skydyvr 0 #51 August 11, 2006 QuoteI'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Dude, the WORLD should be happy that plot was foiled by the NSA. I believe the next time Al-Qaida (most likely, unless it was a Tennesse milita guy lol) pulls off a successful attack of that magnitude, the current conflict will look like a barfight compared to what will come. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #52 August 11, 2006 There needs to be a balance Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #53 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThis is obviously a thinly veiled plot by Bush and Blair to get Lieberman re-elected and to shore up support for the right-wing in the coming elections. Ever notice how whenever one of Bush's buddies poll numbers are dropping that something like this happens? I've read that the intel for this bust came from info gathered by the NSA listening machine. I wonder what the folks who argued this against you think now? You noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Unlike the Chairborn Ostriches who sit comfortably behind their keyboards and choose to send innocent civilians off to their deaths because they don't want to have a couple of keywords of their conversations monitored. So an assumption suddenly becomes fact. For now, I'm sticking with the theory that this is just a plot by Bush and his buddies at PNAC to drum up support for Lieberman and the Republicans in the next election cycle. Unless you have some facts to the contrary. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #54 August 11, 2006 QuoteThe report I read said the information came from British Intelligence, not the NSA. I've heard the NSA provided key information from two TV news sources. Either FOX and CNN are correct, or they will need to retract what they said. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,651 #55 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteI'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Dude, the WORLD should be happy that plot was foiled by the NSA. I believe the next time Al-Qaida (most likely, unless it was a Tennesse milita guy lol) pulls off a successful attack of that magnitude, the current conflict will look like a barfight compared to what will come. My understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #56 August 11, 2006 QuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,651 #57 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #58 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html QuoteThwarting the Airline Plot: Inside the Investigation Exclusive: U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities; new federal alert warns that peroxide-based explosives could also be employed in future attacks in the U.S. Back at you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #59 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4780815.stm Doing the round-robin of internet & TV News here, it does seem that this all started with an arrest in Pakistan which led to monitoring in Britain. Given that any comms intercepts would go through GCHQ in Cheltenham (which has a significant American presence), then The NSA would have certainly been well in the loop from the off. I'll bet there's a similar Pakistani-American joint facility in Pakistan. Indeed, I'd expect that the original intelligence went from Pakistan to Britain via the NSA. Well done, Postman Pat. This was developed co-operatively. People working together! Although sometimes that seems a strange concept here. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Gravitymaster 0 #60 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4780815.stm Doing the round-robin of internet & TV News here, it does seem that this all started with an arrest in Pakistan which led to monitoring in Britain. Given that any comms intercepts would go through GCHQ in Cheltenham (which has a significant American presence), then The NSA would have certainly been well in the loop from the off. I'll bet there's a similar Pakistani-American joint facility in Pakistan. Indeed, I'd expect that the original intelligence went from Pakistan to Britain via the NSA. Well done, Postman Pat. This was developed co-operatively. People working together! Although sometimes that seems a strange concept here. Mike. I'm just glad this plot was discovered. Those planes hold, what, 300-400 people each? This could have been as large a loss of life as we had on 9/11. Whatever the process involved in uncovering this terror attempt, it worked and 2000-3000 innocent people are still alive. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites miked10270 0 #61 August 11, 2006 QuoteI'm just glad this plot was discovered. Those planes hold, what, 300-400 people each? This could have been as large a loss of life as we had on 9/11. Whatever the process involved in uncovering this terror attempt, it worked and 2000-3000 innocent people are still alive. Rather more than that. This would have dwarfed 9/11. Putting myself in the Terrorist's mind, the time to detonate wouldn't have been in mid flight. it would have been at the beginning or end of the flight... When you can see buildings out of your window. They talk of 10 flights being targetted; I'll bet that a look at airline schedules would give near simultaneous arrivals at several US Cities (with the planes still having some 20% of fuel remaining) along with departures from UK airports (BA's Gatwick-Phoenix flight actually climbs out over London with a good view of The Millenium Dome & it won't be the only one)! Initial reports would simply have been of plane crashes on approach to landing or shortly after take-off. Only when all the reports started to come together would planes be grounded, but anything still in the air HAS to land somewhere, doesn't it. The only airport I can think of which could take potential bomb-carrying planes with minimal loss of life if it blows up on approach is Gander. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nigel99 151 #62 August 11, 2006 [rant Jeez it pisses me off when the US tries to grab credit for things. Bloody MI5 has been monitoring this for some months, then people try and pass the credit to the NSA. Firstly the NSA is only released the information WHEN a flight takes off and not before (still contravening the data protection act). The brits are much more clued on terrorism - sorry but this gets my back up. /rant]Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites busaunit 0 #63 August 11, 2006 I wonder where these terrorist got there funding from this time. last time the usa funded there own terroist attack,sep 11 , i wounder what government employed these guys? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #64 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html QuoteThwarting the Airline Plot: Inside the Investigation Exclusive: U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities; new federal alert warns that peroxide-based explosives could also be employed in future attacks in the U.S. Back at you. So you know that this was part of Bush's unConstitutional eavesdropping program, rather than the kind of stuff NSA has been doing for generations? You are STILL making unwarranted assumptions.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #65 August 11, 2006 QuoteYou noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Wrong YET again Bucko....it was humint in the UK and Pakistan. http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14275048/?GT1=8404 QuoteUnlike the Chairborn Ostriches who sit comfortably behind their keyboards and choose to send innocent civilians off to their deaths because they don't want to have a couple of keywords of their conversations monitored. I was under the opinion those were Chickenhawks.... who do not give a dayum about the people they are sending off to war... since they have no clue what its all about. But the spying does work well against the american people to keep your favorite fascists in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,436 #66 August 11, 2006 > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #67 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuote I've read that the intel for this bust came from info gathered by the NSA listening machine. I wonder what the folks who argued this against you think now? You noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. My complaints about the NSA program involved warrantless domestic spying on citizens who are not suspected of any crimes, not spying on foreign conversations between non-citizens who are suspected of crimes. And where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #68 August 11, 2006 QuoteAnd where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" That is exactly what happened but the fascists around here need to mollify people into believing their domestic spying program is good for all of us. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #69 August 11, 2006 Quotehttp://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html The same article you cited reads: QuoteBritain's MI-5 intelligence service and Scotland Yard had been tracking the plot for several months, but only in the past two weeks had the plotters' planning begun to crystallize, senior U.S. officials tell TIME. In the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. Most of the suspects are second or third generation British citizens of Pakistani descent whose families hailed from war-torn Kashmir. U.S. officials believe the 29 members were divided into multiple cells and planned to break into small groups to board the nine planes. So who are we going to invade for this one, Great Britain or Pakistan? Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steveorino 7 #70 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. One could only wish, but don't hold your breath. steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #71 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. There was remarkably little crime in the former Soviet Union and its vassal states. All we have to do to keep safe is to adopt the old Soviet ways. Some, on the other hand, would prefer to maintain the freedoms granted in the Bill of Rights and accept that some additional risk is associated with freedom.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Channman 2 #72 August 11, 2006 > > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #73 August 11, 2006 Quote> > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? All of us. Big Brother goes by the name Echelon.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #74 August 11, 2006 How about we fuck with them? Every time that you make a phone call make sure that you throw in phases like.... New Clear solution. Should keep the busy for a while and you get the chance to make new friends. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites lummy 4 #75 August 11, 2006 QuoteIn the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. From the article you cited, it seems that the British already knew of the plot and the NSA only provided the communications in the last few days. By no means does it say that the plot was uncovered due to the NSA wiretaps. Just want to also point out that in this case it sounds like it would be a slam dunk to get a warrant for those wiretaps.I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. eat sushi, get smoochieTTK#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 3 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. 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Gravitymaster 0 #60 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4780815.stm Doing the round-robin of internet & TV News here, it does seem that this all started with an arrest in Pakistan which led to monitoring in Britain. Given that any comms intercepts would go through GCHQ in Cheltenham (which has a significant American presence), then The NSA would have certainly been well in the loop from the off. I'll bet there's a similar Pakistani-American joint facility in Pakistan. Indeed, I'd expect that the original intelligence went from Pakistan to Britain via the NSA. Well done, Postman Pat. This was developed co-operatively. People working together! Although sometimes that seems a strange concept here. Mike. I'm just glad this plot was discovered. Those planes hold, what, 300-400 people each? This could have been as large a loss of life as we had on 9/11. Whatever the process involved in uncovering this terror attempt, it worked and 2000-3000 innocent people are still alive. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites miked10270 0 #61 August 11, 2006 QuoteI'm just glad this plot was discovered. Those planes hold, what, 300-400 people each? This could have been as large a loss of life as we had on 9/11. Whatever the process involved in uncovering this terror attempt, it worked and 2000-3000 innocent people are still alive. Rather more than that. This would have dwarfed 9/11. Putting myself in the Terrorist's mind, the time to detonate wouldn't have been in mid flight. it would have been at the beginning or end of the flight... When you can see buildings out of your window. They talk of 10 flights being targetted; I'll bet that a look at airline schedules would give near simultaneous arrivals at several US Cities (with the planes still having some 20% of fuel remaining) along with departures from UK airports (BA's Gatwick-Phoenix flight actually climbs out over London with a good view of The Millenium Dome & it won't be the only one)! Initial reports would simply have been of plane crashes on approach to landing or shortly after take-off. Only when all the reports started to come together would planes be grounded, but anything still in the air HAS to land somewhere, doesn't it. The only airport I can think of which could take potential bomb-carrying planes with minimal loss of life if it blows up on approach is Gander. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nigel99 151 #62 August 11, 2006 [rant Jeez it pisses me off when the US tries to grab credit for things. Bloody MI5 has been monitoring this for some months, then people try and pass the credit to the NSA. Firstly the NSA is only released the information WHEN a flight takes off and not before (still contravening the data protection act). The brits are much more clued on terrorism - sorry but this gets my back up. /rant]Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites busaunit 0 #63 August 11, 2006 I wonder where these terrorist got there funding from this time. last time the usa funded there own terroist attack,sep 11 , i wounder what government employed these guys? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #64 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html QuoteThwarting the Airline Plot: Inside the Investigation Exclusive: U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities; new federal alert warns that peroxide-based explosives could also be employed in future attacks in the U.S. Back at you. So you know that this was part of Bush's unConstitutional eavesdropping program, rather than the kind of stuff NSA has been doing for generations? You are STILL making unwarranted assumptions.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #65 August 11, 2006 QuoteYou noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Wrong YET again Bucko....it was humint in the UK and Pakistan. http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14275048/?GT1=8404 QuoteUnlike the Chairborn Ostriches who sit comfortably behind their keyboards and choose to send innocent civilians off to their deaths because they don't want to have a couple of keywords of their conversations monitored. I was under the opinion those were Chickenhawks.... who do not give a dayum about the people they are sending off to war... since they have no clue what its all about. But the spying does work well against the american people to keep your favorite fascists in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,436 #66 August 11, 2006 > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #67 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuote I've read that the intel for this bust came from info gathered by the NSA listening machine. I wonder what the folks who argued this against you think now? You noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. My complaints about the NSA program involved warrantless domestic spying on citizens who are not suspected of any crimes, not spying on foreign conversations between non-citizens who are suspected of crimes. And where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #68 August 11, 2006 QuoteAnd where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" That is exactly what happened but the fascists around here need to mollify people into believing their domestic spying program is good for all of us. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #69 August 11, 2006 Quotehttp://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html The same article you cited reads: QuoteBritain's MI-5 intelligence service and Scotland Yard had been tracking the plot for several months, but only in the past two weeks had the plotters' planning begun to crystallize, senior U.S. officials tell TIME. In the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. Most of the suspects are second or third generation British citizens of Pakistani descent whose families hailed from war-torn Kashmir. U.S. officials believe the 29 members were divided into multiple cells and planned to break into small groups to board the nine planes. So who are we going to invade for this one, Great Britain or Pakistan? Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steveorino 7 #70 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. One could only wish, but don't hold your breath. steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #71 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. There was remarkably little crime in the former Soviet Union and its vassal states. All we have to do to keep safe is to adopt the old Soviet ways. Some, on the other hand, would prefer to maintain the freedoms granted in the Bill of Rights and accept that some additional risk is associated with freedom.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Channman 2 #72 August 11, 2006 > > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #73 August 11, 2006 Quote> > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? All of us. Big Brother goes by the name Echelon.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #74 August 11, 2006 How about we fuck with them? Every time that you make a phone call make sure that you throw in phases like.... New Clear solution. Should keep the busy for a while and you get the chance to make new friends. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites lummy 4 #75 August 11, 2006 QuoteIn the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. From the article you cited, it seems that the British already knew of the plot and the NSA only provided the communications in the last few days. By no means does it say that the plot was uncovered due to the NSA wiretaps. Just want to also point out that in this case it sounds like it would be a slam dunk to get a warrant for those wiretaps.I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. eat sushi, get smoochieTTK#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 3 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. 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miked10270 0 #61 August 11, 2006 QuoteI'm just glad this plot was discovered. Those planes hold, what, 300-400 people each? This could have been as large a loss of life as we had on 9/11. Whatever the process involved in uncovering this terror attempt, it worked and 2000-3000 innocent people are still alive. Rather more than that. This would have dwarfed 9/11. Putting myself in the Terrorist's mind, the time to detonate wouldn't have been in mid flight. it would have been at the beginning or end of the flight... When you can see buildings out of your window. They talk of 10 flights being targetted; I'll bet that a look at airline schedules would give near simultaneous arrivals at several US Cities (with the planes still having some 20% of fuel remaining) along with departures from UK airports (BA's Gatwick-Phoenix flight actually climbs out over London with a good view of The Millenium Dome & it won't be the only one)! Initial reports would simply have been of plane crashes on approach to landing or shortly after take-off. Only when all the reports started to come together would planes be grounded, but anything still in the air HAS to land somewhere, doesn't it. The only airport I can think of which could take potential bomb-carrying planes with minimal loss of life if it blows up on approach is Gander. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 151 #62 August 11, 2006 [rant Jeez it pisses me off when the US tries to grab credit for things. Bloody MI5 has been monitoring this for some months, then people try and pass the credit to the NSA. Firstly the NSA is only released the information WHEN a flight takes off and not before (still contravening the data protection act). The brits are much more clued on terrorism - sorry but this gets my back up. /rant]Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
busaunit 0 #63 August 11, 2006 I wonder where these terrorist got there funding from this time. last time the usa funded there own terroist attack,sep 11 , i wounder what government employed these guys? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #64 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html QuoteThwarting the Airline Plot: Inside the Investigation Exclusive: U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities; new federal alert warns that peroxide-based explosives could also be employed in future attacks in the U.S. Back at you. So you know that this was part of Bush's unConstitutional eavesdropping program, rather than the kind of stuff NSA has been doing for generations? You are STILL making unwarranted assumptions.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #65 August 11, 2006 QuoteYou noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Wrong YET again Bucko....it was humint in the UK and Pakistan. http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14275048/?GT1=8404 QuoteUnlike the Chairborn Ostriches who sit comfortably behind their keyboards and choose to send innocent civilians off to their deaths because they don't want to have a couple of keywords of their conversations monitored. I was under the opinion those were Chickenhawks.... who do not give a dayum about the people they are sending off to war... since they have no clue what its all about. But the spying does work well against the american people to keep your favorite fascists in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,436 #66 August 11, 2006 > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #67 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuote I've read that the intel for this bust came from info gathered by the NSA listening machine. I wonder what the folks who argued this against you think now? You noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. My complaints about the NSA program involved warrantless domestic spying on citizens who are not suspected of any crimes, not spying on foreign conversations between non-citizens who are suspected of crimes. And where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #68 August 11, 2006 QuoteAnd where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" That is exactly what happened but the fascists around here need to mollify people into believing their domestic spying program is good for all of us. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #69 August 11, 2006 Quotehttp://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html The same article you cited reads: QuoteBritain's MI-5 intelligence service and Scotland Yard had been tracking the plot for several months, but only in the past two weeks had the plotters' planning begun to crystallize, senior U.S. officials tell TIME. In the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. Most of the suspects are second or third generation British citizens of Pakistani descent whose families hailed from war-torn Kashmir. U.S. officials believe the 29 members were divided into multiple cells and planned to break into small groups to board the nine planes. So who are we going to invade for this one, Great Britain or Pakistan? Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steveorino 7 #70 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. One could only wish, but don't hold your breath. steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #71 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. There was remarkably little crime in the former Soviet Union and its vassal states. All we have to do to keep safe is to adopt the old Soviet ways. Some, on the other hand, would prefer to maintain the freedoms granted in the Bill of Rights and accept that some additional risk is associated with freedom.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Channman 2 #72 August 11, 2006 > > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,651 #73 August 11, 2006 Quote> > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? All of us. Big Brother goes by the name Echelon.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #74 August 11, 2006 How about we fuck with them? Every time that you make a phone call make sure that you throw in phases like.... New Clear solution. Should keep the busy for a while and you get the chance to make new friends. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites lummy 4 #75 August 11, 2006 QuoteIn the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. From the article you cited, it seems that the British already knew of the plot and the NSA only provided the communications in the last few days. By no means does it say that the plot was uncovered due to the NSA wiretaps. Just want to also point out that in this case it sounds like it would be a slam dunk to get a warrant for those wiretaps.I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. eat sushi, get smoochieTTK#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 3 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
kallend 1,651 #64 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteMy understanding was that British and Pakistani intelligence foiled the plot, not the NSA. The FBI was apparently briefed by the Brits, not the other way around. See above, we shall see. Indeed, until then I suggest you don't leap to conclusions. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html QuoteThwarting the Airline Plot: Inside the Investigation Exclusive: U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities; new federal alert warns that peroxide-based explosives could also be employed in future attacks in the U.S. Back at you. So you know that this was part of Bush's unConstitutional eavesdropping program, rather than the kind of stuff NSA has been doing for generations? You are STILL making unwarranted assumptions.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #65 August 11, 2006 QuoteYou noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. Wrong YET again Bucko....it was humint in the UK and Pakistan. http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14275048/?GT1=8404 QuoteUnlike the Chairborn Ostriches who sit comfortably behind their keyboards and choose to send innocent civilians off to their deaths because they don't want to have a couple of keywords of their conversations monitored. I was under the opinion those were Chickenhawks.... who do not give a dayum about the people they are sending off to war... since they have no clue what its all about. But the spying does work well against the american people to keep your favorite fascists in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,436 #66 August 11, 2006 > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #67 August 11, 2006 QuoteQuote I've read that the intel for this bust came from info gathered by the NSA listening machine. I wonder what the folks who argued this against you think now? You noticed the silence too, eh? Most likely they won't comment or will come up with the normal bullshit reason why they weren't really wrong or how it's not exactly what they meant or how it still doesn't justify listening for keywords. I'll bet those people who were ready to board those planes are happy the plot was foiled by the NSA info. My complaints about the NSA program involved warrantless domestic spying on citizens who are not suspected of any crimes, not spying on foreign conversations between non-citizens who are suspected of crimes. And where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #68 August 11, 2006 QuoteAnd where are you guys getting the info that the NSA's program was what brought this plan to light? I thought I read somewhere that it was a tip by a British muslim that kicked the investigation into gear. Your claims sound like dishonest grandstanding in an effort to win support for the project, when it wasn't even our intelligence community who foiled the plot. "Something good happened! Let's take credit for it!" That is exactly what happened but the fascists around here need to mollify people into believing their domestic spying program is good for all of us. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #69 August 11, 2006 Quotehttp://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1225453,00.html The same article you cited reads: QuoteBritain's MI-5 intelligence service and Scotland Yard had been tracking the plot for several months, but only in the past two weeks had the plotters' planning begun to crystallize, senior U.S. officials tell TIME. In the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. Most of the suspects are second or third generation British citizens of Pakistani descent whose families hailed from war-torn Kashmir. U.S. officials believe the 29 members were divided into multiple cells and planned to break into small groups to board the nine planes. So who are we going to invade for this one, Great Britain or Pakistan? Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveorino 7 #70 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. One could only wish, but don't hold your breath. steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,651 #71 August 11, 2006 Quote> U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . A good example of how our most powerful weapon against terrorism is international cooperation and sharing of information. In the pro-war group's terms, we caught them by "holding hands and singing Kumbaya." They weren't caught by a bunch of Marines in Iraq. We didn't catch them by torturing a 20 year old cabbie to death. We didn't stop this by blowing a building up, or filling a mass grave with suspected insurgents. Let's hope people learn from this when they try to decide how to keep us safe from terrorist attacks in the future. There was remarkably little crime in the former Soviet Union and its vassal states. All we have to do to keep safe is to adopt the old Soviet ways. Some, on the other hand, would prefer to maintain the freedoms granted in the Bill of Rights and accept that some additional risk is associated with freedom.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #72 August 11, 2006 > > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,651 #73 August 11, 2006 Quote> > U.S. picked up the suspects' chatter and shared it with British authorities . . . It appears the NSA is doing its job and if I might add with court approval. Who here on DZ.com is being watched by the NSA?? All of us. Big Brother goes by the name Echelon.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #74 August 11, 2006 How about we fuck with them? Every time that you make a phone call make sure that you throw in phases like.... New Clear solution. Should keep the busy for a while and you get the chance to make new friends. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lummy 4 #75 August 11, 2006 QuoteIn the two or three days before the arrests, the cell was going operational, and authorities were pressed into action. MI5 and Scotland Yard agents tracked the plotters from the ground, while a knowledgeable American official says U.S. intelligence provided London authorities with intercepts of the group's communications. From the article you cited, it seems that the British already knew of the plot and the NSA only provided the communications in the last few days. By no means does it say that the plot was uncovered due to the NSA wiretaps. Just want to also point out that in this case it sounds like it would be a slam dunk to get a warrant for those wiretaps.I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. I promise not to TP Davis under canopy.. eat sushi, get smoochieTTK#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
