brenthutch 383 #1 Posted February 4, 2020 Sitting back, enjoying a beer, watching MSNBC and some prog on prog fratricide Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #2 February 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, brenthutch said: Sitting back, enjoying a beer, watching MSNBC and some prog on prog fratricide RE: Schadenfreude, Mein Herr, Ich kann Ihren Bedenken nicht widersprechen. Ich bin mir sicher, dass Sie sie zu schätzen wissen. Ich könnte sie niemals auf Englisch veröffentlichen. Das heißt, obwohl ich Sie wirklich respektiere, bin ich weiterhin davon überzeugt, dass Sie Hilfe brauchen. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #3 February 4, 2020 The feeling is mutual Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #4 February 4, 2020 15 minutes ago, brenthutch said: The feeling is mutual Lassen Sie uns irgendwann ein Bier trinken Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #6 February 4, 2020 7 minutes ago, brenthutch said: I’ll buy Perfect. But then it's on to the reserve wine list, d'accord? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #7 February 4, 2020 (edited) MD20/20, Boon’s Farm, Night Train or Wild Irish Rose. They are not just wines, they are fortified wines! Edited February 4, 2020 by brenthutch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SethInMI 145 #8 February 4, 2020 my schadenfreude these days is tesla shorts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #9 February 4, 2020 (edited) Now that Tesla has been weaned from the taxpayer teat and are now left to the tender mercies of the market, I wish them the best. Edited February 4, 2020 by brenthutch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SethInMI 145 #10 February 4, 2020 are you still as bearish on Tesla as you were a few years ago? if now you think they will succeed, does that make the tax credits less evil in your mind? the argument being that Telsa is a net win for the country; the tax revenue generated more than covers the lost revenue of the tax credits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 232 #11 February 4, 2020 18 hours ago, brenthutch said: Now that Tesla has been weaned from the taxpayer teat and are now left to the tender mercies of the market, I wish them the best. I think we can lock this thread now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #12 February 4, 2020 28 minutes ago, DJL said: I think we can lock this thread now. And deny him the opportunity to walk that statement back? No Way - I'm here for the view. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #13 February 4, 2020 5 hours ago, SethInMI said: are you still as bearish on Tesla as you were a few years ago? if now you think they will succeed, does that make the tax credits less evil in your mind? the argument being that Telsa is a net win for the country; the tax revenue generated more than covers the lost revenue of the tax credits. What revenue? I'm pretty sure that Tesla had never paid a dime in federal tax. Not to mention the freeloading on roads paid for by gasoline tax. Show me your math. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #14 February 5, 2020 29 minutes ago, brenthutch said: What revenue? I'm pretty sure that Tesla had never paid a dime in federal tax. Not to mention the freeloading on roads paid for by gasoline tax. Show me your math. A well regulated highway system, being necessary to the internal migration of a free state, the right of the people to own untaxed electric powered vehicles shall not be infringed. Sounds good to me. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #15 February 5, 2020 Easy, just get two thirds of the house, senate and state legislators to go along with you and boom! You can repeal the 2nd while you are at it. Good luck. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mistercwood 287 #16 February 5, 2020 21 hours ago, brenthutch said: Now that Tesla has been weaned from the taxpayer teat and are now left to the tender mercies of the market, I wish them the best. To be logically consistent with your past statements (to the tune of "all subsidies are bad, even for FF"), for it to be a true free market then green companies should continue to get subsidised for as long as fossil fuels historically have been, with the FF subsidies ending immediately. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,299 #17 February 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, mistercwood said: To be logically consistent with your past statements (to the tune of "all subsidies are bad, even for FF"), for it to be a true free market then green companies should continue to get subsidised for as long as fossil fuels historically have been, with the FF subsidies ending immediately. Dear Mr Mistercwood, I've been following your posts intently as so they deserve. But, if you'll allow the intrusion, I fear you do not grasp what is the purpose of our conversations on SC in general and with Mister Brent in particular. Logical consistency with past statements is not the object of our desires. No. No one cares about that anymore. The true purpose of these exercises is to wear each other down with stultifying retorts until no one is any longer interested and some bored fool starts another thread so we can start again. I trust this has been helpful in some small way. Your faithful correspondent, Joe 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mistercwood 287 #18 February 5, 2020 Forgive me for being an optimist. This place used to generate some interesting discussion (and on rare occasion still does), it wasn't always entirely a shit-slinging range... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #19 February 5, 2020 15 minutes ago, mistercwood said: To be logically consistent with your past statements (to the tune of "all subsidies are bad, even for FF"), for it to be a true free market then green companies should continue to get subsidised for as long as fossil fuels historically have been, with the FF subsidies ending immediately. When the tax revenue fossil fuel companies provide exceeds what they get in assistance, they are not really subsidies. If you give me $50 after I have given you $1000, it’s hard to think of that $50 as a subsidy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,914 #20 February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, brenthutch said: When the tax revenue fossil fuel companies provide exceeds what they get in assistance, they are not really subsidies. If you give me $50 after I have given you $1000, it’s hard to think of that $50 as a subsidy. It's a little bit like the way the US government subsidizes skydiving. You don't pay for all the infrastructure needed for aviation to thrive. Does that make you a freeloader? What airport do you run out of? Do you pay landing fees? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #21 February 5, 2020 6 minutes ago, gowlerk said: It's a little bit like the way the US government subsidizes skydiving. You don't pay for all the infrastructure needed for aviation to thrive. Does that make you a freeloader? What airport do you run out of? Do you pay landing fees? We buy more fuel and pay more rent than anyone at the airport, so we actually subsidize everyone else. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,914 #22 February 5, 2020 6 minutes ago, brenthutch said: We buy more fuel and pay more rent than anyone at the airport, so we actually subsidize everyone else. So, how much rent to you pay for all that concrete? You know, the taxiways and runways? How much rent do you pay for that big grass landing area? If you are like most DZs, the answer is zero. The government supplies it to you for free. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SethInMI 145 #23 February 5, 2020 2 hours ago, brenthutch said: Show me your math. Tesla has almost 50,000 employees, much of them in the US. Those employees are well paid and pay taxes. So the amount of tax money going into the system as a result of Tesla is greater than the amount of tax credits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #24 February 5, 2020 11 minutes ago, SethInMI said: Tesla has almost 50,000 employees, much of them in the US. Those employees are well paid and pay taxes. So the amount of tax money going into the system as a result of Tesla is greater than the amount of tax credits. Show your math and site references Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #25 February 5, 2020 17 minutes ago, gowlerk said: So, how much rent to you pay for all that concrete? You know, the taxiways and runways? How much rent do you pay for that big grass landing area? If you are like most DZs, the answer is zero. The government supplies it to you for free. That was here when we started, it is called a sunk cost. All we have done is mitigate that cost Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites