davjohns 1 #126 May 26, 2012 Quote here you go.... http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/look-inside-world-nicest-prison-180524054.html killler... Wow...that place is nicer than places I've gone on vacation. After 28 years in the Army, I've decided I want to retire as a prisoner in Norway.I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet.. But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontlikemustard 0 #127 May 26, 2012 Why NOT the death penalty? its very expensive, does not solve anything, its not full proof, life sentence without parole is not a difficult concept to implement --- but really, we have to ask ourselves... when were wishing suffering upon someone for hurting another, what does that make us? revenge solves nothing, the damage has been done. its sad, but its true. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigbearfng 16 #128 May 28, 2012 How is it ever right to have such a hatred anger in wanting another human dead. ___________________________________________ Be the victim/Your loved one is the victim.............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #129 May 28, 2012 Quotebut really, we have to ask ourselves... when were wishing suffering upon someone for hurting another, what does that make us? I would argue that sending someone to life in prison is "wishing suffering upon someone." Any kind of punishment could be looked at as "revenge." I think the only truly good arguments against the death penalty are that an innocent person could be executed, and that it is too expensive (and to lower the expense would probably only end up with more errors in the system). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #130 May 28, 2012 Well, you also don't want to send out the message that killing people is wrong by killing people as a society. Or so me thinks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #131 May 28, 2012 QuoteWell, you also don't want to send out the message that killing people is wrong by killing people as a society. Or so me thinks. As I've said, I don't think we're sending out that message. Most people who kill are not even eligible for the death penalty; most just go to prison, along with other violent criminals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #132 May 29, 2012 QuoteWhy NOT death penalty? Could you be an executioner? If so, why? Who the fuck is you? *edit* I'm proud to say that my State leads the Union when it comes to no death penalty...I do not trust government when it comes to death nor it's interpretation of Scripture...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
killler 2 #133 May 29, 2012 Sure... It would be a lot faster and more humane then what they did to those young girls... Not even thinking about the mother and father.... So this guy is raping, beating and then pours gas on "YOUR" daughter and lights her up... Then as you walk in the room the guy's got his hands in the air , kneeling and saying I GIVE UP.... Using your views on this you tell him he's under arrest and await the police and the fire department to put out your daughters burning body... Do I have it right.. Killler... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #134 May 29, 2012 I don't depend on the law...I don't call the cops for help. I want government out of my life. I take care of my own business...quite fairly and competent actually. ...As I said, who the fuck is you? In other words, mind your own business. The problem with this is that people are too hot headed and incompetent to manage their own affairs and must rely on the .gov, however, that is not my problem...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
killler 2 #135 May 29, 2012 So you'll kill him in cold blood, Then get rid of the body? Is that what your saying now... killler.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #136 May 29, 2012 No, I wouldn't have to get rid of the body.... *edit* You watch too much tv, don't you? Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontlikemustard 0 #137 May 29, 2012 QuoteI would argue that sending someone to life in prison is "wishing suffering upon someone." Any kind of punishment could be looked at as "revenge." I am all for a life sentence because it keeps a convicted murderer from hurting someone else ever again. The government should act as a role model when it comes to maintaining the law, killing a convicted murderer is hypocritical. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #138 May 30, 2012 Quote The government should act as a role model when it comes to maintaining the law, killing a convicted murderer is hypocritical. Oh, OK. So if I build a jail in my house and keep someone in it against his will, I shouldn't go to prison for that. Because it would be hypocritical of the government to put me in prison for imprisoning someone else. Edit to add: And no, Remi, I'm not accepting volunteers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #139 May 30, 2012 QuoteQuoteThe government should act as a role model when it comes to maintaining the law, killing a convicted murderer is hypocritical. Oh, OK. So if I build a jail in my house and keep someone in it against his will, I shouldn't go to prison for that. Because it would be hypocritical of the government to put me in prison for imprisoning someone else. exactly, and if I go and take someone's money, I shouldn't go to jail - "role model" and all that ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontlikemustard 0 #140 May 30, 2012 QuoteQuoteThe government should act as a role model when it comes to maintaining the law, killing a convicted murderer is hypocritical. Oh, OK. So if I build a jail in my house and keep someone in it against his will, I shouldn't go to prison for that. Because it would be hypocritical of the government to put me in prison for imprisoning someone else. If you build a jail in your house and keep someone in it against his will, that is called kidnapping. Placing a convicted criminal behind bars is not kidnapping. If someone pleads guilty to assault that does not give .gov the right to beat him up. If someone is guilty of raping someone, it does not give the government the right to rape him. We are better than that, right? Now when it comes to killing, the worst of all crimes, its suddenly okay for us to sink to their level. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davjohns 1 #141 May 30, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteThe government should act as a role model when it comes to maintaining the law, killing a convicted murderer is hypocritical. Oh, OK. So if I build a jail in my house and keep someone in it against his will, I shouldn't go to prison for that. Because it would be hypocritical of the government to put me in prison for imprisoning someone else. If you build a jail in your house and keep someone in it against his will, that is called kidnapping. Placing a convicted criminal behind bars is not kidnapping. If someone pleads guilty to assault that does not give .gov the right to beat him up. If someone is guilty of raping someone, it does not give the government the right to rape him. We are better than that, right? Now when it comes to killing, the worst of all crimes, its suddenly okay for us to sink to their level. We've been down this emotional road in this thread. Please read what has come before and take it into consideration. Execution is not necessarily about revenge, justice or other concepts. Those are part of it, but hardly all. My proposition is that there are instances such as those already cited, where we have to accept that the safest thing for society is to remove the cancer. It should be done with great consideration, deliberation and introspection. However, there are fact patterns that just don't leave much choice. I have asked that those who oppose the death penalty provide alternatives. Wendy (and I think one other) have proposed that LWOP is acceptable even given it's possibilities that those so sentenced may walk free and commit heinous acts again. In their judgment, the cost/benefit works out. I am willing to accept their opinion without agreeing to it. I have sought facts on LWOP outcomes. I think the risks are more substantial than I am willing to take just to keep an animal alive. This does not apply in all cases. But a couple have been cited in this thread that are hard to argue against.I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet.. But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #142 May 30, 2012 QuoteIf you build a jail in your house and keep someone in it against his will, that is called kidnapping. Placing a convicted criminal behind bars is not kidnapping. If I kill someone for the fun of it, it is called murder. Killing a convicted criminal using the most humane method possible is not murder. QuoteIf someone is guilty of raping someone, it does not give the government the right to rape him. We are better than that, right? Now when it comes to killing, the worst of all crimes, its suddenly okay for us to sink to their level. No, the criminals in the OP raped and killed three people with a violent death. Sentencing them to the death penalty is not sinking to their level. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,426 #143 May 30, 2012 >If you build a jail in your house and keep someone in it against his will, >that is called kidnapping. And if a government builds a jail on their land and keeps someone there against their will - it is also kidnapping. (If your claim that governmental actions are equivalent to private action is valid, that is.) >Placing a convicted criminal behind bars is not kidnapping. Nor is executing a convicted criminal murder. But you seem to think it is. So which is it? Must the government behave better than a kidnapper, and refuse to hold people against their will? Or is it OK to "descend to their level?" Is it only true for execution, but nothing else? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontlikemustard 0 #144 May 30, 2012 QuoteSentencing them to the death penalty is not sinking to their level. I think we can agree to disagree. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davjohns 1 #145 May 30, 2012 QuoteQuoteSentencing them to the death penalty is not sinking to their level. I think we can agree to disagree. One would think. And then there's SC.... :)I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet.. But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #146 May 30, 2012 "given it's possibilities that those so sentenced may walk free and commit heinous acts again" You insist on putting that part in although that is not always the case. MANY variables to the ability of a convicted violent offender to reduce LWOP. It's even more assured when they land multiple life convictions. I'm good with those. Both sides are also 'emotional' about it, if that's what you want to call it. I just don't understand how killing is ok, so long as it's selective, and has someone's approval. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontlikemustard 0 #147 May 30, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteSentencing them to the death penalty is not sinking to their level. I think we can agree to disagree. One would think. And then there's SC.... :) Now now... were not that bad haha. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
killler 2 #148 May 30, 2012 After 6 pages of posts we're still running around in circles .... We can't have the death penalty because they might be innocent... Even though they are guilty and confess to said crime....It's to expensive to due... We need to spend 10+ yrs in court to see if the death penalty is cruel... Anti-death penalty people like/don't care if the person is raped and killed by fellow convicts ... Anti-death penalty people state that "THEY WOULD TAKE CARE " of said person if it happened in their house... And we (The pro=death penalty people)are the blood thirsty ones for thinking that some people just have done such a barbaric act that the only way to make sure it never can happen again is the death penalty....killler edited to make the "WE" inclusive to only pro-death penalty... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,426 #149 May 30, 2012 >And we're the blood thirsty ones for thinking that some people just have >done such a barbaric act that the only way to make sure it never can >happen again is the death penalty.... . . . or life in prison with no parole. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #150 May 30, 2012 Generally the term 'we' is an all inclusive expression. Not so in this case. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
