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ahegeman

Who owns an AR-15?

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from the link where you "saw no reference to that"

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The AR-10 rifle, designed by the Eugene Stoner at the Armalite division of the Fairchild Engine and Airplane Corp...



He's the John Browning of the second half of the century. You do know who he is, right?



I don't, is that OK?

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owned/own a couple

Not the happiest with Colt due to labor
and politics...and nonstandard pins >:(

Bushmaster is OK, Rock River Arms and
DSA very good, not a big DPMS fan for
customer service reasons.

Whatever you get, keep it clean, find
magazines that work reliably(99% of
the problem with an AR, in my experience)

I would not suggest using Wolf or other
Russian 5.56mm ammo due to the laquered
steel cases. Surplus GI ammo is pretty
easily found, and yes you want a 5.56mm
chamber in yours so you can shoot
5.56mm and .223. Some Olympic
Arms ARs had .223 chambers as well
as Bushy and Colts having one or the
other (I believe).

Good luck with it, they become an addiction.

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He's the John Browning of the second half of the century.



Amen to that. Eugene Stoner was the designer of The AR-5 & AR-7 survival rifles. The rifle knocks down & stores in it's own buttstock! It also floats whether assembled or knocked down.

He also designed the AR-10 & AR-15 rifles. The AR-10 would have been the sensible choice for the US Army but it got scared & went for the more traditional-looking M-14. The AR-15 was originally marketed for The RVN Army to be supplied under MAC(V) - Then 'said MAC(V) grunts saw it & the rest, as they say, is history!

Stoner's crowning moment in military small arms was the "Stoner 63 System". A single receiver to which items could be added to make anything from a short carbine right up to a crew served heavy MG! I still don't understand why that system didn't sell all over the world?:S

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

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I have a Bushmaster XM15-E2. some have mistaken it for an M4 with its collapsible stock and AK muzzle brake.

I LOVE it. at the time, I wished I could have afforded the "nato" version as I too prefer the 7.62 caliber. However, now that I have shot it, I like it. Since I bought mine to silence that paranoid little voice in my head (he only whispers, so I can ignore him ;) ) I do like the thought that in an extreme emergency I can carry quite a few more rounds than I could with my SKS.

My only caviat... try not to order parts from bushmaster.com. SLOW ass service. I orderd misc tools and parts ( sight tools, ambi charging handle mod, etc) and they literally took a week to ship them. I called 5 days after I hit submit to ask where it was, and was told " oh, that order should ship within the next 2 days.... " and that was after sitting on hold for 15-20 mins.

Now this WAS right after the ban was lifted, so that COULD have had an effect... but still... 6 days to ship? c'mon.
Two wrongs don't make a right, however three lefts DO!

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you want a 5.56mm chamber in yours so you can shoot
5.56mm and .223. Some Olympic Arms ARs had .223 chambers...



What's the difference between a "5.56mm chamber" and a ".223 chamber"?

I thought these were identical metric/caliber designations for the same thing...

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The 5.56 chamber is a little looser than the .223 standard. I'm not sure it really matters much, as I have put quite a few rounds of mil-spec ammo through a .223 chambers before I was made aware of this. I'm speculating that it might be more of a problem if you don't clean you firearm regularly.

There is a difference though, many manufacturers make you specify which one you want when you order a barrel/upper/parts kit.

Edited to add this link from Fulton Armory on 5.56 vs. .233 chambers: http://www.fulton-armory.com/556-vs-223-Chambers.htm

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I've even considered buying a stripped lower and building my own, but I've never done anything like that. I've got an engineering degree, maybe I should just suck it up and build the thing but I'd feel better if I knew someone who had done it themselves.



If you are at all inclined to build your own, then I would urge you to give it a shot. It's not hard, and really doesn't take any special tools (at least for the lower). It can also be educational and kind of satisfying. I've built several and not had any problem with any of them.

That being said, I wouldn't mess with assembling an upper. Re-barreling takes a few special tools and is not really worth the hassle unless you are needing to change the barrel on an upper you already have.

Feel free to PM me if you have any questions about it.

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from the link where you "saw no reference to that"

Quote

The AR-10 rifle, designed by the Eugene Stoner at the Armalite division of the Fairchild Engine and Airplane Corp...



He's the John Browning of the second half of the century. You do know who he is, right?



Hmmm, let me think......

nope - just don't care.

I have an AR-15 and don't care who he is - you don't have one and do know who he is.....

... I like my position better :P

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The 5.56 chamber is a little looser than the .223 standard.



I too have fired thousands of mil-surplus rounds through my Colt AR rifle.

As I now understand this situation, the 5.56 NATO and .223 commercial cartridges are identical. However the chambers into which they feed, and from which they are fired, may be slightly different.

My guess would be that this is due to military firearms often having looser tolerances than civilian firearms, so that they can ingest more dirt and still function properly.

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link from Fulton Armory on 5.56 vs. .233 chambers



Thanks for that link. I'm still confused though. There is a published maximum OAL (overall length) for the standard SAAMI chambers. As long as you don't exceed that, you should be okay. And that also conforms to the limitations required to make the rounds fit in the magazine. If it's too long to feed from the magazine, then it may also be jamming into the rifling, creating higher pressure upon firing.

I wish Fulton had said which military cartridges create the problem in the .223 SAAMI chamber...

Well I'll be darned, found this in my reloading manual: "Some people are shooting the 5.56mm military ammo in standard .223 rifles. This results in excessive pressures and those wishing to shoot this ammunition should have their rifle chambers throated to the military configuration."

This implies that military ammo is longer than commercial. And that's not true, in my experience. I just measured some SS109 mil surplus and some commercial loads with calipers. The commercial stuff was longer...

I've done that a lot, firing military ammo in a .223, and I know a lot of others who have also. I'm curious as to more technical specifics here. Mostly I shoot my own reloads these days.

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Eugene Stoner



He's the John Browning of the second half of the century. You do know who he is, right?



I have an AR-15 and don't care who he is - you don't have one and do know who he is.....

... I like my position better :P



Your reading comprehension sucks and you prefer to remain ignorant, while I am happy with my choice of firearms and continue educating myself...

Nope, I like my position better.
witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
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Eugene Stoner



He's the John Browning of the second half of the century. You do know who he is, right?



I have an AR-15 and don't care who he is - you don't have one and do know who he is.....

... I like my position better :P



Your reading comprehension sucks and you prefer to remain ignorant, while I am happy with my choice of firearms and continue educating myself...

Nope, I like my position better.




See, this makes DZ.com's rules a joke and draws obvious attention to the fact that they're absolutley subjective. Could it bo more obvius that the rules are for anyone with a conservative message to write what they want. In a recent post, Kennedy wrote something about calling me an assbag w/o even a public admonishment.

Here it is from my perspective:

1. Retaliate and be suspended

2. Draw attention to it and be called a whiner

3. Write the greenies and be told it's not an attack - but then return it to the conservtaives and rule 1,2, and 3 apply.


Let's get this straight - I'm not offended and prefer to exchange niceties like this. What I am offended by is the blatant actions of the greenies that overlook this stuff and penalize me when I return the serve. Actually it has been Biil so far that has done this, so I don't want to include them all.

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In a recent post, Kennedy wrote something about calling me an assbag w/o even a public admonishment.



Hmm. I checked the entire thread and your post was the only one containing "assbag".

Edit: What's even more funny is that you are complaining about attacks after referring to all police officers as "pigs" 17 times (I counted) in a recent thread.

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See, this makes DZ.com's rules a joke and draws obvious attention to the fact that they're absolutley subjective. Could it bo more obvius that the rules are for anyone with a conservative message to write what they want. In a recent post, Kennedy wrote something about calling me an assbag w/o even a public admonishment.

Here it is from my perspective:

1. Retaliate and be suspended

2. Draw attention to it and be called a whiner

3. Write the greenies and be told it's not an attack - but then return it to the conservtaives and rule 1,2, and 3 apply.


Let's get this straight - I'm not offended and prefer to exchange niceties like this. What I am offended by is the blatant actions of the greenies that overlook this stuff and penalize me when I return the serve. Actually it has been Biil so far that has done this, so I don't want to include them all.



I'm gonna be sure and send him a link to your post criticizing the moderation of this website...I believe that is one of the few things that isn't tolerated...this ain't no damned democracy...Have a nice day!:)
~R+R:)
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~...

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In a recent post, Kennedy wrote something about calling me an assbag w/o even a public admonishment.



Hmm. I checked the entire thread and your post was the only one containing "assbag".

Edit: What's even more funny is that you are complaining about attacks after referring to all police officers as "pigs" 17 times (I counted) in a recent thread.



Hmm. I checked the entire thread and your post was the only one containing "assbag".


Hmm, I went and rechecked it too and didn't find that I wrote, "assbag" anywhere. Please, corect me if I'm wrong, but I didn't find it in my text. If you can't find it maybe you can admit that you misstated that.

Edit: What's even more funny is that you are complaining about attacks after referring to all police officers as "pigs" 17 times (I counted) in a recent thread.

Your brevity on, "attacks" from what should have been, personal attacks seesm to be intentional. See, the rule is about personal attacks, and my statement wasn't directed at anyone. In fact, I don't know of any cops on the forum. Even if I did, the statements were general and never directed at anyone. I have no problem referring to cops in any derogatory way, even though there are a couple good ones out there,

So your referrence that I'm being hypocritical about personal attacks is moot due to your reference given is not a personal attack.

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See, this makes DZ.com's rules a joke and draws obvious attention to the fact that they're absolutley subjective. Could it bo more obvius that the rules are for anyone with a conservative message to write what they want. In a recent post, Kennedy wrote something about calling me an assbag w/o even a public admonishment.




Just thought I would point out where you said the word assbag....

Ok...but isn't all this talk off topic anyway?:S I was hoping to learn more about the AR-15, but I think I'll just watch History of the Gun on The History Channel...I can watch it without all the bickering, bitching, accusations, criticizing, and lies...

~R+R:)
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~...

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Just a small thing, but the NATO 7.62 is the same as a Winchester .308, which is a shortened version of the venerable 30.06. Both can be very accurate rounds.



Doh!:$ Sorry about that.

Regarding the "difference between .223" & 5.56mm NATO. Apparently it used to be the same thing - until Nato changed the standard slightly in the 1980's after some shoot-off between the original .223" Remington, The British 4.5mm (same cartridge necked down with longer, narrower, heavier bullet) & a "new" 5.56mm with a (slightly) shorter case & longer, heavier bullet for the same overall length.

From there, I'd suggest that a weapon chambered for .223" will chamber & fire 5.56mm NATO, and even conceivably 4.5mm (or was it 4.85mm... BUT WITHOUT THE PRECISE FIT! Hence the throat erosion.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

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>Your reading comprehension sucks and you prefer to remain
>ignorant . . .

Kennedy, consider this your one warning.

>Here it is from my perspective:

>1. Retaliate and be suspended

>2. Draw attention to it and be called a whiner

>3. Write the greenies and be told it's not an attack - but then
>return it to the conservtaives and rule 1,2, and 3 apply.

A good summary, along with 4) do not read things that make you angry.

>What I am offended by is the blatant actions of the greenies that
> overlook this stuff and penalize me when I return the serve.

Believe it or not, I don't spend all my time reading threads here; I actually do things like work and skydive on occasion. From the sticky on personal attacks from the top of the page:

-----------------------------
The moderators make an effort to keep track of the threads in the various forums. But with over 2000 posts a day on Dropzone.com, it's just not possible to read every post. If someone posts a personal attack and it is not deleted, there are two possibilities:

1. It wasn't really a personal attack in the view of the moderators

2. A moderator hasn't seen it yet

In such cases an email/PM to the moderators of that section can help us keep tabs on the threads that are getting rambunctious.
------------------------------

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My only caviat... try not to order parts from bushmaster.com. SLOW ass service.



Yeah, I ordered some of the manuals from then a week ago and have yet to receive them.
---------------------------------------------------------------
There is a fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness'.
--Dave Barry

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The 5.56 chamber is a little looser than the .223 standard. I'm not sure it really matters much, as I have put quite a few rounds of mil-spec ammo through a .223 chambers before I was made aware of this. I'm speculating that it might be more of a problem if you don't clean you firearm regularly.

There is a difference though, many manufacturers make you specify which one you want when you order a barrel/upper/parts kit.

Edited to add this link from Fulton Armory on 5.56 vs. .233 chambers: http://www.fulton-armory.com/556-vs-223-Chambers.htm



From my experience (at least with bushmasters) you can only interchange if your barrel (sp? I just chugged 3 beers and there is a spelling for each bottle that makes sense) is stamped with "5.56 NATO", otherwise your weapon should ONLY be fired with .223 rounds. something about gas pressures of the 5.56 being MUCH higher to the point of causing the barrel to bulge and/or explode if it isnt stamped as such.
Two wrongs don't make a right, however three lefts DO!

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