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Lindsey 0
LOL. What's kind of funny is that I used to think like you, too. I don't reject Jesus. I think there's a lot to learn from the Bible. But I'm not led through life by the Gospel, and I am open to the lessons and truths that are taught outside the Church.
linz.
linz.
--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail
Shotgun 1
Quote
Since you listen to truth, do you speak the truth as well? Have you read the Gospel?
I try to always speak the truth. And yes, I have read the Gospel. I have read most of the Bible (though it's been a while), and I do not believe it contains "the truth." It's just a book written by men.
billvon 2,442
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>if you desire all these things do you reject the love that is in Jesus?
Why would one have to? You can accept that love as well as the love that others (from other prophets to other people) show you.
Why would one have to? You can accept that love as well as the love that others (from other prophets to other people) show you.
QuoteQuote
I try to always speak the truth. And yes, I have read the Gospel. I have read most of the Bible (though it's been a while), and I do not believe it contains "the truth." It's just a book written by men.
I also try to always speak the truth. I was trying to get creative for some reason in how I was asking if youve read the Gospel. I didnt mean for it to sound disrespectful, it was a sincere question, so I just wanted to make sure you know that first.
It is funny to me that people believe that just becuase they know the Gospel, that they speak the truth to God. God doesnt care what we know. He demands that we speak the truth from our hearts to him. If we believe we are not guilty of sin, (sins very job is to seperate us from God) then we are not speaking the truth to God.
The Gospel (and the entire bible) is written by man, but it is inspired by the Holy Spirit, therefore it is actually written by God. It is the hallowed book of righteousness, but there is soooooo much more power in it than just finding truth. There is love that touches the deepest parts of our hearts. That is what seems to be its greatest connection with man.
"We didn't start the fire"
Shotgun 1
QuoteThe Gospel (and the entire bible) is written by man, but it is inspired by the Holy Spirit, therefore it is actually written by God. It is the hallowed book of righteousness, but there is soooooo much more power in it than just finding truth. There is love that touches the deepest parts of our hearts. That is what seems to be its greatest connection with man.
I am glad that you get that out of the Bible and that it works for you. But I do not believe in God, so of course I do not believe that the Bible is written by God, and I personally find it of little use or inspiration to me.
But luckily for me, I find inspiration, love, etc., in other things.
QuoteQuoteThe Gospel (and the entire bible) is written by man, but it is inspired by the Holy Spirit, therefore it is actually written by God. It is the hallowed book of righteousness, but there is soooooo much more power in it than just finding truth. There is love that touches the deepest parts of our hearts. That is what seems to be its greatest connection with man.
I am glad that you get that out of the Bible and that it works for you. But I do not believe in God, so of course I do not believe that the Bible is written by God, and I personally find it of little use or inspiration to me.
But luckily for me, I find inspiration, love, etc., in other things.
Yes, I have no doubt that you do.
"We didn't start the fire"
jcd11235 0
QuoteI would hardly say that those who believe however, dont use deductive logic, its just logic and reason that is out of the perception of those who do not believe.
Then it's not logic and reason.
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jcd11235 0
QuoteIt is funny to me that people believe that just becuase they know the Gospel, that they speak the truth to God.
Read your words very carefully, repeatedly, if necessary, and then explain to us why you are not one of those people you speak of.
Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!
pirana 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteThe errors are only there when itis misread without Spiritual direction and understanding.
So your all powerful, all knowing, all etc... God created your Bible but only those people with "spiritual direction and understanding" can read it correctly ...
What kind and loving god would write something that the vast majority of the people cannot read to understand?
He must also be responsible for the instructions behind California's 540 tax form.
He must be related to this one philosophy professor I had for Symbolic Logic. Or maybe it was me.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
pirana 0
QuoteI realize this gets to the fundamental distinction of the 2 camps (one being faith-based and the other relying on deductive reasoning); but isn't your being so sure about what you feel you know without much to support your assertions, while dismissing what others think they know via deductive logic a bit like saying I know you are but what am I.
It does. We all had a huge conversation about this very subject in a previous thread. You have to respect the dividing line between the two, it is impenetrable. It is literally two completely different perceptions of the same world. One sees what the other does not and visa versa. I would hardly say that those who believe however, dont use deductive logic, its just logic and reason that is out of the perception of those who do not believe. Since I am a believer, I believe there was wisdom in the "beginning". Others do not.
So what do you do when a fundamentalist interpretation is completely out of sync with observable facts, investigation and experimentation, etc? In my opinion that is one of the methods (science) putting proof on the table, and the other (faith) saying they don't believe it because it clashes with the way they wish things were based on ancient systems of belief.
To me it is the equivalent of a modern man studying chemistry and insisting that there are only four elements, because a several hundred year's old book says so. The 4 elements theory is very interesting (and valuable) as a means of understanding what has lead up to current methods and thinking; but to insist it is accurate is ludicrous.
If you are not of that school of interpretation, then my statements are directed to those that are of the strict fundamentalist type.
I used to accept the apologetics that were of the to-each-his-own ilk. But when an educator starts telling school age kids that the Grand Canyon truly is only a couple thousand years old, and other such tripe, then it is beyond personal choice and is damaging to society.
I really can not fathom wanting something to be so true so badly that a person abandons critical thought, logic, and hundreds of years of building ever more accurate knowledge as if it were just the flotsam of society.
When science, which has only the accumulation of knowledge as an agenda, penetrates the kind of lie I mentioned, then the it's-just-2-different-ways-of-looking line isn't good enough.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
QuoteLOL. What's kind of funny is that I used to think like you, too. I don't reject Jesus. I think there's a lot to learn from the Bible. But I'm not led through life by the Gospel, and I am open to the lessons and truths that are taught outside the Church.
linz.
This made me think of a billboard on the PA turnpike. It says "Jesus, Accept or Reject". I don't see it as that clear cut. I agree, that some of the teachings of the Bible are truly good ones, how to live in peace, get along, help others, the basics of how to live a good life. Teachings that are similar to virtually every philosophical and religous doctrine.
I have tried very hard in my life to be a good Christian, that is how I was raised. But I never really felt it in my heart, I don't feel that Jesus is real and there and part of me, no matter how open I was and how badly I wanted to believe in that kind of truth.
Is that rejection of Jesus that I walked away from the Christian church because I could no longer bear the hypocrisy of pretending to believe something that just never really fit with me? I don't feel that I've rejected anything, only accepted the fact that I am human, I have to do the best I can in this life with the tools that I have and the nature of my spirit. That's exactly what I am doing, and I've found so much more peace and joy on this path than I've ever known before. As a result I'm better equipped to give to and care for others.
Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda
rehmwa 2
QuoteIt says "Jesus, Accept or Reject".
I have no issues with respecting and studying stories (myth or not doesn't much matter) about a guy that advocated all of us being nice to each other, even to the point of giving up his life for those values.
But that's not we're really talking about.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
billvon 2,442
Hmm. Yesterday the California Supreme Court reached a decision that will allow gay marriage in California. Today the forecast for this weekend is gorgeous. 70F and sunny in SF, mid-80's in San Diego - going to be a good beach weekend.
Is God trying to tell California something?
Is God trying to tell California something?
Shotgun 1
QuoteHmm. Yesterday the California Supreme Court reached a decision that will allow gay marriage in California. Today the forecast for this weekend is gorgeous. 70F and sunny in SF, mid-80's in San Diego - going to be a good beach weekend.
Is God trying to tell California something?
Yes, he's telling us that we should go to the beach.
BillyVance 34
QuoteHmm. Yesterday the California Supreme Court reached a decision that will allow gay marriage in California. Today the forecast for this weekend is gorgeous. 70F and sunny in SF, mid-80's in San Diego - going to be a good beach weekend.
Is God trying to tell California something?
It's all about the fun and calm before the storm hits.
I just can't decide if it's going to be raining fireballs or the next big earthquake.
Completely in jest, of course. It would really suck..."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban
Amazon 7
Quotemid-80's in San Diego - going to be a good beach weekend.
Is God trying to tell California something?
He is trying to lure you all to the beach for the tsunami generated by the massive earthquake.
BillyVance 34
QuoteQuotemid-80's in San Diego - going to be a good beach weekend.
Is God trying to tell California something?
He is trying to lure you all to the beach for the tsunami generated by the massive earthquake.
That too.... good one!
"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban
42
Born ok 1st time.
QuoteQuoteI would hardly say that those who believe however, dont use deductive logic, its just logic and reason that is out of the perception of those who do not believe.
Then it's not logic and reason.
Even simpler. Do you believe there is life greater than just being alive? I believe it is logical to believe there is, as it seems to be the pursuit of most. The pursuit of happiness?? There is reason all throughout that process, but ther are those who do not see it.
"We didn't start the fire"
QuoteQuoteIt is funny to me that people believe that just becuase they know the Gospel, that they speak the truth to God.
Read your words very carefully, repeatedly, if necessary, and then explain to us why you are not one of those people you speak of.
Its unfortunate that you seem to be against me becuase of my faith. You havent listened to anything that I have said, instead your only listening for ways to prove me wrong. Did you even read the last post in "an atheist speaks"? Or did you just consider me to be shifty in my assertions and now are convinced more than ever that I am ridiculous in thought?
You seem set on calling me on everything that I have said to the extent of even changing my intent. Nevertheless...The Gospel is about truth, its about speaking the entire truth to God. The entire truth will find your guilt and condemnation. Both are covered by the blood of Jesus. I wont be fully honest with you, because I dont want to be ridiculed. I will however be fully honest with God. I have said the only one who isnt a hypocrite is the one who says he is one. I am guilty, I am not innocent, I am dark, I am a sinner, I am not good, and Im shallow in thought, I fall deathly short of the Righteousness of God, and I dont know anything. I seek humbleness. I am in constant remorse, which is joyful in ways that you wont understand until you learn you need to be forgiven. The very combination of remorse and forgiveness is grace.
I wouldnt assume that you believe me to always have been this way, its not your style. I was an advocate for darkness in ways that would definitely suprise you
"We didn't start the fire"
Oh Linz, you must think I am so biggoted
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