It's curtains for the new healthcare plan

[DaVinci 0]

billvon

And the GOP will shut down the government until Obamacare is repealed (they tried). Boehner will never back down. And Obama will ban guns (He tried).

[billvon 2,426]

>And the GOP will shut down the government until Obamacare is repealed (they tried)

But . . . but . . . it was going to happen! The GOP said so!

> And Obama will ban guns (He tried).

But . . . if you elect Obama he will ban guns! Again, this was promised.

Geez, it's like you can't believe anything they say. But I'm sure this one time it will be different.

[turtlespeed 212]

billvon

>And the GOP will shut down the government until Obamacare is repealed (they tried)

But . . . but . . . it was going to happen! The GOP said so!

> And Obama will ban guns (He tried).

But . . . if you elect Obama he will ban guns! Again, this was promised.

Geez, it's like you can't believe anything they say. But I'm sure this one time it will be different.

Looks like ted Cruz was correct in holding out though. All he wanted was a one year delay . . . Now Mr "we will not negotiate" is good to his word once again, huh.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[DaVinci 0]

billvon

>And the GOP will shut down the government until Obamacare is repealed (they tried)

But . . . but . . . it was going to happen! The GOP said so!

> And Obama will ban guns (He tried).

But . . . if you elect Obama he will ban guns! Again, this was promised.

Geez, it's like you can't believe anything they say. But I'm sure this one time it will be different.

Without the outcry, they would have gotten what they said they would get.

[masterrig 1]

Andy9o8

***To the original topic:

Can anyone (without using google) cite a government agency, program, etc that was ever closed because it didn't work as intended, was outdated, cost too much, etc?

The horse cavalry. You know, with real horsies.

The U.S. Amy 1st. Cav. Mounted Division still exists. They are based here in Texas and make appearances at such events as 'Eques-Fest' before the Tournament of Roses Parade as well as the parade itself.


Chuck

[mirage62 0]

Quote

Looks like ted Cruz was correct in holding out though. All he wanted was a one year delay . . . Now Mr "we will not negotiate" is good to his word once again, huh.

+1

Funny so many people here were SURE - I mean completely SURE that Bush knew there were no WMD I Iraq.

The same people seem to be sure that Obama - a law prof - didn't know what was in his signature law.

He knew it, he lied to get the bill passed (that not surprising for any party) and now he is dealing with the problem of his lie.

The only problem (they think) is that the web page didn't work - if that is correct they will fix it and things will be great.

Time will tell.

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[winsor 187]

mirage62

Quote

Looks like ted Cruz was correct in holding out though. All he wanted was a one year delay . . . Now Mr "we will not negotiate" is good to his word once again, huh.

+1

Funny so many people here were SURE - I mean completely SURE that Bush knew there were no WMD I Iraq.

The same people seem to be sure that Obama - a law prof - didn't know what was in his signature law.

He knew it, he lied to get the bill passed (that not surprising for any party) and now he is dealing with the problem of his lie.

The only problem (they think) is that the web page didn't work - if that is correct they will fix it and things will be great.

Time will tell.

The whole WMD thing amazes me.

You want Weapons of Mass Destruction? The USA is WMD Central! We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger, and we have stockpiles that can turn this planet into a cinder with the push of a button.

The idea that we should summarily attack any other country that has WMDs is and was laughable. What makes Iraq so special? What about South Africa, Korea, Great Britain, Syria, France, Russia, Libya, China, Israel, India, Pakistan and anyone else I forgot to mention?

The outcome of our adventure in the sandbox was clear at the outset, as is the ultimate efficacy of the ACA. Which is the greater exercise in stupidity is debatable, though I personally consider starting wars to be an order of magnitude more serious.

Given my druthers, I would much prefer be dealing with the legislative clusterfuck that is the ACA and never have attacked Iraq than to have Mission Accomplished! (tm) in Iraq and no ACA.


BSBD,

Winsor

[kelpdiver 2]

winsor

The whole WMD thing amazes me.

You want Weapons of Mass Destruction? The USA is WMD Central! We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger, and we have stockpiles that can turn this planet into a cinder with the push of a button.

The idea that we should summarily attack any other country that has WMDs is and was laughable. What makes Iraq so special? What about South Africa, Korea, Great Britain, Syria, France, Russia, Libya, China, Israel, India, Pakistan and anyone else I forgot to mention?

What's special about Iraq is that they pledged to give them up as part of their terms of surrender in 1991, in order to avoid an even more thorough destruction in war by the US lead UN forces.

Which biological and chemical uses by the US are you referring to? Agent Orange, imo, doesn't count, and the Indian wars were nearly 150 years ago now.

[billvon 2,426]

>Without the outcry, they would have gotten what they said they would get.

Which, at the end of all the fuss, was a big fat zero.

[winsor 187]

kelpdiver

***
The whole WMD thing amazes me.

You want Weapons of Mass Destruction? The USA is WMD Central! We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger, and we have stockpiles that can turn this planet into a cinder with the push of a button.

The idea that we should summarily attack any other country that has WMDs is and was laughable. What makes Iraq so special? What about South Africa, Korea, Great Britain, Syria, France, Russia, Libya, China, Israel, India, Pakistan and anyone else I forgot to mention?

What's special about Iraq is that they pledged to give them up as part of their terms of surrender in 1991, in order to avoid an even more thorough destruction in war by the US lead UN forces.

Which biological and chemical uses by the US are you referring to? Agent Orange, imo, doesn't count, and the Indian wars were nearly 150 years ago now.

Even if they had stocks of CBR weaponry, it did not constitute a casus belli on our part - regardless of what Dick Cheney says. CLAIMING to have them was simply good politics in a part of the world where being seen as weak is but an invitation to attack by a host of opponents, foreign and domestic.

From Wikipedia: In World War I, the U.S. produced its own munitions as well as deploying weapons produced by the French. The U.S. produced 5,770 metric tons of these weapons, including 1,400 metric tons of phosgene and 175 metric tons of mustard gas.

Entire tribes were wiped out by the intentional use of smallpox-infected blankets (the Sheep-eaters of the Shoshone come to mind), and I do not think the passage of time makes that okay. YMMV.

In the same sense that people who got rich by breaking a variety of laws are big proponents of law and order once they have it made, our holier-than-thou stance on WMDs rings rather hollow.

I can give you a reading list that makes it clear that our aversion to the use of WMDs is very much in keeping with the fact that they are poor tools for achieving our purposes.


BSBD,

Winsor

[kelpdiver 2]

winsor

From Wikipedia: In World War I, the U.S. produced its own munitions as well as deploying weapons produced by the French. The U.S. produced 5,770 metric tons of these weapons, including 1,400 metric tons of phosgene and 175 metric tons of mustard gas.

Entire tribes were wiped out by the intentional use of smallpox-infected blankets (the Sheep-eaters of the Shoshone come to mind), and I do not think the passage of time makes that okay. YMMV.

In the same sense that people who got rich by breaking a variety of laws are big proponents of law and order once they have it made, our holier-than-thou stance on WMDs rings rather hollow.

But the US didn't break any laws. It behaved to the standards of the time. The ban on chemical weapons came in response to the horrors of WWI. And no, it's silly to claim hypocrisy for holding Iraq to standards of today because of actions during the Frontier Era in the 19th Century. There wasn't a single civilized nation from that time per our current standards of conduct.

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger

False.
Saddam gassed the Kurds.
Germain's used Mustard Gas in WWI
In medieval times people would throw plague infected body's into forts.

[JerryBaumchen 1,061]

Hi DaVinci,

Quote

False.

Sorry, but winsor is correct. The US is the only country to have used all three in anger.

JerryBaumchen

[Andy9o8 0]

DaVinci

Quote

We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger

False.
Saddam gassed the Kurds.
Germain's used Mustard Gas in WWI
In medieval times people would throw plague infected body's into forts.

Hey, leave Germain alone. He's one of us.

[kelpdiver 2]

JerryBaumchen

Sorry, but winsor is correct. The US is the only country to have used all three in anger.

With these polonium poisonings, the Russians may have met the nuclear requirement, and I've little doubt they had the others met in the past.

[kallend 1,644]

DaVinci

Quote

We are the ONLY country that has used Chemical, Nuclear and Biological weapons in anger

False.
Saddam gassed the Kurds.
Germain's used Mustard Gas in WWI
In medieval times people would throw plague infected body's into forts.

And daVinci is WRONG yet again.

(Look up the difference between "and" and "or").

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rhaig 0]

billvon

>And the GOP will shut down the government until Obamacare is repealed (they tried)

But . . . but . . . it was going to happen! The GOP said so!

> And Obama will ban guns (He tried).

But . . . if you elect Obama he will ban guns! Again, this was promised.

Geez, it's like you can't believe anything they say. But I'm sure this one time it will be different.

so what you're saying is that we can't believe promises made during election cycles? Really? shocker!!!

we can start stacking up the lies on both sides of the political fence and see which stack is higher, but the shameful part is that both stacks will be too high.

--
Rob