billvon 2,400 #76 January 8, 2016 >Your OK with the government having more and bigger guns to point at you No, I'm not. >and you think that our politicians deserve more protections than the average person. No, I don't. I think SOME politicians need more protection than the average person. As has been demonstrated all too often, assassination is a very real threat here - and both sides seek to increase the tensions that lead to such threats. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgoose71 0 #77 January 8, 2016 billvon>Your OK with the government having more and bigger guns to point at you No, I'm not. >and you think that our politicians deserve more protections than the average person. No, I don't. I think SOME politicians need more protection than the average person. As has been demonstrated all too often, assassination is a very real threat here - and both sides seek to increase the tensions that lead to such threats. Yep, and that is why we have politicians standing behind a wall of heavily armed thugs pointing guns at us telling us we don't need the same guns to protect ourselves."There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #78 January 8, 2016 >Yep, and that is why we have politicians standing behind a wall of heavily >armed thugs pointing guns at us telling us we don't need the same guns to >protect ourselves. I've met about a dozen politicians, including a vice president. I've never had a wall of heavily armed thugs pointing their guns at me. If you have experienced that, then the problem may be with you rather than "the system." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #79 January 8, 2016 Hi 71, QuoteThe US military is only allowed to operate outside the US Oh, yea? From the following link: 'On September 24, the President ordered the 101st Airborne Division of the United States Army—without its black soldiers, who rejoined the division a month later—to Little Rock and federalized the entire 10,000-member Arkansas National Guard, taking it out of the hands of Faubus.' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Rock_Nine Quoteas per the Posse Comitatus Act. And what legislature passed this act? I would like to know because I have never heard of any legislature doing so. Jerry Baumchen PS) One more: 'At 4:45 p.m., commanded by Gen. Douglas MacArthur, the 12th Infantry Regiment, Fort Howard, Maryland, and the 3rd Cavalry Regiment, supported by six battle tanks commanded by Maj. George S. Patton, formed in Pennsylvania Avenue while thousands of civil service employees left work to line the street and watch. The Bonus Marchers, believing the troops were marching in their honor, cheered the troops until Patton ordered the cavalry to charge them—an action which prompted the spectators to yell, "Shame! Shame!" ' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,340 #80 January 8, 2016 billvon >and you think that our politicians deserve more protections than the average person. No, I don't. I think SOME politicians need more protection than the average person. As has been demonstrated all too often, assassination is a very real threat here - and both sides seek to increase the tensions that lead to such threats. Ok, do you think that a regular citizen, facing a demonstrable threat, should have access to the same type of stuff used to protect the politicians? I mean weaponry appropriate to the threat. The security details in parts of DC have Stinger surface-to-air missiles to defend against a threat from the air. I don't mean that."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #81 January 8, 2016 >Ok, do you think that a regular citizen, facing a demonstrable threat, should >have access to the same type of stuff used to protect the politicians? With appropriate training and licensing - yes. (And excepting the exclusively miltiary weapons, as you mention.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #82 January 9, 2016 DanGAs a soldier in the US military, you have been granted the right to travel to war zones and kill people without prosecution. "Regular" citizens don't have that right. Are you saying that you shouldn't have that right, or that any American should be able to go to Afghanistan and kill people with impunity? No. You haven't, and that is a pretty barbaric way of looking at it. As a soldier in the us military, you are given orders to complete missions and are not always brought up on charges of death occurs while accomplishing those directives. There is no "right" to kill, just as there is no liscenses to kill like James Bond has.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #83 January 9, 2016 Huh, I was under the impression you had served. Was I wrong? Soldiers in a war zone absolutely have the right to kill the enemy. This is true whether or not they are on a mission. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jtiflyer 0 #84 January 9, 2016 DanGQuoteapparently you must be killing.....a lot.......with impunity Never said he was killing. But if he was, and he was killing the right people, he'd be hailed as a hero, not a mass murderer. Because he's a soldier in a war zone, his rights and responibilities are different than a civilian back home. Are you saying that you shouldn't have that right, or that any American should be able to go to Afghanistan and kill people with impunity? Suggesting an American goes to Afghanistan and kills with impunity by default suggests he as a member of the Military is doing so. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #85 January 9, 2016 Your logic is severely flawed. Either way, if he is killing the bag guys, good for him. That's what war is. I'm surprised he'd take offense at any implication that he may have killed some enemy soldiers. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #86 January 9, 2016 DanGHuh, I was under the impression you had served. Was I wrong? Soldiers in a war zone absolutely have the right to kill the enemy. This is true whether or not they are on a mission. You are really backward on this one. Soldiers are give an objective. They do not have the right to do anything but follow orders. I served during the the first gulf ware. If I had killed any enemy where I was, I would have been court marshaled. Yes, I was in the gulf. Yes, I was in a war zone. I didn't have the right to do anything but what my orders were. That's how the military works.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #87 January 9, 2016 Well, in most cases. I'm sure there are a handful of German WWII soldiers in prison that would see it somewhat different. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #88 January 9, 2016 normissWell, in most cases. I'm sure there are a handful of German WWII soldiers in prison that would see it somewhat different. Just because you have the right to do something, doesn't mean you have to.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgoose71 0 #89 January 9, 2016 JerryBaumchenHi 71, QuoteThe US military is only allowed to operate outside the US Oh, yea? From the following link: 'On September 24, the President ordered the 101st Airborne Division of the United States Army—without its black soldiers, who rejoined the division a month later—to Little Rock and federalized the entire 10,000-member Arkansas National Guard, taking it out of the hands of Faubus.' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Rock_Nine ***as per the Posse Comitatus Act. And what legislature passed this act? I would like to know because I have never heard of any legislature doing so. Jerry Baumchen PS) One more: 'At 4:45 p.m., commanded by Gen. Douglas MacArthur, the 12th Infantry Regiment, Fort Howard, Maryland, and the 3rd Cavalry Regiment, supported by six battle tanks commanded by Maj. George S. Patton, formed in Pennsylvania Avenue while thousands of civil service employees left work to line the street and watch. The Bonus Marchers, believing the troops were marching in their honor, cheered the troops until Patton ordered the cavalry to charge them—an action which prompted the spectators to yell, "Shame! Shame!" ' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army The president and Patton should have been removed and sent to jail: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1385 And more, even though it's wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #90 January 9, 2016 Those were not rights, they were simply following orders. Most likely why, when I was in, the use of the term "lawful orders" was bandied about with regularity. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
