Florida Teen Shot

[jclalor 12]

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Considering what happened in LA when the cops were acquitted and then the feds charged them again anyway, I guess it really doesn't matter. Obummer and Holder will get their man anyway they can

...


I would be willing to put my $100 against your $50 (payable to a charity of the winners choosing) that zero federal charges will be filed against Zimmerman if he is acquitted.

But you and I both know that there will be no federal charges coming from Obama and Holder.

[DanG 1]

Read the thread above.

All those documents show is that the DOJ unit assigned to mediate racially tense situations, went and worked a racially tense situation. They don't show that they were advocating for any position, coordinating any protests, and training anyone.

But the right wing internet doesn't let facts, or lack thereof, get in the way of a good headline.

- Dan G

[DanG 1]

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I would be willing to put my $100 against your $50 (payable to a charity of the winners choosing) that zero federal charges will be filed against Zimmerman if he is acquitted.

But you and I both know that there will be no federal charges coming from Obama and Holder.

I already offered a similar bet to GravityMaster with only tumbleweeds for a response.

- Dan G

[rushmc 18]

DanG

Read the thread above.

All those documents show is that the DOJ unit assigned to mediate racially tense situations, went and worked a racially tense situation. They don't show that they were advocating for any position, coordinating any protests, and training anyone.

But the right wing internet doesn't let facts, or lack thereof, get in the way of a good headline.

What they did was mort than mediate
They organized the marches and protests

And Holder, with his buddy Sharpton, went down there and stirred things up

All fits

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

DanG

Quote

I would be willing to put my $100 against your $50 (payable to a charity of the winners choosing) that zero federal charges will be filed against Zimmerman if he is acquitted.

But you and I both know that there will be no federal charges coming from Obama and Holder.

I already offered a similar bet to GravityMaster with only tumbleweeds for a response.

I think the bet is 50 50 at best. I could eaily see Holder filing civil rights charges or hate crime charges

Not saying that he will, but it would not surprise me if he does

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[linebckr83 3]

DanG

But the right wing internet doesn't let facts, or lack thereof, get in the way of a good headline.

Come on now, you know better than to differ between right and left wing media. All media is skewed for a good headline.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[lawrocket 3]

normiss

They did clearly wait until the last minute.

This isn't uncommon. I've done it in the civil arena - motion to amend the complaint to conform to proof. It's been done to my client. I understand that in the criminal context it happens all the time.

The "child abuse" was grasping at straws. The judge thought so.

But I do consider this: will the jury find manslaughter? Did the prosecution prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? There's the inquiry, in my mind. Would anybody feel differently if he was charged with it from the beginning? Trust me - his attorneys and he have known all along that he had that hanging over him.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[rushmc 18]

linebckr83

***But the right wing internet doesn't let facts, or lack thereof, get in the way of a good headline.

Come on now, you know better than to differ between right and left wing media. All media is skewed for a good headline.

Actually the info was obtained by Judicial Watch and then first reported by pjmedia

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jclalor 12]

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I think the bet is 50 50 at best. I could eaily see Holder filing civil rights charges or hate crime charges

Not saying that he will, but it would not surprise me if he does

And that's exactly why I'm giving odds, in all honesty, I would say it's less than a 10% chance of federal charges being filed. Obama and Holder are too busy setting up FEMA camps and instituting socialism through out our land to be bothered with this.

[Channman 2]

FreeFallFiend

***

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...and with the DOJ sending in a team of Community Relations Service (CRS) personnel to train and organize protestors throughout Florida against Zimmerman and demand procecution gives us a glimps in how Zimmerman is being railroaded. There is an active attempt to get a conviction no matter the evidence, and these latest charges is just that.

And apparently there is a current politically driven thrust to get the CRS bullshit into the discussion, again with no thought about the actual evidence.

Evidence such as official documents from the Justice Department?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2359517/Documents-Little-known-Justice-Department-unit-provided-support-protest-deployment-Florida-initial-Trayvon-Martin-unrest.html

HawaiiReporter

"The Community Relations Service provided “support for protest deployment” and “technical assistance” to event organizers for a march and rally on March 31. According to the Orlando Sentinel [3], Community Relations Service staff even helped organize a meeting between the city of Sanford and the local NAACP that resulted in the temporary resignation of police chief Bill Lee. One of the local pastors whose church was the focal point of protests aptly summarized the bias of Community Relations Service when she was quoted as saying that it was “there for us.” Apparently, it wasn’t “there” for Zimmerman."

"On April 15, 2012, during the height of the protests, the Orlando Sentinel reported, “They [the CRS] helped set up a meeting between the local NAACP and elected officials that led to the temporary resignation of police Chief Bill Lee according to Turner Clayton, Seminole County chapter president of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.” The paper quoted the Rev. Valarie Houston, pastor of Allen Chapel AME Church, a focal point for protesters, as saying “They were there for us,” after a March 20 meeting with CRS agents.

Separately, in response to a Florida Sunshine Law request to the City of Sanford, Judicial Watch also obtained an audio recording of a “community meeting” held at Second Shiloh Missionary Baptist Church in Sanford on April 19, 2012. The meeting, which led to the ouster of Sanford’s Police Chief Bill Lee, was scheduled after a group of college students calling themselves the “Dream Defenders” barricaded the entrance to the police department demanding Lee be fired. According to the Orlando Sentinel, DOJ employees with the CRS had arranged a 40-mile police escort for the students from Daytona Beach to Sanford."

DanG, I can provide additional evidence if necessary.

[skypuppy 1]

normiss

They did clearly wait until the last minute.

I was referring to ian's story about when his house was broken into. I'm sure the crown didn't wait until the break and enter trial was almost over and then tacked 'kidnapping' to the charges...

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[normiss 633]

The FBI has already been here investigating the incident for federal charges.
It is my understanding they declined to press charges as there were no violations of law.

[rushmc 18]

normiss

The FBI has already been here investigating the incident for federal charges.
It is my understanding they declined to press charges as there were no violations of law.

Agreed but, this admin has already shown they care little about what law they may be breaking

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[muff528 3]

lawrocket

***They did clearly wait until the last minute.

This isn't uncommon. I've done it in the civil arena - motion to amend the complaint to conform to proof. It's been done to my client. I understand that in the criminal context it happens all the time.

The "child abuse" was grasping at straws. The judge thought so.

But I do consider this: will the jury find manslaughter? Did the prosecution prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? There's the inquiry, in my mind. Would anybody feel differently if he was charged with it from the beginning? Trust me - his attorneys and he have known all along that he had that hanging over him.

As an untrained outsider, it seems to me that there is no middle ground in this case. Nobody, not even the defense, is disputing that Z pointed his gun at M's chest and pulled the trigger. That was either an act of self-defense or it was 2nd-degree murder. If the jury decides to "compromise" with a manslaughter (or other nonsense charge) conviction, then they are effectively saying that it was not self-defense. If they reject the self-defense argument, and given that Zimmerman made an undisputed conscious decision to shoot Martin, that would leave 2nd-degree murder as the only other option. (consider all that as a question.)

[Channman 2]

I just read that CNN once again during a News telecast refered to Zimmerman as a "White Hispanic" Does that make Obama a "White African American"?

[rushmc 18]

Channman

I just read that CNN once again during a News telecast refered to Zimmerman as a "White Hispanic" Does that make Obama a "White African American"?

that term was coined after the media made a fool of itself and said this was a white man killing a black man issue

then they found out he was hispanic and if I remember correctly his mother is black

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

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What they did was mort than mediate
They organized the marches and protests

You can say that until you're blue in the face, but it's not the same as providing evidence.

- Dan G

[Channman 2]

rushmc

***I just read that CNN once again during a News telecast refered to Zimmerman as a "White Hispanic" Does that make Obama a "White African American"?

that term was coined after the media made a fool of itself and said this was a white man killing a black man issue

then they found out he was hispanic and if I remember correctly his mother is black


Father is White, Mother Hispanic. Opposite for Obama, Mommy White, Daddy Black.

[rushmc 18]

DanG

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What they did was mort than mediate
They organized the marches and protests

You can say that until you're blue in the face, but it's not the same as providing evidence.

Been provided
You just refuse to see it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[lawrocket 3]

normiss

The FBI has already been here investigating the incident for federal charges.
It is my understanding they declined to press charges as there were no violations of law.

At least no violations of federal law. The Rodney King trial was about civil rights violations by sworn officers acting under color of authority. That's different from a private person.

Of course, it doesn't mean that Zimmerman won't be charged with terrorism. Seems to be the hip thing.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[rwieder 0]

I'm watching the closing arguments right now. The Prosecuting attorney is going out of his way to make GZ a liar, and a thug, and keeps referring to him as a policeman wannabe. He's taking so long, he's actually killing his own case. Haven't heard fro Mark O'Meara as of yet, but you know he's gonna shoot this clown down. They are going for 2nd degree murder, no less. MISTAKE! The judge is recessing untill 09:00 07/12/2013. I smell a "Hung Jury" because his presentation was self contradictory.
Best-
Richard

[linebckr83 3]

Prosecution is done with the first part of their closing argument. Anyone hear it all?

I was far from impressed. I can't recall seeing one piece of evidence that proves 2nd degree murder. The evidence shown was to disprove GZ's story. What good does that do? That's not the state's job here. They HAVE to prove their case. Assumptions and exaggerations aren't proof.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[devildog 0]

lawrocket

***The FBI has already been here investigating the incident for federal charges.
It is my understanding they declined to press charges as there were no violations of law.

At least no violations of federal law. The Rodney King trial was about civil rights violations by sworn officers acting under color of authority. That's different from a private person.

Of course, it doesn't mean that Zimmerman won't be charged with terrorism. Seems to be the hip thing.

When there are riots after his acquittal, he'll be charged with inciting riots.

You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

[DanG 1]

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DanG, I can provide additional evidence if necessary.

That "evidence" has already been provided and responded to. I'll humor you in the very off chance that you're interested in what I have to say, and address the points one-by-one:

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“support for protest deployment” and “technical assistance”

These line items have been shown to be taken out of context. The "support for protest deployment" was truncated fromthe full line, which was "interregional support for protest deployment", and basically meant buying plane tickets and making travel arrangements for the CRS employees. It had nothing to do with which side they supported. The "technical assisstance" could be anything. Again, it doesn't say anything about what they may have advocated for.

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They [the CRS] helped set up a meeting between the local NAACP and elected officials...

That's what they are supposed to do, set up dialogues. How does that prove that they were advocating against Zimmerman?

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...that led to the temporary resignation of police Chief Bill Lee according to Turner Clayton, Seminole County chapter president of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.

The fact that the police chief resigned after the meeting has nothing to do with what the CRS did or did not do. If you can show that the CRS pushed for him to resign, then you'll have something.

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The paper quoted the Rev. Valarie Houston, pastor of Allen Chapel AME Church, a focal point for protesters, as saying “They were there for us,” after a March 20 meeting with CRS agents.

Without contect, that quote is meaningless. You choose to emphasize the words "us", as in "they were there for US (anti-Zimmerman people)." Neither of us knows if that's what the pastor meant, or if she simply meant that the CRS was there to help the citizens work through the issues, like they are supposed to. If a friend showed up to my Mom's funeral, my statement, "he was there for me," doesn't mean that he showed up for ME, and he was advocating against the rest of my family.

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DOJ employees with the CRS had arranged a 40-mile police escort for the students from Daytona Beach to Sanford.

Arranging for a police escort to make sure a peaceful protest stays that way seems pretty logical to me. Do you have evidence that a pro-Zimmerman group wanted a police escort and the CRS refused? That would help you argument.

And what's with the three paragraphs you quoted saying the same thing over and over? If that's a direct quote from the HawaiiReporter, they suck at reporting.

- Dan G

[normiss 633]

He actually made incorrect references to evidence...that's bad.
I think that might be what the juror with 2 notepads was comparing.

I think he did an amazing job. Of introducing reasonable doubt in everything he mentioned.