mnealtx 0
quade 3
QuoteQuoteQuote2 - Yes.
Oh, I see. You seem to think there's some magic form of telepathy or other form of communication the government can't tap into yet the average (or hell, even above average) citizen would be able to use?
Yes, that amazing telepathic program called PGP - I would ask if you've heard of it, but it's obvious you haven't.
Oh my, sir, you are naive if you think messages sent under PGP are not instantly flagged and nearly instantly cracked by the NSA.
Sending a message with PGP encryption is essentially the same thing as sending it via the Little Orphan Annie Secret Decoder Ring method. It will keep your messages to your mistress "secret" from perhaps your wife, but certainly not the NSA.
Got a cite for that?
Again, I say go for it!
Send out your email about armed revolution to 100 of your friends using whatever cryptological method you desire.
Let's see what happens!
But hell, don't take my advice. Take the advice of guys that have actually thought about it for more than a day or two.
http://www.ncmilitia.org/spycounterspy/fs006.html
Google up "NSA PGP" and you'll find hundreds of articles. Although nobody can say with 100% certainty what the capabilities of the NSA are, I think a person would have to almost be an imbecile to underestimate them and assume the planning for their "revolution" can take place unnoticed in today's post-9/11 US.
This is among the reasons the government has less fear of a large uprising and is terrified by very small cells and the "lone wolf."
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
You are giving the government far too much credit.
They failed to prevent 911 but in hindsight they had all the info they needed.
They failed to prevent Pearl Harbor.
The list goes on and on. In each case the government had the intell but failed to recognize it for what it was.
Hell, they had one of Jeff Dahmer's victims naked and pleading for help in the streets yet gave the poor S.O.B. back to that monster.
Another thing you fail to recognize is that in any large uprising or revolution, to destroy the revolutionaries you must destroy yourself to an equal or greater degree.
In case you still aren't convinced a small group of people can fuck over their government, one name: Somalia.
They failed to prevent 911 but in hindsight they had all the info they needed.
They failed to prevent Pearl Harbor.
The list goes on and on. In each case the government had the intell but failed to recognize it for what it was.
Hell, they had one of Jeff Dahmer's victims naked and pleading for help in the streets yet gave the poor S.O.B. back to that monster.
Another thing you fail to recognize is that in any large uprising or revolution, to destroy the revolutionaries you must destroy yourself to an equal or greater degree.
In case you still aren't convinced a small group of people can fuck over their government, one name: Somalia.
HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.
mnealtx 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote2 - Yes.
Oh, I see. You seem to think there's some magic form of telepathy or other form of communication the government can't tap into yet the average (or hell, even above average) citizen would be able to use?
Yes, that amazing telepathic program called PGP - I would ask if you've heard of it, but it's obvious you haven't.
Oh my, sir, you are naive if you think messages sent under PGP are not instantly flagged and nearly instantly cracked by the NSA.
Sending a message with PGP encryption is essentially the same thing as sending it via the Little Orphan Annie Secret Decoder Ring method. It will keep your messages to your mistress "secret" from perhaps your wife, but certainly not the NSA.
Got a cite for that?
Again, I say go for it!
Send out your email about armed revolution to 100 of your friends using whatever cryptological method you desire.
Let's see what happens!
But hell, don't take my advice. Take the advice of guys that have actually thought about it for more than a day or two.
http://www.ncmilitia.org/spycounterspy/fs006.html
Google up "NSA PGP" and you'll find hundreds of articles. Although nobody can say with 100% certainty what the capabilities of the NSA are, I think a person would have to almost be an imbecile to underestimate them and assume the planning for their "revolution" can take place unnoticed in today's post-9/11 US.
You make an AWFUL lot of assumptions. You assume that Fed.gov already has suspicions and has the person under surveillance. Then, they either have to break into the house and bug it, or TEMPEST the computer, or find where passphrases are written down - and do you *REALLY* think that someone that serious would have them written down?
You *do* realize that the last RSA challenge took just short of 3 years of calendar time, right?
And your example *still* doesn't support your "instantly flagged and decoded" statement.
Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
quade 3
QuoteIn case you still aren't convinced a small group of people can fuck over their government, one name: Somalia.
I'm almost certain the current, post-9/11 NSA has one or two more capabilities than Somalia ever dreamed of in detecting the early stages of an uprising.
While you may have a point about me perhaps overestimating the capabilities of the NSA, I'm equally certain you personally would be unwilling to gamble your current way of life on running the email experiment to find out.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
quade 3
QuoteAnd your example *still* doesn't support your "instantly flagged and decoded" statement.
Mike, I don't want to cast any aspersions on you so I'm hoping you don't take this personally because that is truly NOT the way it's intended, however, with the amount of on-line ill will you've shown toward certain members of the government, don't you think you're already flagged?
I'm not suggesting you've ever done anything too untoward or made any death threats or that the "government" has you bugged or anything . . . but . . . I can't for the life of me imagine a scenario that doesn't have "mnealtx" in a database somewhere to be kept watch on and if "mnealtx" sent out the previously proposed howeverthehell encrypted email about an armed revolt that it somehow wouldn't be instantly flagged and looked at.
And again, I don't mean this as any sort of insult at all. In fact, I think I'm probably in the exact same position.
What I'm fascinated in is that you've somehow not thought about it before and come to the exact same conclusion.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
mnealtx 0
QuoteQuoteAnd your example *still* doesn't support your "instantly flagged and decoded" statement.
Mike, I don't want to cast any aspersions on you so I'm hoping you don't take this personally because that is truly NOT the way it's intended, however, with the amount of ill will you've shown toward certain members of the government, don't you think you're already flagged?
Amount of ill will I've shown? I was unaware that sarcasm and satire was considered "ill will" these days.
QuoteI can't for the life of me imagine a scenario that doesn't have "mnealtx" in a database somewhere to be kept watch on and if "mnealtx" sent out the previously proposed howeverthehell encrypted email about an armed revolt that it somehow wouldn't be instantly flagged and looked at.
I'm sure that virtually all of us are in some sort of gov't database.
And you're making the assumption that the person would only use PGP for that single email....which is probably not the case.
QuoteAnd again, I don't mean this as any sort of insult at all. In fact, I think I'm probably in the exact same position.
As I said above, I think most all of us are on some sort of database or another.
QuoteWhat I'm fascinated in is that you've somehow not thought about it before and come to the exact same conclusion.
Again, you assume that the person is only going to use PGP for that one email.
Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
quade 3
QuoteAgain, you assume that the person is only going to use PGP for that one email.
Actually, Mike, the less you use encryption, the more difficult is it for people to crack. People are generally lazy and have a tendency to reuse passwords or make passwords that follow a pattern or use words in their messages that repeat from message to message. Those are among the ways Enigma was cracked in WWII.
For instance, if I was working for the NSA, one of the first patterns I'd be looking for in messages from AQ would be the Arabic equivalents of "God is great" because no matter what the message it's probably going to have that in there somewhere. I know it sounds like it would be silly attempting to look for that in the encrypted messages, but if I had thousands and thousands of them, even though they are encrypted, they'd still pop out like a sort thumb via statistical analysis. I used to do that sort of thing in high school for fun using the equivalents of Enigma messages. OK, they only had the equivalent of 5 or 6 wheels and I was programming in BASIC, but let's assume the NSA has better computers, smarter people and it's not just a hobby.
So the plotter of the "revolution" is kinda screwed either way. If he ONLY sends out one encrypted message, it's going to pop up as something unusual. If he's ALWAYS sending encrypted messages, they probably have noticed that and already have his passwords he normally uses and they don't even have to bother "cracking" it; just open it up like they normally do.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
Oh my, sir, you are naive if you think messages sent under PGP are not instantly flagged and nearly instantly cracked by the NSA.
Sending a message with PGP encryption is essentially the same thing as sending it via the Little Orphan Annie Secret Decoder Ring method. It will keep your messages to your mistress "secret" from perhaps your wife, but certainly not the NSA.
Got a cite for that?
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706