Liberalism in the Classroom (Long, but I need your opinion)

[Michele 1]

I am quite frustrated this evening...and I thought I'd make a post about it.

I am struggling with chemistry - I've got an 87.5 cumulative in the class, but there are still two exams to go - one on Monday, and then the final on Friday.

I like my chemistry professor; he's pretty laid back and funny; uses foul language, and teases the one openly gay guy about his homosexuality (which doesn't bother him at all, and makes for some very funny exchanges...). He's not a great teacher, a poor explainer and lacks patience with those of us who don't readily grasp the concept...but he's a nice guy, and not everyone can be both great teacher and good guy. I'm not blaming my less than A grade on him. Yet. He's relatively arrogant and pretty superior, but still, a nice dude nonetheless once you get past that. I thought we had, but boy was I wrong.

Over the last few weeks, my lab partners and I have often been the last out of the lab. Since I've got no life, I have nothing to run home to, so on occasion, he and I have stayed and talked a bit. Religion, politics, how he came to be a teacher, why I went back to school, him being brought up Southern Baptist, et cetera. He's about my age, and we have pretty different views on politics and faith. Frankly, he is a liberal democrat athiest, and I am not.

But see, I don't really care. I like listening to others' opinions, and discussing things from different perspectives. But he's often brought it into the classroom...inasmuch as like when someone sneezes and the class says "bless you", he says "there is no god." Or "Bush is a wimp" or "that jackass leading our country", or "the creationists would have you believe that, but real scientists know better." And so on.

I'm not debating whether or not he's correct in his beliefs or I am correct in my beliefs. They are, honestly, what they are. But tonight, things came to a head.

In the first bit of class - not sure but about 10 minutes into it; lecture hadn't started yet - he said something about Bush and the war (I can't recall what, exactly). Then he added "but Bush isn't my president." I responded with "well, yes, technically, he is," and he responded with a rant about how the 2000 election was taken to the Supreme court and that nowhere in the Constitution gives the Supremes the right to appoint a president. When I tried to point out that it was Gore who brought the legal action, and that Bush pursued his right to appeal, as guaranteed in the Constitution...he went off some more, about "wimpy Daddy's boy Georgie", and how Bush stole the election. I added a comment (can't remember what), but also said "well, we can agree to disagree" and he said "there's no disagreement, you're wrong." and reiterated his point about the SC. Again I repeated "we can agree to disagree", and kept repeating that to every additional point he made. A classmate stated "well, before Michele interrupted you, what were you saying about Bush stealing the election? Sure he stole the 2000, but what do you think about the 2004?" and he answered "fraud, pure and simple. That's why he's not my President. He is a liar, theif, and fraud." My classmate, who agreed with him, stated as much when she walked out of the classroom on a personal break because, as she said, "this sort of stupidity pisses me off" while looking at me directly.

Later during the lecture he brought up carbon dating, and I asked him if it was as accurate as it was portrayed, as I had read that many scientists don't agree with it's exactitude. He interrupted me, saying "well, those scientists who say that are the ones who'd push creationism on people, so consider that source." My response was "hey, I didn't bring that into the conversation" and his comment was "didn't say you did, but don't believe that crap."

A three hour lecture was subsequently truncated into about 40 minutes, his reason being he has two more days to cover the material, so let's just go home...and then he called a break. Most of the class left, because it would only be review for the test on Monday...but I stayed. When I returned to the classroom from outside, I saw him conversing down the hall with the classmate I mentioned above. When he returned to class (after easily 30 minutes), he walked into the room and shoved in front of me a print out of Article II of the Constitution, and said "here, learn something. Show me where it says the Supreme Court can appoint the President". Then, when I said something about that wasn't what my point was, he said "it was changed in 1804. I know how old you are, and you're not old enough to have read the original."

Anyway, long story short, when most of the class had left, I asked him what the point was of giving me the article. He gave me one of those "looks", and said "you're wrong." I reiterated my point was that Gore brought the legal action, the Supreme Court basically only said "stop counting", and sent it back to FLA for decision. I wasn't debating the Constitution, but I was debating whether or not Bush had the right to appeal, just like everyone else in the country. He told me I was wrong, wrong, wrong, that it wasn't supposed to go like that, that the House was supposed to make the decision, et cetera...talking over me, interrupting me, and basically not letting me speak.

And then I told him I had heard him discussing me with my classmate in the hallway, and that I thought that was out of line and I didn't appreciate being discussed behind my back with my colleague. He had the grace to look "caught" (all you parents know that look), and then said "I adhere to the policy that I won't say anything behind someone's back that I won't say to their face," to which I pressed the point..."what did you say?"

"You don't know as much as you think you do." Well, whatever. And that's what I said. I asked him what gave him the right to make that conversation about a topic that had nothing to do with the class he taught, and he said "I make my observations, and that's what I think." I've never had an isntructor say something like that to me; and if I were insecure, I'd think he was right.

I then clued him in....I hadn't heard him talking...he was 3/4 down the hallway, and I couldn't have heard him. However, I also am rather bright and can read body language, and when two people turn their back on me when they see me, I know I'm the topic of conversation. And that I was bright, and that I may not be a chemist, or even a college grad, but I know some things...and I also know I don't know 1/8 of a billionth of a quadrillionth of what's out there to know.

He basically then told me the conversation was over, and walked out of the classroom. I closed the classroom up - shut out the lights, shut the door, and walked out to my car.

I am pretty damned well pissed off. It's a chemistry class. It's not a political science class (which he terms "bullshit fluff"), and for him to have intimated - let alone stated - that I don't know what I'm talking about on a subject that he doesn't even teach...and then to comment about his perception of my lack of knowledge in general, overall, about everything (rightly or wrongly) to a fellow classmate really, really crossed the line of professionalism and decency.

And now....I have those two exams to pass. He could fail me easily; I'm not the best chemistry student, and I work as hard as I can and study as well as possible, but I am not going to score 100%. Furthermore, he could take points off for things that he doesn't take points off for for other students. And now I'm beyond stressed, because if I don't pass the class, I'll have to repeat it, and I'll not be able to finish up my prerequisites by summer as I had planned.

I'm trying to decide whether or not I say anything to the Dean (my [professor is the chairman of the chemistry department...), or just sit tight and see what happens on the next test. However, if I just sit tight, and a problem arises, if I say anything then it will be seen as "sour grapes" potentially.

And I like him...it was no worse than the conversations we have here...more mild, frankly, than these here. It's the concept of his talking about me, denigrating me, behind my back that galls me...and the fact that he's now pissed and can fail me just because he wants to now.

The bottom line? I don't really want to get him in trouble; but I don't want to suffer at the hands of someone who has power over me and my future.

I don't want to get into a debate about whether Bush is the President or not. Nor do I want to debate whether or not I was right, the professor is right, or neither one was right; that's not the point. We are all allowed our opinions...and I respect his right to have a different one than mine - even if vice versa is not. But I really, really don't like the fact he talked about me to another student...and negatively, at that.

I do want some advice and guidance as to what you might do in a situation similar to mine...I'd really appreciate it. This had me in tears earlier. Chemistry is a bear, and I just don't need this, you know?

Ciels-
Michele

What would you do, in my situation? Talking to him is apparently not working; I tried that tonight...but he walked out of the conversation, and told me to "get over it." Other than notifying the Dean, I don't really know what else to do...so does someone have an idea?

Thanks...

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[mnealtx 0]

Definitely talk to the Dean. You're not in a poli-sci class, and it's not his job to bring his PERSONAL opinions into class, anyway.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

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Definitely talk to the Dean. You're not in a poli-sci class, and it's not his job to bring his PERSONAL opinions into class, anyway.

Unless its a conservative position.. then it would be ok of course.

[mnealtx 0]

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Definitely talk to the Dean. You're not in a poli-sci class, and it's not his job to bring his PERSONAL opinions into class, anyway.

Unless its a conservative position.. then it would be ok of course.

Incorrect...of course.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[jarrodh 0]

If it was me I would sit tight and not say anything and hope for the best. Even though this guy sounds like a real asshole chances are hes not mean enough to flunk you illegitimately.

If you had conversations in the past and have had a chance to become somewhat more than a typical student teacher relationship then its likely hes feeling as crummy about this whole situation as you are, since he has clearly offended a good,friendly student. He only says things like "get over it" since he he is to insecure to admit he was in the wrong by treating you poorly and arguing over semantics of politics in a chem class.

2 BITS....4 BITS....6 BITS....A DOLLAR!....ALL FOR THE GATORS....STAND UP AND HOLLER!!!!

[Croc 0]

Sit tight. You can't get to be a dean in an American university unless you're liberal. He (she) will not be sympathetic. It is, after all, a chem class. Don't take the bait. If he talks trash just don't reply.

"Here's a good specimen of my own wisdom. Something is so, except when it isn't so."

Charles Fort, commenting on the many contradictions of astronomy

[jenfly00 0]

Hmmm ..........WOW!

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Guest]

Report him to NO INDOCTRINATION. See how he likes that.

mh

.

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[warpedskydiver 0]

Remain calm and go on about your business, if you do not receive a fair grade it will be readily apparent, if this does occur make a copy of your test bring it to the Dean of Students and if not action is taken to correct this then you will have the right to go to the president/chancellor and or the media on what an asshat like him uses his classroom and student fees for.

He sounds like if he had to have a job outside of academia he might realize he is a prick.

The fact that he is surrounded by nothing more than other elitest academics, who share all of the same opinions, deludes him further into his misconception.

He may show that he can be fair and give you a grade based soley upon your knowledge of teh subject matter, I kind of doubt it at this point but we shall see wont we?

Tape Him in class you have the right and it is nothing more than note taking.

[warpedskydiver 0]

You may also want to seek John Kallends advice on this issue, he may even agree with your professor, but unlikely that he would look upon this situation in any favorable manner.

[Lucky... 0]

Welcome to D street!!! Isn’t it liberal to debate things? I thought only whiny liberals whined about things when they don’t go their way? Conservatives are much tougher and suck it up, so I thought. After having a degree and ½ way thru another, and being a so-called whiny liberal, apparently like you, I reject any notion that college/university liberalizes people. With that, I was and still am a registered Republinazi and became liberal after a year or two into college. Was it the evil liberals out there doing that? Nah, I was converted during a poli-sci class taught by a conservative Hispanic guy who was very cool. It had to do with the content, not the deliverer of said liberalizing data.

Basically the conservative doctrine is nauseating, just as the Christian doctrine is nauseating. I love this expression: Science begs you to disagree, whereas religion dares you to. That goes with lib/conservatives respectively. I think that’s what turned me away from the Nazi’s. Can you go to a Repub convention and debate abortion, welfare, gay rights/marriage, socialized medicine, etc? Can you go to a Dem convention and discuss gun rights, tax cuts, etc? Although if you go to the latter and have 100% Repub feelings, well, you won’t be well received. If you go to the former and have just 1 Dem ideal, you’re fucked. You don’t discuss things with Republicans, you look at their schedule of predestined rules and ideologies and adhere or be damned.

As for appeals in school, of the approximately 200 credits I have, I have appealed 9 teachers and won 7 of them. Could have won the other 2 by taking them higher, but feared retaliation when I transferred. The appeal that stands out the highest is one of a military history teacher. I broke my leg right before the end of the semester and took a continuance on the class, meaning I could make-up the test later. I had a year and the teacher kept putting me off up to the 11th hour and I then took the test. He gave me a C for the test and for the semester, I appealed at all levels and it took an additional year of fighting his delays and his Alzheimer’s to finally get to the highest level of appeals, a board of 6 PhD’s, the dept chair who was a PhD, and the teacher who was a PhD and retired emeritus. I petitioned to have the whole thing audio-videotaped and it was. As I showed up, the university provided the teacher a lawyer and offered me one too. I declined. Might wonder why the univ provided a lawyer? This racists, but emeritus POS made a statement that could have the university fucked, he said as he was explaining my grade: I have a way of explaining grading and I call it my Mexican light bulb question; a D student doesn’t know what electricity is, a C student can’t find the switch, a B student can turn the lights on and an A student can find brilliance…….guess which this appeal was, one of the 2 or one of the 7?

This kook was so fucking gone in the brain that of the 3 syllabi he distributed, only 1 had his name spelled correctly. I really fucked up by not suing the school for admissions into a grad school, I think they would have folded. I really missed a chance. I had all of these recorded and brought them to the appeal. When I crossed the teacher with that Mexican light bulb question, he reiterated it shocking the professor to his left out of her fucking chair!!! The other appeals were less interesting and sometimes were handled at the first level.

As for squabbles over ideology, I had a female moralist sociology teacher who I engaged in a big discussion about how rock music causes people to commit crimes, especially violent ones. SO the point is, you won’t find the conservatives, because you are one, you find the liberals because you go against the grain with them. Trust me, there are as many conservatives in the colleges as there are in the streets, so don’t think academia is some liberal conspiracy.

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Anyway, long story short,…

When does the story get short?

As for the SCOTUS ignoring the appeal, it is far more complicated than you or I know and I studied that shit. A normal appeal goes thru a certification process called a Writ of Certiorari. This was an emergency case, so I think it may have had a different or just an expedited process to be heard. To argue justice ion America is lame, just talk to any attorney and throw out the word, “Constitution” a lot and watch their eyes gloss over. Referencing the US Constitution is food for the foolish, it is dispensed by the elitists, for the elitists and there are cases that are identical with opposite outcomes. Remember, you’re only guaranteed certain appeals, the rest can summarily ignore your appeal and they do very often. So the whole debacle of the election is very American, sleazy, illegal, corrupt and covered with a layer of frosting to make it appear as if everything was done correctly, and I say this noting Bush may or may not have won the election either way.

As for due process, you have procedural and substantive. The more money you have the more you get lawyer to demand the latter. Procedural is when they give you an arraignment, check, lawyer, check, trail by jury, check. But when the judge allows evidence that was illegally seized, refuses to have your evidence/witnesses heard, etc, then you have failed to receive substantive due process and this is what the courts do ion a daily basis under the guise of liberty, justice and equal protection. God damnit, there go the universities again, liberalizing me with the truth and facts.

Trying to trick your teacher into thinking you know more than you do, inadvisable. If you’re gonna play fuck-fuck, better get a tape recorder and then be known as the liberal whiner by all the faculty. I did it, but make sure it’s worth it. They can give you that win and then fuck you several times in subsequent semesters; think teachers don’t talk?

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He basically then told me the conversation was over, and walked out of the classroom. I closed the classroom up - shut out the lights, shut the door, and walked out to my car.

And then what did you do? Did you stop at Circle K for a Big Gulp? Just a joke about over-detailing!!!!

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I am pretty damned well pissed off. It's a chemistry class. It's not a political science class (which he terms "bullshit fluff"), …

True and true, it is BS fluff. But poli-sci is so much more interesting. If you wanna get into a pissing contest about teaching styles, teaching latitude with the staff, you better practice pissing high for a long time. Teachers are like cops, they cover for each other even and especially when they are wrong and/or lying.

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...and then to comment about his perception of my lack of knowledge in general, overall, about everything (rightly or wrongly) to a fellow classmate really, really crossed the line of professionalism and decency.

Prove it. If you can prove he discussed anything academic or otherwise about you, you have a case, but otherwise it’s conjecture. don’t get caught looking stupid with no evidence. Also, check your state laws about recording people w/o their knowledge.

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And now....I have those two exams to pass. He could fail me easily; I'm not the best chemistry student, and I work as hard as I can and study as well as possible, but I am not going to score 100%. Furthermore, he could take points off for things that he doesn't take points off for other students. And now I'm beyond stressed, because if I don't pass the class, I'll have to repeat it, and I'll not be able to finish up my prerequisites by summer as I had planned.

Suck it up and apologize for the whole deal, he will upgrade you for it. Being 33 as I entered college, I was as old or older as some of my professors and a strategy with some was to develop an abrasive relationship with them and then improve upon it as the semester went on. Remember, all things are relative and going from a dislike to a kinda like is great distance, rather than going from a really like to a ????. Point is, you can’t go up from some relationships, meaning you can only go down. Don’t accept all blame, just a casual mention of how you wish it hadn’t happened and that you’re sorry for your part. Remember, you can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar. Right now he’s probably getting ready for war with you himself. He probably thinks you’re gonna be a whiny liberal and appeal a grade or make a general complaint to his department, so he may be aligning his guns too. Considering you have no evidence you will go in there looking like a whiny student pissed about your grade. If you are gonna complain on zero evidence, better do it before the test, or you will look like sour grapes hating your grade.

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It's the concept of his talking about me, denigrating me, behind my back that galls me…

You actually don’t know that and even if it is true, to what degree? Geez, if you go thru life that thin-skinned, you are fucked. I’ve had drill instructors in my face, had cops rip me off on multiple occasions, lied their asses of, had teachers fuck me due to gender, had all kinds of bad shit happen as we all have. OK, he’s a liberal faggot-loving asshole to you, so what? Gloss it over, take your grade, unless he truly does downgrade you unfairly, and get on with it. There is no collegiate liberal conspiracy that is widespread.

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but I don't want to suffer at the hands of someone who has power over me and my future.

That’s life, a series of autocratic bastards having control over your life. This is one reason I like a Socialist society, it is less autocratic. Here, the golden rule applies: he who has the gold makes the rules. In Socialism, the government provides so much that less autocratic empowerment is prevalent.

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Chemistry is a bear,…

THAT IS A MF FACT. I had to take it twice to get a borderline C. I was liking her ass (teacher) by end of semester. Fuck! Micro, Anatomy and physiology were more work intensive, but not as hard as Chemistry.

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What would you do, in my situation? Talking to him is apparently not working; I tried that tonight...but he walked out of the conversation, and told me to "get over it." Other than notifying the Dean, I don't really know what else to do...so does someone have an idea?

I would talk to him and make peace. If you are sure he’s gonna downgrade for this then preemptively talk to his department. There is a protocol for filing complaints against teachers in your student handbook or catalogue. Just don’t be paranoid and assume he’s gonna downgrade you for this. The mind can manifest gremlins that then become problems.

BTW, Bush isn't my pres either

[Lucky... 0]

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Sit tight. You can't get to be a dean in an American university unless you're liberal. He (she) will not be sympathetic. It is, after all, a chem class. Don't take the bait. If he talks trash just don't reply.

That's a real, Croc! In the univ I attended with the sitation I stated, the department was hardcore Nazi. The chair was this lady who was pissed I dare appeal this, condemned me for not spelling his name correctly, until I produced his hand-typed syllibi with 1 of 3 spelled correctly. Drop this insanity of colleges/univs being all liberal, you guys sound like us, liberal whiners when you do that.

[Lucky... 0]

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Remain calm and go on about your business, if you do not receive a fair grade it will be readily apparent, if this does occur make a copy of your test bring it to the Dean of Students and if not action is taken to correct this then you will have the right to go to the president/chancellor and or the media on what an asshat like him uses his classroom and student fees for.

He sounds like if he had to have a job outside of academia he might realize he is a prick.

The fact that he is surrounded by nothing more than other elitest academics, who share all of the same opinions, deludes him further into his misconception.

He may show that he can be fair and give you a grade based soley upon your knowledge of teh subject matter, I kind of doubt it at this point but we shall see wont we?

Tape Him in class you have the right and it is nothing more than note taking.

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Tape Him in class you have the right and it is nothing more than note taking

Not neccesarily. Check with state law and school procedures/rules. Furthermore, isn't the semester over? If there has been adverse realtions, he may not give you the bait anymore.

[mnealtx 0]

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Although if you go to the latter and have 100% Repub feelings, well, you won’t be well received. If you go to the former and have just 1 Dem ideal, you’re fucked. You don’t discuss things with Republicans, you look at their schedule of predestined rules and ideologies and adhere or be damned.

Yeah, right.... compare DU or OAC to almost any conservative discussion board out there - who bans / blocks anyone who opposes the "party line"? Yup... DU and OAC.



*wheeze*



OH shit, I needed that... thanks, man!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[downwardspiral 0]

Michelle, Michelle, Michelle.....I'll try not to be harsh but let me say first that I think your professor is wrong in bringing up politics in front of his chemistry class. However, you were as much a party to situation's escalation by challenging him in front of HIS class. I don't understand why you would do that and to what end?

Also what makes you think that this "incident" could possibly affect your grade? Did he threaten you? If not, don't you think you might look the fool by bringing this incident to the Dean's attention especially since you actually DIDN'T hear the professor's conversation with the other student? You might just end up looking a bit paranoid.

Personally, I feel you are freaking out over nothing and this is an incident not worth hurting anyone's career over.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[Lucky... 0]

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Although if you go to the latter and have 100% Repub feelings, well, you won’t be well received. If you go to the former and have just 1 Dem ideal, you’re fucked. You don’t discuss things with Republicans, you look at their schedule of predestined rules and ideologies and adhere or be damned.

Yeah, right.... compare DU or OAC to almost any conservative discussion board out there - who bans / blocks anyone who opposes the "party line"? Yup... DU and OAC.



*wheeze*



OH shit, I needed that... thanks, man!

DU, OAC? I'm not limiting this to anything. It could be a discussion board, an RNC or DNC convention, anything. I believe it to be true that the Repub protocol is to be hard lined and allow for no deviance. The Dems are the party of progress and change and allow for ideas other than those written in stone 100's of years ago.

[mnealtx 0]

democratic underground and old american century websites

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Lucky... 0]

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Michelle, Michelle, Michelle.....I'll try not to be harsh but let me say first that I think your professor is wrong in bringing up politics in front of his chemistry class. However, you were as much a party to situation's escalation by challenging him in front of HIS class. I don't understand why you would do that and to what end?

Also what makes you think that this "incident" could possibly affect your grade? Did he threaten you? If not, don't you think you might look the fool by bringing this incident to the Dean's attention especially since you actually DIDN'T hear the professor's conversation with the other student? You might just end up looking a bit paranoid.

Personally, I feel you are freaking out over nothing and this is an incident not worth hurting anyone's career over.

I tend to agree and even if he was talking about you, who's to say he didn't just say something about how misguided he feels you you are and leave it at that? He could have hammered you or he could have said nothing about you or somewhere inbetween, so what? Have you ever talked about another person behind their back? Of course you have, so has the teacher, so has Mother Theresa; so what?

I think you're being hypersensitive, which doesn't mean he won't downgrade you. Doesn't mean he will, but doesn't relate to it at all. In teh future, when trying to see what teh grading trend is of a given teacher, use this:

http://pickaprof.com/

[tigra 0]

What he said.

Clearly the best and most relevant post to this thread.

Why not keep the chem lab for chemistry and save your political discussions/ debates for the coffee shop?

[Michele 1]

I might be being hypersensitive...and I might not be. All I know is he was pounding me. Did I escalate it? Perhaps, but I also realized that, and kept saying "let's agree to disagree" in an attempt to stop that and to get back to the topic - Chemistry.

The problem isn't necessarily the politics in the classroom - it was the bullshit commentary afterwards to a fellow classmate. The problem is also that I am not pulling an A in the class - and that's simply because I don't grok the material very well. However, at this point, I am indeed concerned that he will be downgrading me unnecessarily because of personal feelings. Do I think he will do that? Dunno...but the possibility is there. Furthermore, the issue was compounded because he took the time and during break, researched, printed out, and brought me the article from the Constitution. He continued, and escalated, at that point...and then I caught him discussing me with a student.

As for taping, I doubt that it will help; he's likely to not bring up the topic again. However, I will bring my tape recorder, and will have it there should the need arise.

Lucky, that site doesn't have my school on it. However, on Ratemyprofessor.com, he is the lowest rated professor in the department. He knows it, and "brags" about it.

Warpedskydiver, thanks for the advice. I'll consider that carefully.

Appreciate the opinions and the discussion...

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[Michele 1]

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Unless its a conservative position.. then it would be ok of course.

Not necessarily, Jeanne. I'd be upset if he were conservative and pounded a lib in a Chemistry class...and especially if he commented to me that the other student was unintelligent. See, that's inappropriate in a chem class, and even in a poli-sci class. Instructors are supposed to instruct, and encourage learning and to teach; when one simply insults another, no learning takes place (you see that here constantly...although here, it's no biggie; this isn't a classroom).

Althought most of the class had left at break, I had stayed because I had additional questions. Because of his actions after break (his unwillingness to let it go...), I never asked the questions. And that bothers me.

As for the person who said "the semester's over", it's not. It's winter intersession, and it doesn't end until next week Friday. I have two exams during that time; one on Monday, and the final on Friday. Together, those exams are worth 300 points, plenty to knock my score down below passing, and certainly enough to take me off my B. What he's done in the past for everyone is allow partial credit on the problems....but my concern is that I'll make enough mistakes that he's allowed in the past and that he allows others to make, but he'll remove all points for that error...which he might not do for others. Because of that, my concern is valid.

The session will be over in 1 week; and then I'll be on back to those classes which I both enjoy and understand...it's just a matter of making it through this week and these exams fairly.

And again, just to make it clear...I like this guy as a person, differing opinions and all. I am just quite bothered about the whole event last night...and concerned it will indeed impact my grade.

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[waltappel 1]

Michele,

Whether you like it or not, that's just the way things are while you are in school. Your teachers and professors have you in a vulnerable position and there is little you can do about it. Most are professional and stick to the topics they are teaching but others, not so much.

I'm not going to talk right and wrong here because I think that with the exception of criminal acts, right and wrong are sort of irrelevant in that situation.

You need to have it very clear in your mind what you want to achieve in school. Do you want an education or do you want to get a degree and have a 4.0 GPA? Generally, you'll need to choose one or the other because the "educational" system is not really compatible with getting both.

Let me spell it out for you in very clear terms. If you want a degree and a 4.0 GPA you will do things like ask around to find the easiest professors for the courses you need to take and you will get copies of their old exams. You will visit them during office hours and do some not-so-obvious brown-nosing and act like their field of study is the most fascinating thing you have ever been exposed to. You will *not* disagree when they express opinions you disagree with.

On the other hand, a real education must involve open debate and the free exchange of ideas. The problem, as you point out, is that doing so can get people annoyed at you and if those people have the ability to jerk you around, they may well do so.

My advice is to decide what you want (education or degree) and stick with an approach that will ensure success. Don't bother with going to the Dean. That may result in some action toward your instructor but it will do nothing to contribute to your long-term goal unless your goal is to clean up the "educational" system.

Walt

[PhreeZone 15]

I would be interested to see out of all those that are giving Michelle advice how long ago it has been or if they were ever in a college setting.

It was my experience in college just a few years ago that only those seeking a political debate would find one. If you never bring politics up most other people will never bring their political thoughts up also. The classroom was for the specific purpose of talking about the subject we were on, not bringing up side tangets with current political topics. I was in college during the 2000 election, 9/11 and a few other hottly debated political events so I know a tad about being around the "liberal establishment" when things were getting intersting in the world.

Unless you seek out a confrontation with politics most people will not force their political views on the public. Now if you have said things in the past that conflict with others views then they will probally throw their views out there too.

Best thing to do is to just sit back and follow along in class and leave your political thoughts at the door unless you are in a Poli-Sci class. If someone says something that you disagree with socially or politically then ignore it unless they are talking about the specific class you are in.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

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[JohnnyD 0]

Quote

As for taping, I doubt that it will help; he's likely to not bring up the topic again. However, I will bring my tape recorder, and will have it there should the need arise.

Holy crap. How much free time do you have? This is an AP class right? Get in, do your work and get out. A week from now you will see this guy rarely if ever. By the time you graduate, you won't be able to remember his name. Normally, adults that are going to college or back to college are way past spending time on the trivial bullshit. Good luck on your tests. Do you really think your prof gives a crap how you do either way? He grades and records - if he even grades himself. Spend your time worrying about crap that matters.

[Mockingbird 0]

Michele, Hi! Here are my thoughts.

1. This guy is wasting his students' time.
2. He was hired to teach chemistry, not poli sci.
3. The school is obviously desperate for faculty.
4. I would tape record a class and give it the dean of faculty-- but wait til the semester is behind you.
5. As for the converstation behind your back thing, that's just so middle-schoolish. He's awfully immature. How did he get this far?
6. As for not wanting to get him in trouble, bah. He deserves the complaint and needs a re-evaluation (AFTER you're out of his class). Do you want other students to be subjected to his type of education?
7. The guy's a first-class jerk... but I guess even jerks need a job; why not teach?
8. In the meantime, study hard. If you do well but still make a lousy grade for all the wrong reasons, we can deal with that when/if it happens. For now, concern yourself with the test.

Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird
"Why is there something rather than nothing?"