Tell me again why alcohol should be legal and pot shouldn't be.

[doughboyshred 0]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101101/ap_on_he_me/eu_med_dangerous_alcohol

Actually, why alcohol should be legal, and all the drugs you don't like shouldn't be.

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Alcohol is more dangerous than illegal drugs like heroin and crack cocaine, according to a new study.
British experts evaluated substances including alcohol, cocaine, heroin, ecstasy and marijuana, ranking them based on how destructive they are to the individual who takes them and to society as a whole.
Researchers analyzed how addictive a drug is and how it harms the human body, in addition to other criteria like environmental damage caused by the drug, its role in breaking up families and its economic costs, such as health care, social services, and prison.
Heroin, crack cocaine and methamphetamine, or crystal meth, were the most lethal to individuals. When considering their wider social effects, alcohol, heroin and crack cocaine were the deadliest. But overall, alcohol outranked all other substances, followed by heroin and crack cocaine. Marijuana, ecstasy and LSD scored far lower.

As I've stated before, I don't use anything, but support legalization of all drugs.

I want to hear arguments from those of you that drink but are adamant against legalization of other drugs.

[happythoughts 0]

The basis of this guys mathematics are poor.

Alcohol is legal, so the opportunities for car crashes and damage are larger. More drinkers.

Heroin (and other opium products) are not as widely used.
Very few fatalities from its use.

Damage is not as good a measurement unless the user pool was equal.

When opium was legal in China, the impact was much larger. It destroyed many lives.

Pot has a larger user base in the US and has less
damaging effects than alcohol, in terms of violence
while under use.

In all the NIH stats, the reports seem to make an effort
to find a poor reason to support the legal system.
It is obvious that they bow to politics and funding.

[skipbelt 0]

up and at 'em adam ant !

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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Actually, why alcohol should be legal, and all the drugs you don't like shouldn't be.

Some of the reasons the general populace has bought into anti-marijuanna laws are that Marijuana turns Mexicans crazy, makes black men rape white women, and turns kids into pacifists who won't fight for our great country.

More plausible reasons are that hemp threatened DuPont's paper market revenues, InBev does not want the competition (Anheuser-Busch was a Partnership for a Drug Free America contributor), and the California Correctional Peace Officers Association prison guards' union wants full employment.

It's political and all makes perfect sense once you look at who benefits.

[doughboyshred 0]

huh, second person that doesn't seem to know what adamant means.

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adamant -
ad·a·mant   
[ad-uh-muhnt, -mant] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
utterly unyielding in attitude or opinion in spite of all appeals, urgings, etc.

Am I missing something here?

[Andy9o8 0]

See bulls-eyes at posts #s 2 & 4.
Lock the thread.

[RonD1120 58]

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See bulls-eyes at posts #s 2 & 4.
Lock the thread.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[wolfriverjoe 1,366]

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huh, second person that doesn't seem to know what adamant means.

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adamant -
ad·a·mant   
[ad-uh-muhnt, -mant] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
utterly unyielding in attitude or opinion in spite of all appeals, urgings, etc.

Am I missing something here?

Yep. It's not a what, it's a who

Damn, I'm old.

Anybody else remember "World Gone Wild"?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[stayhigh 2]

i find it funny when someone says "I haven't done single drug but I think all should be legal."

I definitely don't want to have crack head or meth head as my neighbor.

Social effects of Meth and Crack is way higher than Alchohol.

the writer must been on meth and crack for days and nights to say that heroin is safer than alcohol.

Bernie Sanders for President 2016

[Meso 38]

How so?

The reason why alcohol seems so 'safe' is because it's legal. And the reason why most other drugs seem to dangerous is because they are... illegal.

Look back at prohibition to see what alcohol does to society when it's put in the same environment as other drugs are.

I'm straight edge, I will not touch any substances... And I support the legalization of substances.

One of the reasons why alcohol is such common place is because people think that because something is legal it must naturally be a lot better for you than the illegal substances.

Now that's not to say I'd want to have someone I know on heroin rather than alcohol, that's definitely not the case (and I`m not going to say I can say that alcohol is worse than heroin). But as for neighbours... Crack, Alcohol- what's the difference... The only reason to worry about crackhead neighbours would be because what they're doing is illegal and as such they are 'criminals'.

Think about it, you're far more likely to have pre-existing criminals doing crack and meth as opposed to just alcohol. So I'm sure much of their personality traits and actions are determined on that pre-existing criminal behaviour and not on the crack or meth.

[rnicks 0]

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As I've stated before, I don't use anything, but support legalization of all drugs.

Visit any ICU and see the effects cocaine has and I bet you change your mind.

[stayhigh 2]

Crack and Meth changes personality traits.

smoke meth for a year or two and you'll find yourself to be way way different thinking state than two years ago.
(way more aggressive and perverted, onset of stimulant psychosis)


if Hitler wasn't so much on speed, history might have changed.

and also I haven't seen drunk or pot head stealing other people's car in order to support their habit.

Why don't I want meth neighbors???
Cause I wanna keep my garage door open unattended time to time??? and not worry about shit missing???

and guess what,
Meth and Cocain is schedule 2 drug meant to be much more safer than marijuana which is shedule 1 drug.
and they ARE legal.

Bernie Sanders for President 2016

[Meso 38]

Anti-depressants also cause a change in personality traits too (and no not just changing ones mood)? As well as many other prescription medicine.

I have a few friends who do meth, heroin, cocaine and I've known them from before they used (over 5 years ago) and they haven't changed when they aren't high.

The most prevalent changes you will see is the change in priorities, which I've seen happen in people who turn to alcoholics too.

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Why don't I want meth neighbors???
Cause I wanna keep my garage door open unattended time to time??? and not worry about shit missing???

Again this is mostly an issue caused by the persons prior criminal history or upbringing, not a result of the drug. There are many fiends who don't turn to crime. Look at the crimes committed to obtain alcohol as well during prohibition.

I don't deny the problems in meth and coke. I had a girlfriend who's father was a successful architect, but he became a meth addict. While he never resorted to any crime, he did destroy his child's life. But I've seen alcohol ruin much more families.

[Meso 38]

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And also I haven't seen drunk or pot head stealing other people's car in order to support their habit.

There are plenty alcoholics out there who commit crime to support their habit.

More time is spent trying to address the problem and not enough is spent on fixing the cause of the problem. Drugs aren't the problem, ignorance and fucked up lives are the problem.

Wipe crack, meth, heroin away and you'll find that new drugs will be used/found. Or they`ll just go back to using glue and methelated spirits. (which is what some still do anyway).

[stayhigh 2]

look bro, thread was about weed and let's keep it there.

your thought of legalization of all drugs sound obsurd.
go do meth for yourself for the next two weeks and let see..
how are you gonna say anything if you haven't done it huh???

btw go vote yes on prop 19, if you live in California.

Bernie Sanders for President 2016

[doughboyshred 0]

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As I've stated before, I don't use anything, but support legalization of all drugs.

Visit any ICU and see the effects cocaine has and I bet you change your mind.

So, you think alcohol should be illegal, or do the effects of drunk driving not bother you at the same ICU?

[doughboyshred 0]

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look bro, thread was about weed and let's keep it there.

your thought of legalization of all drugs sound obsurd.
go do meth for yourself for the next two weeks and let see..
how are you gonna say anything if you haven't done it huh???

btw go vote yes on prop 19, if you live in California.

read my op, it was about all drugs. Only the title is weed.

[Andy9o8 0]

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your thought of legalization of all drugs sounds absurd.

I'm sure he means just for adults and not for children, too.

A lot of people oppose governmental "paternalism" for adults, i.e., laws that restrict an adult's freedom to decide for himself what is or is not too risky for himself. Drug laws are one of the more blatant examples of that in our society.

Although it's an imperfect analogy (which I'm not willing to go off on a tangent discussing at length), a lot of very ordinary, clear-thinking people consider skydiving to be so dangerous that they simply cannot fathom what could possess a sane person to ever do it. Yet you prefer to make that decision for yourself; and if ever a law prohibiting skydiving were contemplated, I'm sure you'd howl.

[rnicks 0]

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As I've stated before, I don't use anything, but support legalization of all drugs.

Visit any ICU and see the effects cocaine has and I bet you change your mind.

So, you think alcohol should be illegal, or do the effects of drunk driving not bother you at the same ICU?

Just because one may choose to drink alcohol does NOT mean they will choose to drive. However, if one chooses to do cocaine, even the smallest amount, they choose to run the risk of hemorrhage.

[Meso 38]

I would vote yes on it, but I live in South Africa.

And don't you try tell me that one has to personally do something to have an opinion on it.

I have enough stories and experience through friends using to know exactly how each drug plays out, and it leads me to the conclusion that meth fucks up lives, heroin fucks up lives, BUT alcohol also fucks up lives.

But clearly the current approach isn't working. And prohibition showed that the same approach on alcohol didn't work too.

People are going to fuck up their lives and those around theirs whether you make it legal or not. Putting the cookie car on top of the fridge isn't going to stop a kid from dipping his hand in.

There is no easy quick fix (excuse the pun) to the problem. But as I said, clearly the current approach isn't working.

And one can deny it as much as they like, alcohol kills and harms plenty people- whether it be the drunks on the road or the domestic abuse. I know I'd rather run paths with a crack head in the streets than a drunk on the road.

[Andy9o8 0]

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Just because one may choose to drink alcohol does NOT mean they will choose to drive. However, if one chooses to do cocaine, even the smallest amount, they choose to run the risk of hemorrhage.

(With respect to adults only):
To you, the key phrase in your post is "run the risk of hemorrhage". To me, the key phrase is "they choose".

[Meso 38]

By drinking just a few shots you run the risk of impairing your judgement and driving drunk.

And the way I see it, I don't give a fuck about someone causing harm to their own body, that's their issue. And who is anyone to tell someone they must stop doing coke because they may harm themselves.

I only care when children or the innocent are effected by others actions. And this happens in many cases of drunk driving, yet very rarely in cases of cocaine usage. (And since we're on a skydiving forum, one can't use the 'the put themselves in an increased risk of death, which leaves kids parentless' argument).

I know a lot of drug users, yet funnily enough all the deaths of people I know have been alcohol related.

[doughboyshred 0]

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As I've stated before, I don't use anything, but support legalization of all drugs.

Visit any ICU and see the effects cocaine has and I bet you change your mind.

So, you think alcohol should be illegal, or do the effects of drunk driving not bother you at the same ICU?

Just because one may choose to drink alcohol does NOT mean they will choose to drive. However, if one chooses to do cocaine, even the smallest amount, they choose to run the risk of hemorrhage.

They choose to run the risk of hemorrhage to themselves.

As a skydiver don't you support a persons choice as to what risks they are willing to take for fun?

And, if you don't think coke is fun, you haven't tried it.

[winsor 189]

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look bro, thread was about weed and let's keep it there.

your thought of legalization of all drugs sound obsurd.
go do meth for yourself for the next two weeks and let see..
how are you gonna say anything if you haven't done it huh???

btw go vote yes on prop 19, if you live in California.

Legalizing any drug that is not demonstrably worse than alcohol or tobacco makes sense. You would be hard put to come up with a worse drug than either of these.

Methamphetamine is clinically indicated an awful lot more often than either of the aforementioned substances, and the same applies to cocaine and diamorphine (heroin). All of these are prescribed legally.

Good old water is fatal if you drink enough (witness the death of the "how much water can you drink?" contest winner).

While I advise against the use of most any mind-altering substance unless REALLY medically necessary, it is easily demonstrated that by resorting to prohibition, the cure is substantially worse than the disease.

One of the reasons we as a society (such as it is) are swirling down the bowl is that we make major decisisons for emotional reasons, and rationalize them despite irrefutable evidence to the contrary.

'Twas ever thus.


BSBD,

Winsor

[rnicks 0]

???

I don't understand. Explain further please?? (Sorry, I'm a bit slow at times!)