Do the moderators play favorites in deciding who to ban?

[penniless 0]

Quote

Quote

So you're in a boat and several people say they think it's leaking. Do you (1) Deny there's a leak, (2) Say there's a leak but we musn't rock the boat, (3) Ask for suggestions to fix the leak, or (4) say "this is a great boat, if you don't like this boat, get out and swim".

Horrible analogy. Let me make it closer.

You're in a fine restaurant getting a free meal and several people also getting free meals say they don't like the service. (1) Deny that the service is poor (2) Say, yeah the service is poor, but it's free food so who cares (3) Ask the waiter to provide better service (4) Tell the complainers to not look a gift horse in the mouth, no one is forcing them to be there and they can go to another restaurant or go home and cook their own meal.

It's not free food, it's a pot-luck dinner, we all bring our own and share it around. The room is what's free, along with the services of a bouncer who evaluates the food you bring.

We come here for the food we share, not on account of the room or the bouncer. Judging by the poll results it seems that 50%+ of the diners think the bouncer plays favorites in some way.

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

D'oh! How could I have forgotten about Derek? I guess I still kinda see him as a bit of a greenie.

NNNOOOOOOO!!!!!

The Moderators don't play favorites and go to great lengths to be fair. You (not anyone in particular, just a general 'you') have no idea. Thinking otherwise simply isn't fair to the them and the job they do.

Derek

[ladyskydiver 0]

Quote

Quote

D'oh! How could I have forgotten about Derek? I guess I still kinda see him as a bit of a greenie.

NNNOOOOOOO!!!!!

Derek

Yes, Derek...you look funny not being green.

Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.

[penniless 0]

Quote

Quote

D'oh! How could I have forgotten about Derek? I guess I still kinda see him as a bit of a greenie.

NNNOOOOOOO!!!!!

The Moderators don't play favorites and go to great lengths to be fair. You (not anyone in particular, just a general 'you') have no idea. Thinking otherwise simply isn't fair to the them and the job they do.

Derek

Perception is reality. Take a look at the poll. These are the people who use the forum and for whose benefit (supposedly) it is kindly operated by Sangiro.

[jerryzflies 0]

Quote

>So you're in a boat . . .

This isn't a boat. It's more like a hot dog stand that gives out free hotdogs (chili dogs cost extra.) If you don't like the free hotdogs, you can go to another hotdog stand. If you fight with people in line all the time, or curse at the sauerkraut guy, the owner might just say "no hotdog for you."

I didn't say it WAS a boat, I used that as an illustration of attitudes.

Your analogy is false. We come here for the content, not the template. The value added (your "hot dogs") is provided by people like tunaplanet and Phillykev, kennedy, kallend, wmd, Ron, Gawain, Anvil and others, all of whom can be abrasive but still add value.

If you ban all the smartasses and assholes (edited for PC), what you have left may not be worth much. Just IMO.

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

Perception is reality. Take a look at the poll.

People's opinion of the Moderators fairness doesn't mean they are or aren't fair.

It is a lot dofferent on the other side of the fence.

Take any court case and ask the loser and the winner if the verdict was fair. Too bad you can't bet on those results in Vegas.

Derek

[PhreeZone 15]

Speakers corner was created to bring more people to the site by removing all the content that was pissing people off in Talkback. This fourm is unsponsorable, costs nothing but bandwidth and does not further the discussion of Skydiving or build a sense of community at all like Bonfire does. If this fourm would go away tommorrow I don't think there would be more then a handful of people that would suddenly stop coming to the site.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[penniless 0]

Quote

Quote

Perception is reality. Take a look at the poll.

People's opinion of the Moderators fairness doesn't mean they are or aren't fair.

It is a lot dofferent on the other side of the fence.

Take any court case and ask the loser and the winner if the verdict was fair. Too bad you can't bet on those results in Vegas.

Derek

It all depends on whether you think SC is here for the benefit of the users or of the moderators or HH. If the user's perceptions don't count for anything, you are quite right. Generally speaking, ignoring your user base is not a smart way of conducting your business.

[AggieDave 6]

Then Bonfire might become like a *real* DZ bonfire, where politics, guns, etc are discussed. Usually a bit more civilized then done here, even with alcohol involed.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[PhillyKev 0]

Quote

Generally speaking, ignoring your user base is not a smart way of conducting your business.

If your goal is to make money. But as in all things skydiving related, if he's trying to make money from this site, it ain't gonna happen.

To be a customer, don't you have to pay something?

[penniless 0]

Quote

Speakers corner was created to bring more people to the site by removing all the content that was pissing people off in Talkback. This fourm is unsponsorable, costs nothing but bandwidth and does not further the discussion of Skydiving or build a sense of community at all like Bonfire does. If this fourm would go away tommorrow I don't think there would be more then a handful of people that would suddenly stop coming to the site.

Quite correct - so why is SC here at all? For whose benefit is it here? Is it for the users? In that case their perceptions and opinions should count for something. Is it to bring people to the site? Not very cost effective, according to you, so prolly not for that. Very hard to assess something unless you know what its purpose is.

[penniless 0]

Quote

Quote

Generally speaking, ignoring your user base is not a smart way of conducting your business.

If your goal is to make money. But as in all things skydiving related, if he's trying to make money from this site, it ain't gonna happen.

To be a customer, don't you have to pay something?

Who said "customer"? I said USER. Viewers don't pay to watch FOX, MTV or NBC, but FOX, MTV and NBC pay close attention to their viewers.

[PhillyKev 0]

Quote

Very hard to assess something unless you know what its purpose is.

Benevolence.

[penniless 0]

Quote

Quote

Very hard to assess something unless you know what its purpose is.

Benevolence.

Benevolence is assessed by seeing how much the recipients benefit.

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

If there were NOT a problem then this thread would have died after the first post.

If there were NOT a problem it wouldn't have started in the first place.

Nothing dies in Speaker's Corner. Everything is immortal...cept those who are sent out of the Garden for some purgatory from time to time.

If this forum were the core function of this social body, the inconsistencies and biases could be a problem. I've seen other ones decimated when the bbs owner used his root powers to edit and censor opposing viewpoints. Ultimately the other side left, and the site floundered.

But this place is about skydiving, something that should be pretty much politics free. People disagree, sometimes very strongly, but not because the other person voted for Bush.

The rules of the forums are pretty clear - no personal attacks, but obviously this is a know it when you see it type. Making it less vague than that will likely have undesired consequences.

[PhillyKev 0]

Benevolence is defined as a generous act. Providing a forum, which consists of paying out of pocket for bandwidth and storage space, for starters, for people to use without contributing to those costs meets that definition.

Networks charge advertisers to make a profit. This site charges advertisers to mitigate out of pocket costs as a result of its benevolence.

[peregrinerose 0]

I hope the greenies are cracking up over this thread. First there's a poll regarding how fair they are. Then the forum is compared to a boat, closely followed someone's home, then by restaurant and hot dog with chili, and now SC is being psychoanalyzed in an almost Freudian manner.

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

>So you're in a boat . . .

This isn't a boat. It's more like a hot dog stand that gives out free hotdogs (chili dogs cost extra.) If you don't like the free hotdogs, you can go to another hotdog stand. If you fight with people in line all the time, or curse at the sauerkraut guy, the owner might just say "no hotdog for you."

So are you the skydiving forum Nazi then? (Seinfelt reference)

[wmw999 2,177]

Quote

Suck it up, cupcakes

Have I told you lately you're eloquent? I liked penniless's post about the potluck, too (thanks for the correction, peregrinerose -- you sure could have come up with it)

Folks, this is what it is. If you don't like it, taking it offline with Sangiro, and volunteering to do the work, is more likely to end up in a way that you like than bitching about it here. And it still might not work.

If I run a carpool and don't let anyone play country music, I MIGHT give a privately-offered CD an audition if I'm assured that it's not same wailin' as usual. And if you give it to me in the car with everyone else there and tell me I'm being unfair, well, I'll get more irritated. And go back to not listening to country at all.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[peregrinerose 0]

Sorry, Penniless was the potluck writer, not me. Too bad too, it was a good analogy that I'd love to take credit for

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

Speakers corner was created to bring more people to the site by removing all the content that was pissing people off in Talkback. This fourm is unsponsorable, costs nothing but bandwidth and does not further the discussion of Skydiving or build a sense of community at all like Bonfire does. If this fourm would go away tommorrow I don't think there would be more then a handful of people that would suddenly stop coming to the site.

Naw, they would probably take their subjects to other parts of this forum. This is the trashcan of DZ.com, it's not like any venue is w/o trash; that's utopian.

[jerryzflies 0]

Quote

Speakers corner was created to bring more people to the site by removing all the content that was pissing people off in Talkback. This fourm is unsponsorable, costs nothing but bandwidth and does not further the discussion of Skydiving or build a sense of community at all like Bonfire does. If this fourm would go away tommorrow I don't think there would be more then a handful of people that would suddenly stop coming to the site.

Really, I get the distinct impression of community here, even from those with radically different ideas. Rather like Crossfire on the TV. Maybe I'm just too straightlaced for Bonfire but I find it mostly silly noise.

If you can't fix it with a hammer, the problem's electrical.

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

Quote

Speakers corner was created to bring more people to the site by removing all the content that was pissing people off in Talkback. This fourm is unsponsorable, costs nothing but bandwidth and does not further the discussion of Skydiving or build a sense of community at all like Bonfire does. If this fourm would go away tommorrow I don't think there would be more then a handful of people that would suddenly stop coming to the site.

Really, I get the distinct impression of community here, even from those with radically different ideas. Rather like Crossfire on the TV. Maybe I'm just too straightlaced for Bonfire but I find it mostly silly noise.

Ya, I agree!

[peregrinerose 0]

I ditto that. It's a slightly psychotic community, but still one big occasionally dysfunctional family.

Does that mean we have to group hug though?

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[penniless 0]

Quote

Benevolence is defined as a generous act. Providing a forum, which consists of paying out of pocket for bandwidth and storage space, for starters, for people to use without contributing to those costs meets that definition.

Networks charge advertisers to make a profit. This site charges advertisers to mitigate out of pocket costs as a result of its benevolence.

OK, so its purpose is not to make money for HH, but to provide charity to the users in a non-measurable way such that their perceptions don't matter because they're lucky to get it anyway. Did I get it right?

And I thought you opposed faith-based intiatives!