wolfriverjoe 1,346 #26 February 9, 2010 Quote As I said, I only used 'inciting a riot' as an example. What if, that propaganda being passed out, I found offensive? Kids need to be allowed to be kids and don't need some whack-job trying to push their point of view down their throats. Perfect example of 'just say no'. My point was, our 'freedoms' are being stretched to the breaking point. Where does it stop? I reserve the right to knock some klansman or neo-nazi on his ass if he tried to hand my kid his propaganda! Freedom of expression! Chuck Chuck Sorry but I disagree. (And knocking him on his ass will get you an assault charge - that's what he wants) How about instead, reading the propaganda with your kid and showing them how wrong the propaganda is? Most of that crap is actually pretty funny if you read it carefully. Use it as a "teaching moment" to show how wrong hate and prejudice are. To teach about how many people throughout history (and even recent history) have been hurt and killed because of beliefs just like those. I'm of the opinion that even prejudiced and hateful speech should be allowed. And shown for the lies and stupidity it is. Like turning the lights on and watching the cockroaches run away."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #27 February 9, 2010 Quote How about instead, reading the propaganda with your kid and showing them how wrong the propaganda is? Yes. Either you can address this problem with your kids, or the scumbags can. The white supremicists have been passing out the same shit for decades. It used to be poorly xeroxed (like all good commie pamphlets, but now we're in the golden age of quality home laser printers, so it doesn't look like shit anymore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #28 February 9, 2010 Good point! Not a good idea to get violent with those types but they can draw-out those feelings.. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georgerussia 0 #29 February 9, 2010 Quote You know nothing. Obviously. And not much more about Germany or perhaps Europe. Indeed. For those who want to learn I'd suggest to read at least Shirer's "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" before judging. It is memoir style (not strictly a historic book supported by research), but it is easy to read and explains a lot of things which may be difficult to understand for those who didn't live in this culture.* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. * Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #30 February 9, 2010 QuoteQuote You know nothing. Obviously. And not much more about Germany or perhaps Europe. Indeed. For those who want to learn I'd suggest to read at least Shirer's "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" before judging. I'm not judging by the past. I'm judging by the present. Suppressing open discussion leads to bad results. While she seems to remain doomed to repeat the past, it seems like the authorities have it right. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #31 February 10, 2010 Quote....To teach about how many people throughout history (and even recent history) have been hurt and killed because of beliefs just like those. Boy! THAT'S going to open up a can of worms. Now you have to include nearly every religious group and nearly every political party throughout the entire world. But I DO like your approach to things with respect to the kids.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #32 February 10, 2010 Quote...While she seems to remain doomed to repeat the past, it seems like the authorities have it right. Could be a matter of perspective. It's kinda hard, if not impossible, to truly empathize when you haven't actually gone through the ordeals that form that perspective. It's also hard to remove yourself out from under the rock of propaganda you've been subjected to in your own world.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #33 February 10, 2010 QuoteThe neo-Nazi National Democratic Party will be allowed to distribute CDs outside schools with interviews and music by party members because authorities have no legal grounds to stop them, a report said Saturday. The Federal Department for Media Harmful to Young Persons said the disc merely contained political opinions, daily Süddeutsche Zeitung reported. http://www.thelocal.de/national/20100206-25077.html Some people aren't able to distinguish names, titles and translations from different countries. The NPD is Germany's leading far-right party. It promotes an anti-immigrant agenda and is considered by the country's domestic intelligence agency to be a threat to the constitution. Threat to the const; just like here. In the US we call peole with this agenda, Republicans. Of course here they are also a threat to the national debt. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #34 February 10, 2010 Quote Quote The biggest Nazi parties are not from/in Germany. You surely know that. Sure, when your population is only 82M, it's likely to be true. But have no illusion that the term will ever be more greatly associated with some other nation. No illusion. Facts. That term already IS associated with the US. In present times. Your Nazi guys are doing their best to be known worldwide. That has nothing to do with our small population of about 80 millions. Why do you guys love those Nazi parties in your country that much? The Nazi Party got 59 million votes in Nov 2008, fortunately the party that defends us from the Nazis got 69M. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #35 February 10, 2010 Quote Why do you guys love those Nazi parties in your country that much? The Nazi Party got 59 million votes in Nov 2008, fortunately the party that defends us from the Nazis got 69M. Holy Cow. What a successful party dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sebcat 0 #36 February 10, 2010 Quote Holy Cow. What a successful party Unless that's sarcasm, here's a hint for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Nationwide_results Edited to add: Germany is not the only country to have laws like this. Hate speech can give you two years in prison here in Sweden (or four if it's considered to be major). Public diplay of a swastika is considered "hate speech" here. A very subjective law, a movie poster for inglourious basterds can have a swastika in it, but if someone (white) walks down the street wearing a swastika printed on his/her shirt they'll probably get arrested. People have been arrested and convicted for that in the past. It has everything to do with the intention of course, the court has to prove that he/she was spreading a message of hate and that a group of people got offended by it. I'm not a nazi, but that law doesn't make much sense to me. Of course, if you look at the history, it might be justified... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #37 February 10, 2010 Quote Quote Holy Cow. What a successful party Unless that's sarcasm, here's a hint for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Nationwide_results OK, what's ur point? Obama's election pertains how? There are relevant comparisons to the Nazi Party and the current-day Republicans. Please, oh please ask me how. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sebcat 0 #38 February 10, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Holy Cow. What a successful party Unless that's sarcasm, here's a hint for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Nationwide_results OK, what's ur point? Obama's election pertains how? There are relevant comparisons to the Nazi Party and the current-day Republicans. Please, oh please ask me how. My point was to show that you compared the republican party to nazis. Nothing more, nothing less. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #39 February 10, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Quote Holy Cow. What a successful party Unless that's sarcasm, here's a hint for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Nationwide_results OK, what's ur point? Obama's election pertains how? There are relevant comparisons to the Nazi Party and the current-day Republicans. Please, oh please ask me how. My point was to show that you compared the republican party to nazis. Nothing more, nothing less. OK, so Obama fgures in how???? But yes, there are relvant comparisons to the Germanyt Nazis and the current-day Repubs as with their ideoligies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sebcat 0 #40 February 10, 2010 QuoteOK, so Obama fgures in how???? I provided a link with the election results that showed that the republican party got 59M votes, the same amount you said the Nazi party got, thus making a clarification as to what you referred to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,346 #41 February 10, 2010 QuoteQuote....To teach about how many people throughout history (and even recent history) have been hurt and killed because of beliefs just like those. Boy! THAT'S going to open up a can of worms. Now you have to include nearly every religious group and nearly every political party throughout the entire world. But I DO like your approach to things with respect to the kids. Yep - Every group has hurt and killed those they don't like. And every group has the right to free speech. And I've long been a stong advocate of teaching kids the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Usually they are smart enough to realize what's going on. I am very grateful to my parents for raising me that way. It's when they are taught only one side, and taught that a particular point of view is the only way to go that hate and prejudice take over."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #42 February 10, 2010 QuoteQuote...While she seems to remain doomed to repeat the past, it seems like the authorities have it right. Could be a matter of perspective. It's kinda hard, if not impossible, to truly empathize when you haven't actually gone through the ordeals that form that perspective. It's also hard to remove yourself out from under the rock of propaganda you've been subjected to in your own world. I doubt that she experienced WW2. I don't even know how much of the Cold War she experienced, or which side of the Wall she lived on. I would think that living in the East would garner an appreciation for openness over suppression. But yes, her frame of references seems to prevent her from appreciating what free speech is. Has a bit of an Animal Farm feel to it. The pigs can talk freely. The other animals can only do it in the luggage compartment under the bus. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #43 February 11, 2010 QuoteQuoteOK, so Obama fgures in how???? I provided a link with the election results that showed that the republican party got 59M votes, the same amount you said the Nazi party got, thus making a clarification as to what you referred to. Sure, that was my point. Not the vote number per se, but the ideology of the Nazi Party and the tactics of the current Repub Party. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
