SkyChimp 0
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There's a lot more dead people on this Earth than live ones. Ain't none of the dead ones talkin'. Cause when your dead.....your dead.
People are crazy. Cuz there's more of 'em.
Quote"Ain't none of the dead ones talkin'. Cause when your dead.....your dead".
This is the sound of the spiritually dying. You dont see that we're already dead, and that only in death can we find life.
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteHere's a question... Why only have a problem with God and not Allah? You engage the bible but not the Qur'an. Are you intimidated by Muslims but not Christians? The Qur'an is most violent, yet I never see any attacks on Islam. Just food for thought. If you're going to pick on a group of people that say you are sinners, then I want to see you have the balls to pick on a group of people that will kill you if you don't convert to their beliefs.
I agree with this. I live in the middle east right now, and unless you've ever lived here, you woud not understand their culture at all. Many (americans) would be quite offended that is for sure. But you bring up an interesting point about other beliefs still focusing on sin as quite a disruption on their spiritual journeys.
Sin is what keeps people from God, but also, ultimately, what brings us closer to him.
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteServants Finish Their Tasks
by Rick Warren
-------------------------------------------------------
"Well done, my good and faithful servant. You have been
faithful in handling this small amount, so now I will give you
many more responsibilities. Let's celebrate together!"
Matthew 25:23 (NLT)
Real servants are faithful to their ministry. Servants finish
their tasks, fulfill their responsibilities, keep their promises,
and complete their commitments. They don't leave a job half
done, and they don't quit when they get discouraged. They are
trustworthy and dependable.
Faithfulness has always been a rare quality (Psalm 12:1;
Proverbs 20:6; Philippians 2:19-22).
Most people don't know the meaning of commitment. They
make commitments casually, then break them for the slightest
reason without any hesitation, remorse, or regret. Every week,
churches and other organizations must improvise because
volunteers didn't prepare, didn't show up, or didn't even call to
say they weren't coming.
Can you be counted on by others? Are there promises you
need to keep, vows you need to fulfill, or commitments you
need to honor?
I am certainly a bruised reed, but I am glad their are good and faithful servants out there, working with what they were given :)
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteQuote"Ain't none of the dead ones talkin'. Cause when your dead.....your dead".
This is the sound of the spiritually dying. You dont see that we're already dead, and that only in death can we find life.
Only in death??
Am I already dead while enjoying the early sun light and the cold breath of a beautiful December morning?
I feel alive - can't tell you, how much! - , that's a fact for me.
Sorry, cannot follow you.
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
dudeist skydiver # 3105
lurch 0
"Spiritually dying"? What kind of condescending crap is THAT? I hate to step into these threads but I gotta call bullshit on ya buddy, because what you have said is laughably untrue.
"Ain't none of the dead ones talkin'. Cause when your dead.....your dead".
The people I trust the most are the people who understand this and live accordingly. As do I. People like us live our lives to the fullest, knowing damn well this is our one and only shot at life.
Already dead, my ass. You know what you find in death? Nothing. Because you don't exist any longer. Theres no "you" to find anything. You can't do any finding of anything when you've ceased to exist.
And I've got a fine and fulfilling "spiritual life" of my own, thank you, full of epic distances, deep appreciation for nature and warm personal relationships, all the rich emotional experiences of being fully immersed in a rewarding existence, all the more satisfying because of the total absence of fear of any hell or damnation or judgement. The freedom from fear and dread of punishment after death by some cave-man set of judgement standards is exhilarating. You should try it.
I wonder, how does your belief system cope with the existence of fully functional happy healthy and fulfilled people who have no religious beliefs? According to your religion, I cannot exist. But I do anyway. What do you say to that?
-B
"Ain't none of the dead ones talkin'. Cause when your dead.....your dead".
The people I trust the most are the people who understand this and live accordingly. As do I. People like us live our lives to the fullest, knowing damn well this is our one and only shot at life.
Already dead, my ass. You know what you find in death? Nothing. Because you don't exist any longer. Theres no "you" to find anything. You can't do any finding of anything when you've ceased to exist.
And I've got a fine and fulfilling "spiritual life" of my own, thank you, full of epic distances, deep appreciation for nature and warm personal relationships, all the rich emotional experiences of being fully immersed in a rewarding existence, all the more satisfying because of the total absence of fear of any hell or damnation or judgement. The freedom from fear and dread of punishment after death by some cave-man set of judgement standards is exhilarating. You should try it.
I wonder, how does your belief system cope with the existence of fully functional happy healthy and fulfilled people who have no religious beliefs? According to your religion, I cannot exist. But I do anyway. What do you say to that?
-B
Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.
maadmax 0
I wonder, how does your belief system cope with the existence of fully functional happy healthy and fulfilled people who have no religious beliefs? According to your religion, I cannot exist. But I do anyway. What do you say to that?
-B
-B
I say Great!!!! That is wonderful, and you are to be admired and envied. Someday when there is an accounting of what you did with your life, you will be able to present a convincing defense. Other people, myself included, have failed to meet Gods standard of perfection. And we are grateful to have the just compensations for our deeds forgiven. Those of us who are helpless and hopeless have been given the privilege of addressing God, and start each day washed clean with an unlimited number of second chances.
...
Bolas 5
QuoteHere's a question... Why only have a problem with God and not Allah? You engage the bible but not the Qur'an. Are you intimidated by Muslims but not Christians? The Qur'an is most violent, yet I never see any attacks on Islam. Just food for thought. If you're going to pick on a group of people that say you are sinners, then I want to see you have the balls to pick on a group of people that will kill you if you don't convert to their beliefs.
http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm
If a Muslim came on here, I'm sure we'd attempt to debate them too. Tha basic tennants are the same, just more extreme from what I've seen.
Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.
maadmax 0
Only in death??
Am I already dead while enjoying the early sun light and the cold breath of a beautiful December morning?
I feel alive - can't tell you, how much! - , that's a fact for me.
Sorry, cannot follow you.
Physical Death - Separation of the Soul/Spirit from the body.
Spiritual Death - Separation of the Soul/Spirit from God.
Spiritual Life - Restoration and unity with God.
...
QuoteSorry, cannot follow you.
Am I already dead while enjoying the early sun light and the cold breath of a beautiful December morning?
I feel alive - can't tell you, how much! - , that's a fact for me.
We arent that different at all, either you believe or you dont, but God shows himself to whomever he pleases. Clearly he is trying to get your attention. Think on this. Either we are here just to die, and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for our existance, (even enjoyment is a reason) or, we are here to find the very spirit of life, the one that brought us up, made us grow, and has been with us since the beginning. Hope is not for death, it is for life, and is life.
God reveals himself to both the hopeless and the hopeful. God is the very nature of beauty. There is us, and the earth, but its the connection that is beautiful. Without the life we would not have the beauty. For me, Beauty is one of Gods absolute, hands down, greatest revelations... that and pleasure.
And its not me you follow, its your very own and very unique personal relationship with God. All Im doing is sharing.
"We didn't start the fire"
Quote
Only in death??
Am I already dead while enjoying the early sun light and the cold breath of a beautiful December morning?
I feel alive - can't tell you, how much! - , that's a fact for me.
Sorry, cannot follow you.
Physical Death - Separation of the Soul/Spirit from the body.
Spiritual Death - Separation of the Soul/Spirit from God.
Spiritual Life - Restoration and unity with God.
...
Restoration?
Sorry, dude. You do not sound that funny and agile ...
I live today, right now - and love it.
Nothing can change that. Except death. Then, I'll just be fodder for the worms.
But, until then ... cya. Looking forward packing for my trip to South Africa, what could be better????
That's (my) life
- and you're not my dialogue partner. Thanks God. Christel
dudeist skydiver # 3105
QuoteThere's a lot more dead people on this Earth than live ones.
Are you sure about that? One generation ago the population was less than half what it is now. It only hit 1 billion in the 1800s. Maybe most people are still alive.
Quote
Individuals are evaluated and categorized based on the observation of their actions and the fruits of their labors. The belief in a Higher Power is an important consideration.
It's up to you, but I prefer dealing with the people who do right things because that's the way they grew up, not because they are scared of something (and modern examples have proved that belief in a Higher Power is definitely not enough to stop the person of doing bad things).
* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. *
Quote"Spiritually dying"? What kind of condescending crap is THAT?
I agree, it does sound condescending, and I am very sorry about that, but for those who know with 100% certainty that death is death what should I call them? Those are the ones who believe they understand death as well as they understand life, yet they find fulfillment in life, but claim with absolute certainty that you cannot find fulfillment in death, and then, with that same absolute certainty they speak against others who simply cannot believe that. Now who sounds more condescending?
Quoteyou've ceased to exist.
No, you are not consious of your own existance anymore, but according to your logic, you cant exist at all if you believe that it is possible to cease existing. As humans, we have no concept of eternity at all. I can tell you that whatever existed in eternity is still in eternity. Think of it like this, does life cease to exist just because you are unaware of it (or dead, or gone, ect...)? But I am interested in how people respond to this one.
QuotePeople like us live our lives to the fullest, knowing damn well this is our one and only shot at life.
Again, I am the same way. Life to the fullest is what Christ is all about. But, I have to question your perception of life to the fullest... what about those who never had the opprotunities for "life to the fullest". Those who are/were oppressed from the beginning, taken advantage of, held down. They have hopes and dreams also, but I guess this is the only shot they get too. I have trust that my God is just, and that everything with life belongs to him. He controls the perceptions of man. That it might be possible for even people in extrememly humble enviornments to find "life to the fullest". And you also are closer to Jesus than what the world is telling you.
Quote"The freedom from fear and dread of punishment after death by some cave-man set of judgement standards is exhilarating. You should try it.
I did. Its not the truth. I have fear, although, I dont dread punishment anymore from any set of "cave man" beliefs.
QuoteAnd I've got a fine and fulfilling "spiritual life" of my own, thank you, full of epic distances, deep appreciation for nature and warm personal relationships, all the rich emotional experiences of being fully immersed in a rewarding existence, all the more satisfying because of the total absence of fear of any hell or damnation or judgement
This is great. Really, do you think Im just attacking you or something? The perception is that Im pushing you, but more likely you are being pulled. Its okay to go as deep as you can.
There is a line in Good Will Hunting when Robin williams is talking to damon and he says "I cant learn anything about you that I cant read in some fuckin book, unless you want to talk about you, but you dont want to do that do you sport? Your terrified of what you might say" I think fear keeps us from going deeper and deeper into our own minds, ironically enough it seems to be just that fear that inspires the deep revelations of the heart. Fear is powerful, but its not designed to destroy us, its designed to help us find life to the fullest.
QuoteI wonder, how does your belief system cope with the existence of fully functional happy healthy and fulfilled people who have no religious beliefs? According to your religion, I cannot exist. But I do anyway. What do you say to that?
I say that I hope with all my heart that your spiritual connection with life is even greater than mine. I would hope that for everyone, with or without Jesus, but I am not the creator, and I have zero control over his timing, grooming, and growing of any of his creations, spiritual or physical. What I know is that God makes things grow and that everything is his.
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteThere have been many bars of morality set in the history of mankind. Jesus did set one, but there were many before that, and have been many since. All have value. The presumption of exclusivity is greatly overstated.
It would appear so, but... righteousness is the teaching of wisdom, the wisdom of the universe, the wisdom of life. I have not found any teachings (of righteousness) outside of the Gospel that were'nt revealed inside the Gospel. I am always open to revelations and invite any of them that are true into value. But the exclusive wisdom you speak about, doesnt beong to anything/anyone but wisdom itslef.
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteI live today, right now - and love it.
Nothing can change that. Except death.
Even death cant change that if you have the hope that Jesus offers. "And now you see the light, stand up for your right"-bob marley
Bring some oil with you while you wait!
"We didn't start the fire"
Will_Evo 0
Starting off with a cool quote.
" A clock made by hand is an amazing machine, but one made by putting all the pieces in a box, and shaking it up, is down right beautiful"
You speak of "the hope that Jesus offers" but so easily forget it is Jesus(who is god) who allowed for the defaulted hell humans belong to, to exist. So the hope you say he offers, saves you from the hell he created in the first place.
Compare this to, say an identity thief, who steals your identity, and then after ruining your name and credit score, calls you with advice and financial planning services for a price.
Quite the scam artist is he not, creating an inescapable scenario, and then offering you a way out too. We call those criminals these days, not gods.
-Evo
Zoo Crew
QuoteYou speak of "the hope that Jesus offers" but so easily forget it is Jesus(who is god) who allowed for the defaulted hell humans belong to, to exist. So the hope you say he offers, saves you from the hell he created in the first place
I dig the cool quote personally... its just cool, but I must say that I dont really believe Jesus is the first to unveil the concept of hell. If you read throughout my many longwinded
posts on this thread, youll see that I think the fear of judgment, hell, the unknown, whatever, is a part of human nature. Jesus saves you from that fear, but he does it with a great love. There are many I have come across who have aparently "given up" their Christian faith, (Although I am one of the few who believe you can get it back, and I can explain that if someone needs me to) The ones who give it up, give it up because they grew bitter towards God for showing them their sin in the first place. They think they dont want to stop (like any addict), so they rebel, and continue to sin in bitterness, rather than with the grace and understanding in Christ. Its not sin itself that takes us further away, it is the bitterness and rebellion we carry that interrupts our pleasure-filled peace and hunger for the light in life. Jesus doesnt just rip us out of sin, he leads us out gently, with complete understanding because he knows how blind we truly are. As we have been saying, changing something because you are told to is so much different than changing something because you want to. Jesus shows us the way to God and helps us persevere without bitterness through an everlasting grace. Everlasting grace is the spirit of Christ.
"We didn't start the fire"
champu 1
The problem people have with the concept of an afterlife, imao, stems from examples of people doing things in life that affect others negatively that they wouldn't do if they had no such belief in said afterlife.
If all anyone ever did as a result of thinking there was an afterlife was be nice to everyone, no one would bother arguing about it.
If you put yourself in the shoes of someone who believes that what we see around us is all we have, and we owe it to ourselves to make the most of what little that is, you'll see just how screwed up Pascal's Wager really is. The cost of believing and being wrong is written over and over again in history; it's unimaginably large.
If all anyone ever did as a result of thinking there was an afterlife was be nice to everyone, no one would bother arguing about it.
If you put yourself in the shoes of someone who believes that what we see around us is all we have, and we owe it to ourselves to make the most of what little that is, you'll see just how screwed up Pascal's Wager really is. The cost of believing and being wrong is written over and over again in history; it's unimaginably large.
http://www.yoel.info/koranwarpassages.htm
Does anyone else find it funny that we made a SPORT out of an EMERGENCY PROCEDURE?!?!
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