Bravo Arizona republicans

[billvon 2,478]

Arizona republicans just voted to expel representative Liz Harris for ethics violation.  She sponsored conspiracy theorist Jacqueline Breger to come to the Arizona House and present a slew of election-denial conspiracies during their investigation of the election, including accusations that governor Katie Hobbs and house speaker Ben Toma were being paid by the Sinaloa cartel.  Harris supported her in these accusations.

Bravo to most of the Arizona republicans in the house for putting integrity and honesty ahead of partisan politics.  More of this could help heal the massive divide in this country between right and left.

[BIGUN 1,112]

Bravo indeed. I go to AZ several times a year to visit guys I served with. We're all moderates and the politics in AZ are so divisive it's not funny. I hope you're right that it's a start towards working together. Now, if we could just get Kari Lake to sit down and STFU; it may go further toward relations.  

[kallend 1,683]

2 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Bravo indeed. I go to AZ several times a year to visit guys I served with. We're all moderates and the politics in AZ are so divisive it's not funny. I hope you're right that it's a start towards working together. Now, if we could just get Kari Lake to sit down and STFU; it may go further toward relations.  

So how are decent, thinking, conservatives going to take back the GOP from the loony and extremist right?

[BIGUN 1,112]

13 minutes ago, kallend said:

So how are decent, thinking, conservatives going to take back the GOP from the loony and extremist right?

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

[kallend 1,683]

8 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, Trump, Giuliani, Sidney Powell have no parallel among the Dems.  Pelosi wasn't in thrall to the most extreme elements of her party when Speaker.  No Dems ever rioted over bogus election fraud claims or put up slates of bogus "electors".

Edited April 13, 2023 by kallend

[wolfriverjoe 1,371]

36 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

Please define "loony and extremist left".

Please give some parallels to MTG, Boebert, Gaetz, Lake and the rest.

How many sexual predators have the "left" condoned and excused.

Cuomo resigned as governor of NY after credible accusations.
Al Franken resigned as Senator from MN after a picture came to light.

The false equivalence of 'the Ds do it too' is disgusting.

Fun fact: 

When Paul Pelosi was attacked, the Rs came up with some incredibly stupid and hateful fantasies about what had happened (I won't call them 'theories' because they have no basis in ANY actual facts).

When Ted Cruz's daughter attempted suicide because the right won't accept her for who she is, the response from the Ds was...

Support. Not hate.

Besides, the 'left' in the US wouldn't even be 'moderate' just about anywhere else in the world. The Ds would actually be right of some of the 'conservative' parties.

[gowlerk 1,956]

46 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

There is an extremist left, but it is not in control of the party and never has been. The whole idea of the D party being in thrall to extremists is a construction of right wing talk show media. See Joe's answer above.

[JoeWeber 2,362]

Just now, BIGUN said:

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

You can not win on this, not even on a skydiving blog. You're a cool dude and a real thinker but your false equivalency bit when it comes to the harms done by the different actors is unsupportable. If you want to call yourself a moderate at least register as an Independent. 

[Phil1111 943]

44 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

You can not win on this, not even on a skydiving blog. You're a cool dude and a real thinker but your false equivalency bit when it comes to the harms done by the different actors is unsupportable. If you want to call yourself a moderate at least register as an Independent. 

You beat me to it. I agree with every word, But AZ is in the process of enacting a new law giving religious exemptions for ANY vaccine mandated by any authority.

In state legislatures in the US over 40% of representatives run unopposed. For 99 legislators in the Tennessee House. They ran unopposed. All due to the USSC giving license to gerrymandering. In the last Tennessee election not one single seat changed hands.

The story that Bill references at the start of this thread is but a ray of light. Upon the plain of darkness that is the death of American democracy. State legislatures protecting guns, stacking the courts and protecting the status quo. All run counter to Bill's applause for one small act.

Sorry to poop on your thread Bill.

Edited April 13, 2023 by Phil1111

[billvon 2,478]

2 hours ago, BIGUN said:

What's the model for for liberals taking back their party from the loony and extremist left?

Same model.

But currently democrats don't have that problem.  When AOC says something dumb (which she does all the time) democrats call her on it.  When a democratic politican is investigated for pedophilia - or if there is even good evidence that he has committed any kind of sex crime - they are gone.  This happened to Franken and Conyers.

When the roles are reversed, republicans defend these people to the bitter end.  MTG has become one of the heroes of the right specifically for saying dumb things, and she is now a party leader - because she "triggers the libs."  The party is defending Matt Gaetz who is under investigation for sex trafficking of underage girls.  When Dennis Hastert confessed to fondling underage boys, Tom Delay wrote to the judge to ask for leniency.  When Trump was accused of sexual assault by almost a dozen women - his ratings went up among republicans.

Both sides certainly have problems, and have people that say and do stupid and criminal things.  Always have, always will.  But the party's responses to them are absolutely not equivalent.  This one case is evidence that that may be changing, and I very much hope it does.  But there's a ways to go.

 

[BIGUN 1,112]

44 minutes ago, billvon said:

Both sides certainly have problems

Bill, 

I really can' t argue with any of your points.  

[gowlerk 1,956]

53 minutes ago, billvon said:

When the roles are reversed, republicans defend these people to the bitter end.

The main reason Liz Harris was expelled was for going too far. By going too far I mean that her attack dog that she lied about included some Rs in her outrageous claims. If she would have only attacked the enemy and not engaged in deliberate friendly fire she would have been given a pass.

[gowlerk 1,956]

11 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Bill, 

I really can' t argue with any of your points.  

You may agree with his points but it is very telling that you chose to quote the one sentence that softens his main thrust in your reply. 

[billvon 2,478]

3 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

The main reason Liz Harris was expelled was for going too far. By going too far I mean that her attack dog that she lied about included some Rs in her outrageous claims. If she would have only attacked the enemy and not engaged in deliberate friendly fire she would have been given a pass.

Perhaps.  But an example of "if you go too far with the lies we won't stand for it" is a good message in any case.

[gowlerk 1,956]

Just now, billvon said:

Perhaps.  But an example of "if you go too far with the lies we won't stand for it" is a good message in any case.

It is a start I suppose. The party is not monolithic in it's beliefs and Harris went after the somewhat more moderate side. And she got smacked down when the majority refused to allow her to drag them to the far extreme with her.

[JerryBaumchen 1,083]

9 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Bravo indeed. I go to AZ several times a year to visit guys I served with. We're all moderates and the politics in AZ are so divisive it's not funny. I hope you're right that it's a start towards working together. Now, if we could just get Kari Lake to sit down and STFU; it may go further toward relations.  

Hi Keith,

Good luck with that; ain't going to happen.

Jerry Baumchen

[billvon 2,478]

3 hours ago, gowlerk said:

It is a start I suppose. The party is not monolithic in it's beliefs . . .

Agreed.  And in some ways a civil war is brewing within the GOP between the Trumpies and the conservatives.  It would be nice if the conservatives won.

[gowlerk 1,956]

Just now, billvon said:

Agreed.  And in some ways a civil war is brewing within the GOP between the Trumpies and the conservatives.  It would be nice if the conservatives won.

It would. Especially because that would discourage far right part of the base. Without them the party might move back towards the centre in an attempt to stay in power. If only moderates could win primaries again. 

[kallend 1,683]

3 hours ago, gowlerk said:

It would. Especially because that would discourage far right part of the base. Without them the party might move back towards the centre in an attempt to stay in power. If only moderates could win primaries again. 

*Sigh* for the days of smoke filled rooms.  The primary system has given us awful outcomes.

[normiss 644]

17 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Keith,

Good luck with that; ain't going to happen.

Jerry Baumchen

She seems to be a big fan of the Trump grifting game. Idiots contribute millions.