How can anyone say "God doesn't exist" ?

[Arvoitus 1]

maadmax

***Why do I hate religion so much?

False ideology, god, higher power, whatever they wanna call it, is the reason why we had 9/11. That is why there is so much conflict in middle east. That is why Jews and Palestinians can't get along. Religion caused ISIS in Iraq. Religion killed thousands of people by the crusaders. Romans killed and persecuted thousands of Christians because of their religion.

Funny how that same roman region became the center of Christianity later on. Maybe they got smart and found out that god is the easiest way to manipulate mass population? Constantine was the smart man. He saw the market. He is like Bill Gates or Steve Jobs. Revolutionary.

So therefore if you believe in god, you are the cause of 9/11.
Your god caused 9/11.

Can't disagree with you on any of your points. Personally I have no use for religion, and I believe Christ didn't either. Basically exploration of God is an exploration of self. I choose not to believe we came from nothing and will return to nothing. The universe is to vast for such nonsense. We came from God and we will return to Him.

...

Why is it so hard to accept non-existence when you've already 'experienced' non-existence?

You didn't exist before you were born. Similarly, once you die you'll no longer exist. Thats it, no big mystery, just eternal non-existence. All you have is the years you'll spend here. Once they're up, you'll be gone forever, only to exist in the minds and memories of the people left behind.

Your rights end where my feelings begin.

[Stumpy 256]

Core27

Evolution shows us clearly how things work as we see it. I think many religious people are skeptical not because of what evolution is, but how many people want to use evolution against the idea of God. Let's face it, do religious people really understand evolution? They pretty much only learn/hear of the concept from antagonistic atheists. It's the same with idiot atheists...they never really studied evolution. Maybe they had a class or two in elementary school or high school...or not, but all of a sudden, they're on the internet forums as evolutionary biologist experts condemning the concept of God...

Again, I think you have it backwards. Evolutionary biologists aren't "out to get" religious people, they are just explaining the facts. Its the creationists that go out to discredit evolution, for example by insisting that creationism is taught in science class as an alternative theory - these two are not the same thing. Not often you see evolutionary biologists insiting evolution is taught in sunday school. It's evolution that religions people see as a threat to religion (specifically the bible), not the other way round. The bible, and creationists are no threat to the theory of evolution.

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Stumpy

I've said it before, and I will say it again, I have never understood why the religious communities can't reconcile evolution with "it's god's mechanism for creating the world"

Why should they? who cares? what benefit does the knowledge of evolution serve other than to the biologists who can take advantage of that knowledge?

If that knowledge would do nothing for them, why would they accept it when it's forced down their throat by atheists falsely using it to dismiss God?

Again - they are generally trying to disprove evolution and failing dismally. Here's an example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z-OLG0KyR4. If instead they reconciled it as I said, a lot of these arguments would go away overnight, and people wouldn't have to start museums with people riding dinosaurs.
As I said, from the other side I equally don't condone the views and behaviour of people like Richard Dawkins for example - as an evolutionary biologist he is spectacularly good - read the blind watchmaker and the selfish gene if you want to understand WHY most of the creationist arguments are so completely wrong, but as an atheist I think he should just shut up, it's unnecessary.

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I'm not trying to be closed minded...I just think that people would obviously be humbly agnostic if they did not know, such as Einstein...Atheism seems to be much more of a defensive ideology. It has to acknowledge the concept of God...a concept that they take offense to. I just want to know why?

Did they inherently come to the idea themselves only to reject it, or did they base the idea on some negative external influence?

The idea of the tooth fairy "could" be true - but I bet you don't believe in it. Religion is much the same for atheists. Why "should" they be agnostic? Sure - there "could" be a deity, but in the atheist mind the chance is so vanishingly small that it's not even worth a mention.

To give you my viewpoint,
-I have simply never seen a good argument or any evidence as to why there needs to be a god.
-Every major religion is as equally convinced as every other that they are the ONLY correct ones, they all contradict themselves and each other in myriad ways. I suspect that if there is a god, there isn't a single religion in the world that has it right yet.
-Religion came about to explain things that seemed like magic, and as education and knowledge improved, religions changed to suit (which kind of implies they are a creation of the mind).
-Religion is also an emotional crutch for people to answer those existential questions why me, whats next etc. "No reason", and "nothing" are perfectly valid answers but many people are too scared to accept that.
-Science increasingly blows the arguments against it into the weeds. (and yes - I am back on the evolution topic here)

There are probably other reasons but it's late and I'm tired.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[RonD1120 58]

Stumpy

You have that backwards. You can't disprove god - but you can't prove him/her/it either. And which god are we talking about here? The evidence for all of them is identical.

The debate to prove or disprove God is futile.

However, Christ can be experienced if you have the courage to surrender and ask Him to come into your life. Once you experience Him and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit the understanding of God becomes self evident.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Stumpy 256]

RonD1120

***

You have that backwards. You can't disprove god - but you can't prove him/her/it either. And which god are we talking about here? The evidence for all of them is identical.

The debate to prove or disprove God is futile.

However, Christ can be experienced if you have the courage to surrender and ask Him to come into your life. Once you experience Him and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit the understanding of God becomes self evident.

Change "Christ" for "Allah" and Muslims will say EXACTLY the same thing, and be just as correct.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[Core27 0]

Stumpy

***
Evolution shows us clearly how things work as we see it. I think many religious people are skeptical not because of what evolution is, but how many people want to use evolution against the idea of God. Let's face it, do religious people really understand evolution? They pretty much only learn/hear of the concept from antagonistic atheists. It's the same with idiot atheists...they never really studied evolution. Maybe they had a class or two in elementary school or high school...or not, but all of a sudden, they're on the internet forums as evolutionary biologist experts condemning the concept of God...

Again, I think you have it backwards. Evolutionary biologists aren't "out to get" religious people, they are just explaining the facts.

Even dick dawkins forces his beliefs onto religion...how much more the ignorant atheist?

Everything would be fine if they just kept science with science instead of crossing their bounds and using it against God...they are a disgrace to science, much like westboro is a disgrace to christianity.

[jakee 1,255]

RonD1120

However, Christ can be experienced if you have the courage to surrender and ask Him to come into your life. Once you experience Him and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit the understanding of God becomes self evident.

So what you're saying is that you can't even get subjective evidence of. Jesus unless you already believe in him. That's kinda pointless.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,255]

Richard Dawkins is forcing his beliefs onto religion? How so, by saying he thinks they're wrong?

So how, by your metric, is every religious person who says god exists not forcing their beliefs onto atheists?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Stumpy 256]

Core27

Everything would be fine if they just kept science with science instead of crossing their bounds and using it against God...

OK now I am certain you are trolling.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[Core27 0]

jakee

Richard Dawkins is forcing his beliefs onto religion? How so, by saying he thinks they're wrong?

So how, by your metric, is every religious person who says god exists not forcing their beliefs onto atheists?

The problem is that he is using science, and polluting it...even deGrasse called him out on it.

[RonD1120 58]

Stumpy

******

You have that backwards. You can't disprove god - but you can't prove him/her/it either. And which god are we talking about here? The evidence for all of them is identical.

The debate to prove or disprove God is futile.

However, Christ can be experienced if you have the courage to surrender and ask Him to come into your life. Once you experience Him and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit the understanding of God becomes self evident.

Change "Christ" for "Allah" and Muslims will say EXACTLY the same thing, and be just as correct.

Not true.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Core27 0]

Stumpy

***Everything would be fine if they just kept science with science instead of crossing their bounds and using it against God...

OK now I am certain you are trolling.

Your measure is completely off...try again.

[jakee 1,255]

Core27

***Richard Dawkins is forcing his beliefs onto religion? How so, by saying he thinks they're wrong?

So how, by your metric, is every religious person who says god exists not forcing their beliefs onto atheists?

The problem is that he is using science, and polluting it...even deGrasse called him out on it.

So A) how is he forcing beliefs on anyone?

And B) what about religious people like you who question evolution because they think it makes God more likely if evolution is wrong, why aren't you the problem?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Core27 0]

RonD1120

*********

You have that backwards. You can't disprove god - but you can't prove him/her/it either. And which god are we talking about here? The evidence for all of them is identical.

The debate to prove or disprove God is futile.

However, Christ can be experienced if you have the courage to surrender and ask Him to come into your life. Once you experience Him and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit the understanding of God becomes self evident.

Change "Christ" for "Allah" and Muslims will say EXACTLY the same thing, and be just as correct.

Not true.

well in their defense they haven't even tried...hell, they can't even get their analogies right.

[RonD1120 58]

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Core27 0]

jakee

******Richard Dawkins is forcing his beliefs onto religion? How so, by saying he thinks they're wrong?

So how, by your metric, is every religious person who says god exists not forcing their beliefs onto atheists?

The problem is that he is using science, and polluting it...even deGrasse called him out on it.

So A) how is he forcing beliefs on anyone?

He's a condescending asshole who doesn't know how it all started...

I present my beliefs on this forum all the time, and for that many athiests consider it as if I'm shoving it down their throat...aka forcing it on them...I'm sure you've heard normiss crying about it...

jakee

And B) what about religious people like you who question evolution because they think it makes God more likely if evolution is wrong, why aren't you the problem?

You got me all wrong Sir...I have no problems with evolution.

If God made a fat tree appear right before my eyes yesterday, and then a biologist came along and told me the tree was here for 100 years, I would understand why he believed that.

If people didn't falsely use science against the idea of God, then I doubt we'd have these problems...

People use the idea of evolution to dismiss God, but they have know idea how it all got started. If you don't believe in God, fine, but leave science out of it.

[Stumpy 256]

RonD1120

Like I said, it's late and I'm tired.

Christ/Muhammed/God/Allah/Same/same

My point still stands.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[kallend 1,623]

Core27

******How did it all start then?

Take your pick - the evidence for each is identical.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_creation_myths

If you were wondering around this world with no external influence of God, could you not see yourself looking up to the sky and asking yourself, why? who?



Nope. I just believe in physics and the consequences arising there from.

Your "How did it all start then?" question is loaded, absurd, and does not warrant an answer.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 622]

Coreece? Is that you buddy?

[stayhigh 2]

I've fucking told people repeatedly about the start, the beginning.

Two unicorns, one black and one white. Their horns crashed one another (The big bang), which started space particles and when there were enough unicorns that were sacrificed the earth was born.

Why do you think there is a myth about the unicorns? Do you think people just made up unicorn out of pure imagination? No dude, the sacred scroll from the Sahara Desert tells us the truth. It was the Roman pope that twisted the words and turned the Unicorn in to Jehovah, and created Jesus story.

Bernie Sanders for President 2016

[muff528 3]

"For let Philosopher and Doctor preach
Of what they will, and what they will not. Each
Is but one Link in an eternal Chain
That none can slip, nor break, nor over-reach."

~Omar the Tentmaker (according to Fitzgerald)

Also:

"Beyond the earth,
beyond the farthest skies
I try to find Heaven and Hell.
Then I hear a solemn voice that says:
"Heaven and hell are inside.”

and

"...One thing is certain, and the Rest is Lies; ..."

~same guy

[Remster 24]

normiss

Coreece? Is that you buddy?

Remster

[Quagmirian 40]

I am not here to mock people and their religious beliefs, much as I would like to.

The problem with answering the question 'Does God exist?' is there is very little evidence either way. What I also find interesting, is how similar spiritual connections seem to be to mental illness, delusions etc. Not that I am slamming anyone who believes in God.

[maadmax 0]

Quagmirian

I am not here to mock people and their religious beliefs, much as I would like to.

The problem with answering the question 'Does God exist?' is there is very little evidence either way. What I also find interesting, is how similar spiritual connections seem to be to mental illness, delusions etc. Not that I am slamming anyone who believes in God.

Welp, maybe so. But the one thing I do know is that the longer I live the more paradoxical and layered life actually turns out to be. If you can watch & understand the video in the OP, you might be able to see there is a lot more going on than meets the eye.

...

[RonD1120 58]

muff528

"For let Philosopher and Doctor preach
Of what they will, and what they will not. Each
Is but one Link in an eternal Chain
That none can slip, nor break, nor over-reach."

~Omar the Tentmaker (according to Fitzgerald)

Also:

"Beyond the earth,
beyond the farthest skies
I try to find Heaven and Hell.
Then I hear a solemn voice that says:
"Heaven and hell are inside.”

and

"...One thing is certain, and the Rest is Lies; ..."

~same guy

One of my oldest jumping buddies from the '60s was Al Stephens, AKA Omar the Tentmaker. RIP, he went in on a tandem jump at Paso Robles CA in the late '80s. Could this be the same fellow?

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[RonD1120 58]

Quagmirian

I am not here to mock people and their religious beliefs, much as I would like to.

The problem with answering the question 'Does God exist?' is there is very little evidence either way. What I also find interesting, is how similar spiritual connections seem to be to mental illness, delusions etc. Not that I am slamming anyone who believes in God.

Nope, mental illness and psychiatric diagnoses are much different.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.