tax cuts or tax hikes

[mnealtx 0]

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Well, there are data, which do NOT show revenue increases associated with tax cuts

Funny you mention that - the inflation-adjusted numbers show increases after 2003, when the full tax rate reductions kicked in and the capital gains tax cuts went into effect.

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, and there are opinions.

Like the rest of your response, yes.

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If revenues had continued to increase at the rate they did during the Clinton years, instead of being sabotaged by Bush&Co's tax cuts, the problem would be miniscule.

They wouldn't have, regardless - funny how the tech bubble bursting and the initial effects of the 9/11 attack on the economy never make it into your 'figuring' when you discuss that time frame.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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means-test medicare and social security.

I believe this will happen BUT where do you draw the line John? People that have $XXX in retirement funds don't get all there S.S.?

I think the only fair approach is to base it on income during peoples' working careers.

People buying large homes and new cars every few years should be treated the same as other people with the same income who opted for yearly five figure retirement account contributions instead.

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How long for everyone stops paying into a 401K (for example) when they realize the gov is going to take part of it to fund the people that didn't bother?

1. The government already does this by considering 401k withdrawals income and taxing Social Security payments as income crosses certain levels (currently 25K/34K for half the benefit to be taxable for single people/married couples and 34K/44K for Social Security to be fully taxable).

2. Retirement vehicles like the 401K and IRA can replace 100% of your pre-retirement income starting at age 59 1/2.

For single high-earners Social Security replaces 1/3 of their pre-retirement income starting at age 70.

Needing to work an extra decade after which you take a 2/3 pay cut doesn't sound like much fun to me.

[hwt 0]

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>this answer is so easy...

Cool! What's the answer?

>It depends on how big you want your government to be.

Looks like the answer isn't so easy for you.

The answer is actually quite simple. If all you do is cut a few programs and cut taxes the budget problem will get worse, not better.

>I for one would like them to stay the f__k . . . .

And this is why we will never balance the budget. Everytime someone tries, a politician hijacks the effort for their personal agendas. "Yes, we should cut spending to fund abortions! ABORTIONS! Evil! Liberal anti-life partial birth abortions killing blah blah blah . . ."

And the next six months is spent debating that point. And in the end someone finally realizes that federal funding does NOT go to abortions. And so they move on to cut funding for Sesame Street. And nothing changes.

Want to make a difference? Cuts across the board. Including veteran's care, military, roads - everything, no matter whose sacred cow it is. Then raise taxes to cover the difference. Once we pay off the debt, reduce taxes again.

Don't want to make a difference? Then get on a soapbox and go on and on about abortion, or nanny government, or solar subsidies, or PBS funding.

The answer is simply cut this corrupt government down to bare bones...let the private sector do everything including the postal service.

2+ trillion a year is not enough??
that amount is way to much...

[kelpdiver 2]

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If revenues had continued to increase at the rate they did during the Clinton years, instead of being sabotaged by Bush&Co's tax cuts, the problem would be miniscule.

But that revenue wasn't going to increase any longer, regardless of the tax cuts, or the 9/11 matters. That was a bubble, and the governments benefited greatly from the oversized capital gains on an inflated NASDAQ. The roth ira conversions were also being paid for from from 1997-2000.

Clearly Bush didn't improve matters by both cutting taxes and substantially increasing federal spending, and getting us stuck in two major wars. Yet pointing to 1999 as the answer ignores the reality that it was on borrowed time. It was a glorious year, without a doubt, but one we can't expect as normal.

[kelpdiver 2]

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The military spending cuts I do not agree with
Although some what of a smaller cut is needed

you can't complain about excess spending yet insist that Defense remain near full budget.

[billvon 2,593]

>The answer is simply cut this corrupt government down to bare bones...

. . . and increase taxation to pay off our debts. Once we do that, we can reduce taxes again. Trying to pay off your credit card bills by just not spending any more doesn't work. You also actually have to pay them off.

[rushmc 18]

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The military spending cuts I do not agree with
Although some what of a smaller cut is needed

you can't complain about excess spending yet insist that Defense remain near full budget.

Yes I can
My opinion is based on what I think our priorities need to be and the primary role of our Federal Gov

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[flashvortx 0]

One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

[Amazon 7]

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One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

Gee millions of businesses and individual Americans use the USPS every day.... Funni Dat.... They seem to know why its there.

[kelpdiver 2]

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The military spending cuts I do not agree with
Although some what of a smaller cut is needed

you can't complain about excess spending yet insist that Defense remain near full budget.

Yes I can
My opinion is based on what I think our priorities need to be and the primary role of our Federal Gov

you can do anything, but it's ridiculous to oppose both tax increases and a substantial cut of the defense spending, yet think you could end up with a balanced budget. It shows a refusal to face reality, or basic math.

[flashvortx 0]

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One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

Gee millions of businesses and individual Americans use the USPS every day.... Funni Dat.... They seem to know why its there.

Yeah but it is run by the government. Why should the government still be running it when there are plenty of businesses that already do what it does. Is it becasue the government is better at doing what the private sector can do? I don't think so. Wasn't one of the reasons the Post Office was started because it wasn't practical for public companies to provide that service at the time?

[Amazon 7]

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One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

Gee millions of businesses and individual Americans use the USPS every day.... Funni Dat.... They seem to know why its there.

Yeah but it is run by the government. Why should the government still be running it when there are plenty of businesses that already do what it does. Is it becasue the government is better at doing what the private sector can do? I don't think so. Wasn't one of the reasons the Post Office was started because it wasn't practical for public companies to provide that service at the time?

Have you sent a letter via UPS or Fed EX or DHL????

How much did that cost you?

All they are doing is going after the cream on the top of the shipping business..

[flashvortx 0]

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One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

Gee millions of businesses and individual Americans use the USPS every day.... Funni Dat.... They seem to know why its there.

Yeah but it is run by the government. Why should the government still be running it when there are plenty of businesses that already do what it does. Is it becasue the government is better at doing what the private sector can do? I don't think so. Wasn't one of the reasons the Post Office was started because it wasn't practical for public companies to provide that service at the time?

Have you sent a letter via UPS or Fed EX or DHL????

How much did that cost you?

All they are doing is going after the cream on the top of the shipping business..

I haven't sent a letter through other companies because the USPS does it for cheap. But guess what. It isn't cheap because the Post Office is extremely efficient at sending out mail. They've been losing money. The government shouldn't be supporting a failing company just so I can send out a letter for $.45 or whatever it is. UPS and FedEx are making money btw.

[KidWicked 0]

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eliminate loopholes

Agree, only if your corrupt asshats in Chicago are included or will they goon there way around this?

Do you think the inclusion or exclusion of Chicago in such matters could possibly have any effect on the sheer size of the numbers that we're talking about? It would be less than a rounding error.

Or did you just want to make a vaguely political jab? You strike me as someone who prefers to be told what to think.

Coreece: "You sound like some skinheads I know, but your prejudice is with Christians, not niggers..."

[Amazon 7]

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One of the only political ideas I've ever been somewhat excited about is Pawlenty's "if you can google it, cut it." I just like the idea. Government should be small in my opinion.

I don't know why the Post Office still exists...

Gee millions of businesses and individual Americans use the USPS every day.... Funni Dat.... They seem to know why its there.

Yeah but it is run by the government. Why should the government still be running it when there are plenty of businesses that already do what it does. Is it becasue the government is better at doing what the private sector can do? I don't think so. Wasn't one of the reasons the Post Office was started because it wasn't practical for public companies to provide that service at the time?

Have you sent a letter via UPS or Fed EX or DHL????

How much did that cost you?

All they are doing is going after the cream on the top of the shipping business..

I haven't sent a letter through other companies because the USPS does it for cheap. But guess what. It isn't cheap because the Post Office is extremely efficient at sending out mail. They've been losing money. The government shouldn't be supporting a failing company just so I can send out a letter for $.45 or whatever it is. UPS and FedEx are making money btw.

RIGHT.. They are making money.. at all of our expense. They are only taking the profitable side of the business. they do NOT want to deliver mail

Just like the insurance companies will not insure old people... they want only profit... and their death panels could care less about people older than 55. That is why the government started medicare because the death panel companies had would not take care of people.

I swear to god the right wing is a bunch of fucking hypocrites.. talking about family values.... I guess that does not extend to their parents who raised them and took care of them... they are just a fucking inconvinience.

I hope everyone of those who wishes to gut medicare and SS end up out in the woods dieing alone.. just like the cave men did thousands of years ago. I really do hope you get the wonderful Somali government you fuckers want... in the not too distant future... no responsibilities.. dog eat dog conservatards piss me the fuck off.

[flashvortx 0]

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RIGHT.. They are making money.. at all of our expense. They are only taking the profitable side of the business. they do NOT want to deliver mail

Just like the insurance companies will not insure old people... they want only profit... and their death panels could care less about people older than 55. That is why the government started medicare because the death panel companies had would not take care of people.

I swear to god the right wing is a bunch of fucking hypocrites.. talking about family values.... I guess that does not extend to their parents who raised them and took care of them... they are just a fucking inconvinience.

I hope everyone of those who wishes to gut medicare and SS end up out in the woods dieing alone.. just like the cave men did thousands of years ago. I really do hope you get the wonderful Somali government you fuckers want... in the not too distant future... no responsibilities.. dog eat dog conservatards piss me the fuck off.

I'm just talking about the Post Office here bra. You really don't think our government is a little bit too big?

[Amazon 7]

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RIGHT.. They are making money.. at all of our expense. They are only taking the profitable side of the business. they do NOT want to deliver mail

Just like the insurance companies will not insure old people... they want only profit... and their death panels could care less about people older than 55. That is why the government started medicare because the death panel companies had would not take care of people.

I swear to god the right wing is a bunch of fucking hypocrites.. talking about family values.... I guess that does not extend to their parents who raised them and took care of them... they are just a fucking inconvinience.

I hope everyone of those who wishes to gut medicare and SS end up out in the woods dieing alone.. just like the cave men did thousands of years ago. I really do hope you get the wonderful Somali government you fuckers want... in the not too distant future... no responsibilities.. dog eat dog conservatards piss me the fuck off.

I'm just talking about the Post Office here bra. You really don't think our government is a little bit too big?

I am just sick of a bunch of whiney tea bagging cunts that want all the services this government provides.. yet they sure as hell are a bunch of assholes that do not want to contribute to pay for all the things they want. ( or have THEIR favorite government handout cut)

Is there waste you fucking bet... but all the things all the idiots are demanding to be cut..... do not add up to SQUAT.

Sure.. I am ready to turn it all over to the rich and the corporations and see how many decades that " We the People" like that.

Lets get the Rollerball Corporate leagues going... you need to entertain your rich corporate masters with some of your BLOOD.. after you have given them all of your money as the Tea Bagging assholes wish to do.

I can exist in that dog eat dog world... I want to see just how committed these stupid muther fuckers are to a true capitalist system with a big time return of the robber barons...

Lets be sure to get all the children back into the sweat shops too.. who needs to pay for educations either... put those little fuckers to work... well the ones not sold into the human trafficking business as they are in so many places now.

Privatize the USPS>.. send a letter to the other side of the country... yeah.. $15 should be a good price..... great for the bottom line of a few... not so good for anyone wanting to send Christmas cards.


All the usual suspects are creaming in their jeans just waiting for this wet dream world of no taxes... and work till they are 80... or drop dead... from the pollution of the water and air.. who the fuck needs those stupid EPA protections.. the corporation will take care of everything.

[rushmc 18]

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The military spending cuts I do not agree with
Although some what of a smaller cut is needed

you can't complain about excess spending yet insist that Defense remain near full budget.

Yes I can
My opinion is based on what I think our priorities need to be and the primary role of our Federal Gov

you can do anything, but it's ridiculous to oppose both tax increases and a substantial cut of the defense spending, yet think you could end up with a balanced budget. It shows a refusal to face reality, or basic math.

I think it shows your refusal to face reality or use basic math.

I do think we can end up with a balanced budget
We have a spending problem, not a revenue problem

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,593]

>I do think we can end up with a balanced budget

OK. What would you cut?

[mirage62 0]

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....All the usual suspects are creaming in their jeans just waiting for this wet dream world of no taxes... and work till they are 80... or drop dead... from the pollution of the water and air.. who the fuck needs those stupid EPA protections.. the corporation will take care of everything.

Do you actually READ what you write or do you just spew stuff?

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[kelpdiver 2]

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The big enchilada is SS and Medicare and I think those should have been means tested a long time ago. I don't want to see someone that was born with a disability, had a freak accident or has just been sucker-punched in the back of the head by life suffer or live in a one room rat-hole for their entire life. But, on the flip side I don't want to pay to continue to support fat greasy people that did nothing with the opportunities in this country OR those that have taken advantage of same and made out pretty good. I know it's a huge grey area but lines would have to be drawn somewhere.

so how exactly do you (anyone) want to apply means testing here? Base it on annual income? SS is already taxed pretty quickly based on income. What would likely result out of this is that people would draw out of their retirement accounts every two years, so they would qualify one year, and lose it the next.

Means test on overall wealth versus life expectancy? Now you're really sticking it to those who actually saved, and possibly setting them up to run out of money in their latter years, which is already a crapshoot in financial planning.

and does means testing actually fix the inherent flaws in both systems, or just delay the downfall, just as has happened with the substantial increases in taxes for both of these? For the past 25+ years, those tax increases subsidized a lot of deficit spending.

[hwt 0]

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>I do think we can end up with a balanced budget

OK. What would you cut?

1. I would cut EPA ...why ? because laws should be legislated only by congress.
2. Military in half for starters ( 900 bases is way too many )
3. Dept. education ...let the states handle it.

i could go on and with all the redundant agencies.
face it this government fails at everything it sticks it's nose into.
60 - 80 billion in fraud a year in medicare ...
4. Obama care... does not need an explanation.

This government has a spending problem .
We could tax all the billionaires and get 1 trillion dollars from taking all they have and then what ? .. Obama wants to spend 4 times that amount in one year. I say do not raise the debt limit and allow this president to borrow another dime from China or rob us any more by lowering the value of our currency.

[kelpdiver 2]

if it were so easy to fix the excess spending by attacking "waste and fraud," wouldn't we have done it by now?

[sfzombie 3]

you would think, right? apparently not, because it is just that easy. if you could find someone with a set of balls to do it. but politicians are always up for re-election. lobbyists want their say in the government. and of course, they're all lawyers.

http://kitswv.com

[hwt 0]

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if it were so easy to fix the excess spending by attacking "waste and fraud," wouldn't we have done it by now?

Congress has not even passed a budget for 2 years .
i do not think that it would be easy because they can not stop spending even now Obama wants to put us 17 trillion in the hole. what happens next year?