LisaM 0 #101 December 12, 2007 I said I was going to be done. This will be it! Not all kids can critical think. With some kids it takes a lot to teach them critical thinking and some can't be taught that. Not everyone can be taught everything and some are better at it than others. I would say I should not have made that blanket statement. Again, my only point was to show why some parents might have issues and withhold this movie and other things that go against their beliefs. I can honestly see it both ways. My son is more religious than I am and he's had a bit of a rude awakening learning that I don't believe everything he believes. I would not tell him these things when he was younger. It was a decision I made because I didn’t feel he would be ready and would understand. Now he’s old enough to talk with me about it and debate with me about it. I don't think teaching your child your religious beliefs and withholding something that you feel goes directly against that is narrow minded. There are plenty of movies we won't let our son see; that doesn't make us narrow minded. It means we don't feel it is appropriate for him at this time in his life. It’s our decision to make. I don’t claim that we never make mistakes; it’s part of parenting. I do think it is narrow minded to not be willing to accept why some parents make the decision that their children won’t see this movie. We are all individuals and we all do things in our own way. Not everyone agrees. That is what makes the world go ‘round. But, if I had a young child and I felt he wasn't ready to deal with something like this movie, then he would not see it. If my child wanted to see this movie, we would rent it when it comes out so we can talk about it. If you read my other posts, we have taught him to be open minded in the case of Harry Potter and as more if this comes up we will continue to promote that. I don’t know enough about the Golden Compass to debate with him. But it is HIS CHOICE not to see it. He is basing it on what he has heard in his religious school. I may not agree with that quick decision and will talk to him again about being open minded, but, I’m not going to force him; that would be equally wrong. ~ Lisa ~ Do you Rigminder? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peregrinerose 0 #102 December 12, 2007 You have a lot of good points. The only thing that you are missing is that 99.9999999999% of kids are going to see the movie/book as a good fantasy movie/book, not a religious commentary. Kids just don't think that way, like you said, they don't have the critical thinking skills to see a movie as a metaphor for anything, only a good story. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LisaM 0 #103 December 12, 2007 QuoteYou have a lot of good points. The only thing that you are missing is that 99.9999999999% of kids are going to see the movie/book as a good fantasy movie/book, not a religious commentary. Kids just don't think that way, like you said, they don't have the critical thinking skills to see a movie as a metaphor for anything, only a good story. You are absolutely right. I would be willing to bet my son could see it and not be aware of the religious aspect if he weren't tipped off. But I support Jaye and others that have said they don't want it in their house. It's SO hard to raise kids today with values and your own values at that. ~ Lisa ~ Do you Rigminder? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #104 December 17, 2007 Erin and I went and saw it yesterday. Both of us thought it was good, and we laughed at the irony of parents forbidding their children from seeing it. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #105 December 17, 2007 Quote Erin and I went and saw it yesterday. Both of us thought it was good, and we laughed at the irony of parents forbidding their children from seeing it. we saw it Saturday - not bad. The girl in it seems to be a very good actor. it just kept going on and on and on and on, though. CGI was great. I could have taken the "Magistrate" and equated with ANY organized power structure - the church (which is not "faith", it's organized 'religion' - different things), the DFL, the RNC, some major comglomerates, etc. At first, the actions and denials by the Magistrate struck me more like the way PC thuggery (which is left wing and far right wing politics, not even religion) is stifling people's freedom to think and do as they wish. I just wish it was a bit more active. I could have taken a couple 20 minute naps and not missed a bit of the plot. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #106 December 17, 2007 Quote Quote Erin and I went and saw it yesterday. Both of us thought it was good, and we laughed at the irony of parents forbidding their children from seeing it. we saw it Saturday - not bad. The girl in it seems to be a very good actor. it just kept going on and on and on and on, though. CGI was great. I could have taken the "Magistrate" and equated with ANY organized power structure - the church (which is not "faith", it's organized 'religion' - different things), the DFL, the RNC, some major comglomerates, etc. At first, the actions and denials by the Magistrate struck me more like the way PC thuggery (which is left wing and far right wing politics, not even religion) is stifling people's freedom to think and do as they wish. I just wish it was a bit more active. I could have taken a couple 20 minute naps and not missed a bit of the plot. Yeah, the correlation with the church was a bit tenuous at best. The bad guys are those who wish to squelch independent thought and the pursuit of knowledge. They'd prefer the populace simply accept their edicts at face value without question. If someone thinks their church fits that bill, well that says far more about their church than the movie does. I didn't see any ties that were specific to Jesus or to a belief in Christianity. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #107 December 17, 2007 QuoteI just wish it was a bit more active. I could have taken a couple 20 minute naps and not missed a bit of the plot. But that's true of a lot of stories. Hemingway once wrote a story in just six words ("For sale: baby shoes, never worn."), but most stories have at least a little more detail.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #108 December 17, 2007 >I could have taken the "Magistrate" and equated with ANY organized >power structure - the church (which is not "faith", it's organized 'religion' - >different things), the DFL, the RNC, some major comglomerates, etc Yep. The second and third books make it a bit clearer on who he's referring to. I'd suspect that the film version will tone down the references a bit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #109 December 17, 2007 QuoteI didn't see any ties that were specific to Jesus or to a belief in Christianity. there was a Magistrate building in the background of a scene full of images of people with halos that's about it ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,255 #110 December 17, 2007 QuoteQuoteI didn't see any ties that were specific to Jesus or to a belief in Christianity. there was a Magistrate building in the background of a scene full of images of people with halos that's about it Magisterium. They will have to ramp up the religion speific references at some point, otherwise the 3rd film will have to be almost completely unrelated to the book.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #111 December 17, 2007 Quotefilm will have to be almost completely unrelated to the book. meh - that never happens Magisterium... I'll try to remember that ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #112 December 17, 2007 Maybe they can get W to play the false god in the third movie...hopefully by then he will be unemployed..... and he does have the mindset with some practical experience. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #113 December 18, 2007 Their their Quote I agree with you 200% Jaye! My kids will not see the movie or read the books. I am a Christian and proud of it, I may not always live the way I should, but I am also human. However, anyone who is a self-admitted atheist "hell-bent" on changing kids to believe that there is no Christ or that He is a false prophet has no place in my life. Things, short of miracles have happened in my life on more than one occassion that can only be described as God working in my life. I am a believer, born again Christian and so are my kids. I too have friends who fall into all categories where religion and faith is concerned, and I myself am not a big fan of organized religion, but rather a personal friendship and relationship with God himself. OK flame away.... Personally (and as a parent) I think the involuntary indoctrination of children in to any of the many religious belief systems is nothing short of disgusting.. WE don’t impose our political views on our children because we know they are to young to understand.. Yet people like yourself are quite happy to indoctrinate your children into your religion. You shield them for any material that confronts, or challenges your chosen belief system, and therefore remove any critical thinking that your child might develop. You say Quote . However, anyone who is a self-admitted atheist "hell-bent" on changing kids to believe that there is no Christ or that He is a false prophet has no place in my life. Maybe no place in your life, but why not let your children make up their own mind…. At what age did your children make their decision to become Christians??----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #114 December 18, 2007 Quote Pullman could write a cookbook and I wouldn't buy it. I'll explain it to you this way; if this guy named Larry hated my dad and tried to tell the community that dad's business was a sham, a hoax, and illegal...would I EVER buy anything to support Larry? Ah but the point you miss is that im sure your dad would have a legitimate business, a business that could be proven to be real and exist, a business that people could see, touch talk to and get a response… there would a record of the business with the IRS and by all accounts you could prove you dads business to be real, and with this no-doubt legal.. However if you had no evidence what so ever to demonstrate this business was real and legal then surely you would not have a problem with “Larry”…----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
n23x 0 #115 December 18, 2007 I just saw the movie. Not too shabby. I think as long as we can all agree that the Magesterium are a bunch of self-loathing dumb cunts, everybody can mind their own business and just get along! Do as I say, and not as I do! .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peregrinerose 0 #116 December 18, 2007 The problem is that in this case, the author was Mis Quoted.... yes, he is agnostic (NOT athiest), but he is not 'hell bent' on converting kids to anything. That was what he thought CS Lewis would say about his books in an interview, not his actual goal. But what are the odds of those who posted so vehemently on here actually reading the links I posted and giving the guy an honest chance to speak for himself? Christians are often quick to judge, but slow to give a person benefit of the doubt. To use Jaye's analogy, someone else said that Larry hated her dad, and she believed it without talking to Larry first. Turns out Larry is perfectly fine with Jaye's dad, but she'll never find that out due to a visceral reaction rather than a rational investigation of the situation. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #117 December 18, 2007 QuoteI think as long as we can all agree that the Magesterium are a bunch of self-loathing dumb cunts, which one: the PC Magisterium various religious magisteriums various anti-religious magisteriums the global warming Magisterium the DFL Magisterium the RNC Magisterium the "I'm a good parent because I don't teach my kids my values, they can decide on their own now that they are 3, and I think you should be forced to do the same" magisterium ad nauseum ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
n23x 0 #118 December 18, 2007 The Majesterium in the Golden Compass, of course! .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,255 #119 December 18, 2007 Quote The Majesterium in the Golden Compass, of course! .jim You know that 'Magisterium' was spelled correctly seven times in the post you just replied to, yes? Sort it out.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
n23x 0 #120 December 19, 2007 And I spelled it correctly in my first post. Boo hoo. Should I travel back through all of Jakee's posts to verify correct spelling and grammar? .jim"Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,255 #121 December 19, 2007 QuoteAnd I spelled it correctly in my first post. Boo hoo. No you didn't. You spelled it wrong in a different way. QuoteShould I travel back through all of Jakee's posts to verify correct spelling and grammar? It's more that the word 'Magisterium' would have been staring you in the face as you wrote your post, all you had to do was copy it. Just thought it was odd.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
