Bush's secret plan for Social Security

[kallend 1,623]

Well, he was asked to outline his plan at his press conference today, and he said he could not say what the plan is because it's actually Congress's job to fix SS. He did say that it's "hard", though.

When asked about how funding would continue for beneficiaries without cutting benefits or raising taxes while allowing privatization, he also said he couldn't say, but it's a hard problem.

I love these secret plans - reminds me of Nixon and his Vietnam War secret plan.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Vallerina 2]

But, who cares about what one of his main platforms back in 2000 was????? (insert eye-rolling icon here.) He failed on one of his promises....again. Here's my shocked face:

I still don't understand why people voted for him. It just really makes no sense to me.

There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning

[PhillyKev 0]

To keep fags from marrying...haven't you been paying attention?

[Vallerina 2]

Okay, that was funny! I nominate you the funniest poster on dz.com of 2004!

There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning

[rickjump1 0]

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I love these secret plans - reminds me of Nixon and his Vietnam War secret plan.

Reminds me of Hillary's secret health care reform.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[headoverheels 291]

Did you miss his statement regarding the proposed individually controlled SS funds? He stated that they could be passed on (implied inherited) to family members, if the person so chose.

[markd_nscr986 0]

*** still don't understand why people voted for him. It just really makes no sense to me.

uhhh......... because Kerry is perceived by most people as an even bigger imbecile

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

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uhhh......... because Kerry is perceived by most people as an even bigger imbecile

nah, it's because Bush talks like a grade school kid which appealed to the LCD in this country.

It was painful listening to his press conference this morning when he is laughing at everything he says
"ya know...war is hard (hehe) and america should know that it is hard (hehe) and together america and our troops will bring freedom to iraq (hehe)"

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[jcd11235 0]

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"ya know...war is hard (hehe) and america should know that it is hard (hehe) and together america and our troops will bring freedom to iraq (hehe)"

"Ya know... war is hard (These sheep are so stupid) and America should know that it is hard (I could convince them of anything, if I lie about it often enough) and together America and our troops will bring freedom to Iraq (and money to mine and my budies' bank accounts),

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[markd_nscr986 0]

***"Ya know... war is hard (These sheep are so stupid) and America should know that it is hard (I could convince them of anything, if I lie about it often enough) and together America and our troops will bring freedom to Iraq (and money to mine and my budies' bank accounts),

Ahhh yes, I forgot,getting rid of Saddam was such a bad thing to do too.........Bad Mr President,BadGood thing you told us what it is REALLY about

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

In related news:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2026&ncid=2026&e=2&u=/latimests/20041220/ts_latimes/medicarestroublesmaybesleepinggiant

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[jcd11235 0]

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I forgot,getting rid of Saddam was such a bad thing to do too

If Shrub had had a lick of integrity and told the people that he wanted to get rid of Husseign, that would be one thing, but he didn't.

Besides, there is a reason G.H.W.Buash did not remove Hussein from power during Desert Storm. We didn't have a government set up, ready to take S.H.'s place, something essential if you don't want to be an occupying force for years to come. Shrub did not heed even that advice.

Let me ask you this. How many times in the passed four years have you seen GHWB give unqualified support of his son and his son's actions? Every time I see, hear or read an interview, any support is always qualified. And that's his DAD, who is a REPUBLICAN.

Shrub is a disease to this country. I only hope it is not terminal.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[markd_nscr986 0]

***Shrub is a disease to this country. I only hope it is not terminal.


Have a little faith in the systemThere's only so much a man can do as President.It's the only thing that kept me going through 8 long years of Clinton.

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[PhillyKev 0]

In WSJ today, Bush is floating the prospect of raising the income cap on SS taxes.

[headoverheels 291]

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In WSJ today, Bush is floating the prospect of raising the income cap on SS taxes.

I'm not surprised. I could feel that in his press conference, even though it wasn't voiced.

[kelpdiver 2]

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I love these secret plans - reminds me of Nixon and his Vietnam War secret plan.

There's nothing secret about this sort of SS reform. But switching away from this foolish pay as you go plan will take away the deficit funding that SS provides, which is why Bush sat on it in his first term, and why Clinton never got past talking about it either.

[TomAiello 25]

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When asked about how funding would continue for beneficiaries without cutting benefits or raising taxes while allowing privatization, he also said he couldn't say, but it's a hard problem.

So what would you do?

I'm in favor of privatizing the whole thing, and allowing people to opt out for a one time (tax free) lump sum payment (which at this point would have to be some fraction of what they've put in). I'd rather pay people out less than raise taxes to give them what they put in. I think it's time to write the whole thing off as a failure, and move on.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[PhillyKev 0]

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I think it's time to write the whole thing off as a failure, and move on.

Could you tell me what we do when the majority of this country is then elderly people who can't work, can't afford a home and can't afford to eat?

Yes, I know, they should have planned better. But they didn't. Now what?

[kelpdiver 2]

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I think it's time to write the whole thing off as a failure, and move on.

Could you tell me what we do when the majority of this country is then elderly people who can't work, can't afford a home and can't afford to eat?

Yes, I know, they should have planned better. But they didn't. Now what?

That has nothing to do with SS, PK. It was never intended to be 100% of one's retirement income, and one would certainly be pressed to live on it now.

The greater problem is that even that amount of money can't be provided by the government once the boomers retire. It wasn't supposed to pay out for decades of every worker's life. Now that we've switched to such a premise, the funding method needs to evolve as well.

For higher wage earners, the return on SS is negative. For most in the middle, it's breakeven. Even personal accounts that only invested in T bills would come out ahead. If the risk of bad investing killing retirees is the real objection (it's not), you can restrict accordingly and still do the people and the future budgets of the country great good.

Takes away the mystery too - you and I have to plan a retirement with no SS, because it would be fucking stupid to assume it will be there. Given this, I can't understand why you are for the status quo.

[jcd11235 0]

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I'm in favor of privatizing the whole thing, and allowing people to opt out for a one time (tax free) lump sum payment (which at this point would have to be some fraction of what they've put in). I'd rather pay people out less than raise taxes to give them what they put in. I think it's time to write the whole thing off as a failure, and move on.

I am against privatization; it defeats the purpose of the fund. That is not to say the management couldn't be a bit more agressive. The program has failed because so much money has borrowed from SS, at least that's part of it.

The only three post WWII presidents to contribute to the national debt in ways other than interest have been Reagan, Bush and Bush. We have to pay for that spending at some point. Tax cuts and allowing deficit spending is not what I would consider responsible economic leadership.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[akarunway 1]

LMAO

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Takes away the mystery too - you and I have to plan a retirement with no SS, because it would be fucking stupid to assume it will be there. Given this, I can't understand why you are for the status quo.

First, I'm not Phree. Second, I'm NOT for the status quo. I am in favor of partially privatizing SS and allowing people to put those funds in a small selection of stable and diversified funds. Especially time horizon funds that automatically change their balances from stocks to bonds as they mature to reduce risk when you near retirement age.

But, I don't think we should give the shaft to the people who have paid into it all their lives and are about to retire. And we shouldn't take on additional 2-3 Trillion in debt.

[kelpdiver 2]

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But, I don't think we should give the shaft to the people who have paid into it all their lives and are about to retire. And we shouldn't take on additional 2-3 Trillion in debt.

It's one or the other- there's no free lunch on this. If the price were only 2-3T to move on, it would be a good decision. Sadly, that doesn't seem close to doing it.

I agree that it's bad precedent for the government to renege on prior promises.

(sorry about the false attribution- distracting work!)

[PhillyKev 0]

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It's one or the other- there's no free lunch on this.

You're right, there is no free lunch. But I don't agree that it's one or the other.

Leaving the status quo screws younger workers. Complete privatization screws the older workers. Either extreme would never pass anyway. The only good solution is for gradual and partial privatization, spreading the cost of the existing shortage among the entire populace while moving toward a new model. It needs to be balanced so that no single demographic ends up paying more proportionally than others (looking back over EVERYONES work lifetime).

The problem is that not many people would understand how to do that, and politicians will try to shift the burden away from their prime supporters while making it look like they are being equitable.

In other words, what I predict is the shafting of younger workers. Why? Cause they don't vote. It will happen in one of several ways. Either the income cap on SS taxes will be raised over a period of years, so that those who are under that cap continue financing the shortfall while the older, voting generation begins to retire. Or, the money will be outright borrowed, further mortgaging the countries future financial stability and screwing the younger workers who will have to pay back those debts in the future.

Of those two choices, I prefer the former. I prefer to pay up front for things, not borrow and expect others to pay it back. Plus any plan to borrow that much would further sink the dollar in the world market.

[gmanpilot 0]

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Yes, I know, they should have planned better. But they didn't. Now what?

Ok, here is what you do: Everyone over the age of 30-40 (pick a number) will get benefits. Everyone under that number gets nothing, AND they have to keep contributing until everyone is off the tit. We all know SS is an untenable joke, so why continue it at all. Kill the program and tell everyone to start investing their own money. If I know the program is going to end, I'll be happy to pay a little extra to help kill it.

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-There's always free cheese in a mouse trap.