Recommended Posts
ryoder 1,384
QuoteQuoteSo if freedom of speech does not apply to professors, then to whom does it apply?
Specifically NOT to college instructors, at least when they are in teaching mode.
Freedom of speech should apply to everyone, but this clown is preaching some fairly extreme and hurtful views to our kids. That's not speech, it's indoctrination.
High school teenagers are skeptical as hell of everything adults tell them. It's hard to believe they become blindly receptive as they get older.
Also,we know he wrote that article, but did he even use that as classroom material? I haven't heard that he did.
Quote
In fact, college professors should just keep their personal political views to themselves, period.
And you just made my point. Thank you.
skydyvr 0
QuoteI always understood that a major reason free speech is so valuable is that it allows individuals to decide for themselves which ideas are extreme or hurtful.
Once restrictions on free speech are allowed, someone else does your thinking for you.
That's far scarier to me than anything I read in his article or his follow up rebuttal.
Again, I don't see this as a free speech issue. It is an issue of incompetent teachers being allowed to function in a public school.
Quote1) College students are not kids, they are adults. As such, they are assumed to be generally capable of critical and independent thought.
I think of most of them as kids, but that's not overly relevant. I don't want public school teachers purveying hateful politics to anyone.
Quote2) His opinions are clearly unpalatable to many, but nothing I read incites or condones violence, and therefore is not at all comparable to advocating nuking all Muslims.
Churchill legitimizes the attack on the WTC in a most hurtful way, and that brought a lot of pain to a lot of people. He wasn't even sensitive about it, well at least not 'till his job got put on the line. Not that he shouldn't be allowed to have his opinions mind you -- I just don't like seeing him teach on a public college campus. I hope they fire him; he's an embarrassment to the school and higher education in general.
QuoteQuoteIn fact, college professors should just keep their personal political views to themselves, period.
That'd make teaching subjects such as oh, I don't know...political science, history, ethnic studies, sociology, geography, and so on, pretty damned difficult.
Hogwash. I am taking an advanced class in the history of western religion right now. It is extremely well taught, and I've learned a lot so far. But to the advantage of myself and the class, the Professor keeps his personal views out of it.
. . =(_8^(1)
skydyvr 0
QuoteQuoteIn fact, college professors should just keep their personal political views to themselves, period.
Anyone else you'd like to add to that list?
Yes, public high school and elementary school teachers.
. . =(_8^(1)
skydyvr 0
QuoteIn fact, college professors should just keep their personal political views to themselves, period.
And you just made my point. Thank you.
I meant my statement in the context of publically funded teachers when they are teaching. If that still makes your point, then good for you.
. . =(_8^(1)
Kennedy 0
Quote
Why is it that the American sheeple like to crow about their freedoms, (including the freedom of speech), but then as soon as someone says something they don't like, they start demanding that the offender's career should be ruined? A professor expresses his opinion, and now we have the governor of CO demanding his firing.
First off, I don't appreciate being called "sheeple."
Second, I never said he should be censored by the government. I was simply using my first amendment rights to point out what an asshat this guy is. Also, I support any college which wants to distance itself from such offensive rantings and ravings.
Why do some people seem to think that freedom of speech means freedom from consequences of that speech?
You can say anything you want, but don't expect to walk away smelling like roses after flinging shit like that.
QuoteI will defend his right to say it.
I do as well, but that doesn't mean I have to support him for doing it.
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
Kennedy 0
QuoteProfessor Refuses Apology for 9/11 Essay
DENVER - A professor who likened World Trade Center victims to a notorious Nazi refused to apologize but said his treatise was a "gut response" to the terrorist attacks.
"I don't believe I owe an apology," Ward Churchill said Friday on CNN's "Paula Zahn Now" program — his first public comments since the University of Colorado began a review that could lead to his dismissal.
Meanwhile, Wheaton College in Norton, Mass., and Eastern Washington University canceled plans for Churchill to speak on campus, citing public safety concerns. Stephen Jordan, president of Eastern Washington University, declined Friday to say whether specific threats had been made.
Churchill defended the essay in which he compared those killed in the Sept. 11 attack to "little Eichmanns," a reference to Adolf Eichmann, who organized Nazi plans to exterminate European Jews. He said the victims were akin to U.S. military operations' collateral damage — or innocent civilians mistakenly killed by soldiers.
"I don't know if the people of 9-11 specifically wanted to kill everybody that was killed," he told Zahn. "It was just worth it to them in order to do whatever it was they decided it was necessary to do that bystanders be killed. And that essentially is the same mentality, the same rubric."
In an interview published Saturday in the Rocky Mountain News, Churchill added, "This was a gut response opinion speech written in about four hours. It's not completely reasoned and thought through."
Churchill said his speech had been misinterpreted. "I never called for the deaths of millions of Americans," he said.
Early editions of the Sunday Denver Post reported Churchill gave another magazine interview in which he was asked about the effectiveness of protests of U.S. policies and the Iraq (news - web sites) war, and responded: "One of the things I've suggested is that it may be that more 9/11s are necessary."
The interview prompted Gov. Bill Owens to renew his call for Churchill's firing.
"It's amazing that the more we look at Ward Churchill, the more outrageous, treasonous statements we hear from Churchill," Owens said.
The furor over Churchill's essay erupted last month after he was invited to speak at Hamilton College in Clinton, N.Y. The speech was later canceled.
Churchill, who recently resigned as chairman of the ethnic studies department but remains a tenured professor, said he would sue if he were dismissed.
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*
ryoder 1,384
Quote
First off, I don't appreciate being called "sheeple."
Second, I never said he should be censored by the government. I was simply using my first amendment rights to point out what an asshat this guy is.
I wasn't making any comment directed at you, or anything you said. In fact, the postings you had made at the time I responded were verbatim quotes from news stories and essays, and you hadn't added any of your own comments.
They're not kids anymore. By the time we're in college we're likely at least 18 and hopefully able to think for ourselves.
Anyone else you'd like to add to that list?
-
Jim
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites