefit the rich or those with high incomes and likely punish those with low to medium incomes.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

6 hours ago, kallend said:

Who remembers that Mitt Romney made nearly $22 Million in 2010, but paid less than 14 percent in taxes, a smaller % than his secretary.

Who even spent time thinking about it? I have no clue how it happened but it could have been as simple as investing capital in job creating depreciable assets and kicking the tax can down the road.

[gowlerk 1,913]

55 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

How much does sales tax have to rise to replace income taxes? This will disproportionally benefit the rich or those with high incomes and likely punish those with low to medium incomes.

Sales taxes are a strange thing. Very unpopular to impose. I remember the fuss over Mulrooney modernizing our hidden production tax and replacing it with the very visible GST. I was very much opposed and I was wrong. Resource rich states and Alberta in Canada have no local sales tax and use it as a promotional gimmick. Most western nations have some form of VAT. Can you imagine ever getting one in the USA?

Edited October 31, 2023 by gowlerk

[SkyDekker 1,123]

46 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Sales taxes are a strange thing. Very unpopular to impose. I remember the fuss over Mulrooney modernizing our hidden production tax and replacing it with the very visible GST. I was very much opposed and I was wrong. Resource rich states and Alberta in Canada have no local sales tax and use it as a promotional gimmick. Most western nations have some form of VAT. Can you imagine ever getting one in the USA?

I am just wondering how the math would work out really. Currently under most income tax schemes the tax burden get's progressively higher when you start making more. Obviously that is not something that can be built into a sales tax scheme, or at least not very easily. So what does the sales tax have to be to replace the income tax, 20%, 30%?

 

And again this disproportionately helps those with higher incomes and hurt those with lower incomes. If I were selfish, I would be all in favour of it, it would free up mass amounts of money for my family. But I can also guarantee that employers will quickly adjust their remuneration going forward.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

8 hours ago, kallend said:

Disagree.  Sales tax even gets trust-funders with inherited wealth and crooks with illegal income.  There are too many loopholes in income tax.

Who remembers that Mitt Romney made nearly $22 Million in 2010, but paid less than 14 percent in taxes, a smaller % than his secretary.

Hi John,

I had not planned on re-writing the tax code for a discussion on here.  I am well aware that going to only an income tax would mean changing a lot of how our taxes are collected.  Which IMO should be accomplished.

And, it is OK to disagree.

Jerry Baumchen

PS)  Your Romney example is just one example of what is wrong with the current tax code.

PPS)  And, the GOP solution is:  House GOP bill would give aid to Israel and cut IRS funding : NPR

 

Edited October 31, 2023 by JerryBaumchen

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi folks,

I doubt that it will take long:  “You really have to get used to it,” said driver James Conner

Oregon’s first electric garbage truck hits Portland streets - oregonlive.com

Jerry Baumchen

 

[brenthutch 383]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2023/08/12/proterra-bankruptcy-electric-buses/
 

Even with billions in subsidies 

[brenthutch 383]

On 10/30/2023 at 8:02 PM, wolfriverjoe said:

Then he pays the import duties.

Contrary to what the Alt-Right wants to believe, the border is ANYTHING BUT 'open'.

Those crazy Alt-right Democrats 

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/05/politics/biden-border-wall/index.html

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi folks,

Shades of 1811:  Swedish dockworkers are refusing to unload Teslas at ports in broad boycott move : NPR

The Ludd Machine-Breaking Riots Occur : History of Information

It did not work for the Luddites and it will not work for these dock workers.

Times, they are a'changing.

Jerry Baumchen

[SethInMI 145]

21 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

it will not work for these dock workers.

from the article you linked, I am not sure it won't. Sweden is 90% union-labor, and the Tesla maint personnel have walked out in a labor dispute, so the rest of the country's workers are refusing to support Tesla.  So sounds like Tesla will have to make a deal to get anywhere in Sweden anytime soon...

Unions seem to be making a comeback these days, at least generating a lot of news.  So I don't follow the connection to the Luddites.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

52 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

from the article you linked, I am not sure it won't. Sweden is 90% union-labor, and the Tesla maint personnel have walked out in a labor dispute, so the rest of the country's workers are refusing to support Tesla.  So sounds like Tesla will have to make a deal to get anywhere in Sweden anytime soon...

Unions seem to be making a comeback these days, at least generating a lot of news.  So I don't follow the connection to the Luddites.

Hi Seth,

They will win the battle; they will lose the war. 

IMO EV's are here to stay; until we figure out some other way of getting ourselves around.

The Luddites destroyed the weaving machines; the factory owners just bought new ones.

Sort of like being a farrier in Detroit in 1910. 

One can try all they want, but they will not stop progress.

Jerry Baumchen

 

 

[ryoder 1,384]

9 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Seth,

They will win the battle; they will lose the war. 

IMO EV's are here to stay; until we figure out some other way of getting ourselves around.

The Luddites destroyed the weaving machines; the factory owners just bought new ones.

Sort of like being a farrier in Detroit in 1910. 

One can try all they want, but they will not stop progress.

Jerry Baumchen

 

 

It is not about EV's; It is about Tesla vs unions.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

On 11/18/2023 at 6:07 PM, ryoder said:

It is not about EV's; It is about Tesla vs unions.

Hi Robert,

I agree that the unions do not like how Musk runs his companies.

We had somewhat of a similar situation here in Portland about 15 - 20 yrs ago.  At that time, about 90% of all vehicles coming into the west coast of the US, came thru the Port of Portland.  The Longshoremen ran the port with an iron fist.  For some reasons that I have never known, they decided to take their time in unloading those vehicles; they did Wildcat strikes, Sick-ins, work slowdowns, etc.  The shipping companies complained to the Port Authority [ that is who the shipping companies had agreements with ].  The Port Authority shrugged and said that they could do nothing.  Within about 3 yrs, almost none of those cars came thru the Port of Portland; they were going to Seattle & Oakland.

I am quite sure that the powers that be for the shipping companies are looking at Oslo & Helsinki as Plan B.

My allusion to the Luddites is because I am of the opinion that these types of things are really only Feel Good Gestures; they are rarely successful.

Time will tell,

Jerry Baumchen

PS)  One result of the Longshoreman's actions were that a lot of their members ended up on unemployment.