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swarley 0
QuoteI mean, we've been keeping detailed meteorological records for what, 100 years? How the hell can anyone possibly determine long term trends on the basis of this?
I totally agree, Like who of us caused the last Ice age? The environs like to yell the "sky is falling", the "sky is falling" to ensure revenue to their cause.
The sky is really fine, its all those people jumping out
of airplanes
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I don't know if I agree with that theory, either.
What I DO know is that, when I jump out of a plane, I don't fry, and that's what matters!
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Blondes do have more fun!
What I DO know is that, when I jump out of a plane, I don't fry, and that's what matters!
*****************************************
Blondes do have more fun!
Iflyme 0
***climate change.nothing new there ... climate change has been happening for a longggg time.
While I think it horrific how fast humans are poisoning the environment, I don't believe in man-made "global warming". The engines that drive this planet's weather are poorly understood. Conditions in our region of the galaxy... variations in the Earth's "wobble" during orbit ... interactions with passing stars -- all play a role in the long term climatic condition of this planet.
While I think it horrific how fast humans are poisoning the environment, I don't believe in man-made "global warming". The engines that drive this planet's weather are poorly understood. Conditions in our region of the galaxy... variations in the Earth's "wobble" during orbit ... interactions with passing stars -- all play a role in the long term climatic condition of this planet.
andy2 0
thats actually pretty unsettling news. I think its rained more in NC this year, than it ever has in recorded history.
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let my inspiration flow,
in token rhyme suggesting rhythm...
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let my inspiration flow,
in token rhyme suggesting rhythm...
MagicLou 0
QuoteLet me start this way...
I don't believe global warming is the big issue it's made out to be. Yes, it's happening, but at a very slow rate that is starting to reverse itself with the application of new pollution regulations, banning of CFC's, etc.
Also, all the weather incidents this year are most likely a fluke. It's like when I read Jurassic Park and first learned about chaos theory; you know "a butterfly flaps its wings in Brooklyn and it causes it to rain in Los Angeles". I don't believe in any of that.
Most of the things that happen in the world are due to a series of random events that are unpredictable. Plus, think of it this way--a meteorologist, with all his nice computers and all of his knowledge, has trouble accurately predicting the weather for a local area the next day, much less the globe a few years from now!
That kind of reminds me the the old joke:
Q. - How can you tell when the weatherman is lying?
A. - Check and see if he's movings his lips.
Seriously though, there are so many factors that can affect global environmental cycles (such as forrest fires, volcanos, skydivers passing wind on jump planes . . .), that I consider most of these to be theories. Consider that some "experts" conclude that we are actually entering into the next Ice Age, Their proof is the temperature change of the oceans that the "global warming" theorists do not take into account.
My theory is, if you want an accurate forecast, stick your head out of the window.
By the way 15 years ago I drove a van into the tail end of a tornado. Incredible amount of energy.
Lou
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. . . now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb - Dark Helmet
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. . . now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb - Dark Helmet
My theory is, if you want an accurate forecast, stick your head out of the window.
Or an airplane!
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Blondes do have more fun!
billvon 2,475
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)
>I do realize this, but with emissions testing going into place, HOV
>lanes being built, etc, this is also an issue for which corrections are
> being made and new regulations are being enacted.
We are doing some of those things, but not very many. We just vetoed a proposal to close the SUV emissions loophole, for example. CO2 emissions are going up about 1% a year, and there are no plans in process that will slow that down. Kyoto would have been one way; we rejected that.
>Global warming is not something that's going to disappear overnight,
> but it's not like an asteroid that's going to destroy the earth in 48
> hours, either. And it's something that can be fixed without some
> radical plan from NASA.
How do you figure it can be fixed? What's the plan? I have seen none other than Kyoto, and even that was a stopgap measure.
>In regards to being prepared, sure. Survival of the fittest, right?
> Those who are prepared, will fare better.
Well, those who can afford to be prepared will. The poor will die. Sort of a harsh thing to be OK with. Are you prepared to accept the deaths of tens of millions of Ethiopians so we can drive SUV's?
> But even though I don't believe in the evolution theory, I do believe
> in the ability to evolve to adjust, and I think that human kind has
>done pretty well so far. I wouldn't expect anything different in this
> case, should it become a large-scale issue.
No doubt. But again, evolution doesn't change organisms to better deal with the environment, it kills the ones not able to adapt - and that means men, women and children.
>lanes being built, etc, this is also an issue for which corrections are
> being made and new regulations are being enacted.
We are doing some of those things, but not very many. We just vetoed a proposal to close the SUV emissions loophole, for example. CO2 emissions are going up about 1% a year, and there are no plans in process that will slow that down. Kyoto would have been one way; we rejected that.
>Global warming is not something that's going to disappear overnight,
> but it's not like an asteroid that's going to destroy the earth in 48
> hours, either. And it's something that can be fixed without some
> radical plan from NASA.
How do you figure it can be fixed? What's the plan? I have seen none other than Kyoto, and even that was a stopgap measure.
>In regards to being prepared, sure. Survival of the fittest, right?
> Those who are prepared, will fare better.
Well, those who can afford to be prepared will. The poor will die. Sort of a harsh thing to be OK with. Are you prepared to accept the deaths of tens of millions of Ethiopians so we can drive SUV's?
> But even though I don't believe in the evolution theory, I do believe
> in the ability to evolve to adjust, and I think that human kind has
>done pretty well so far. I wouldn't expect anything different in this
> case, should it become a large-scale issue.
No doubt. But again, evolution doesn't change organisms to better deal with the environment, it kills the ones not able to adapt - and that means men, women and children.
Iflyme 0
Plant fossils.QuoteI mean, we've been keeping detailed meteorological records for what, 100 years? How the hell can anyone possibly determine long term trends on the basis of this?
http://rbcm1.rbcm.gov.bc.ca/nh_papers/plantfossils.html
Well, those who can afford to be prepared will. The poor will die. Sort of a harsh thing to be OK with. Are you prepared to accept the deaths of tens of millions of Ethiopians so we can drive SUV's?
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Okay, like I said, I try to do my part; I don't drive an SUV, I have a small car. I live close to where I work; and I rarely go to the DZ alone, so I carpool. What else can I do? What else can anyone do? I don't think that the pollution is nearly as large a factor in any change in the living environment as some make it out to be. It becomes an issue when a company wants to sell something, or when someone wants to get elected. As you said, the government has never done as much as possible toward stopping pollution. Why? Because they don't really care. They campaign with their "oh the poor environment" speeches, get elected, and quickly turn to other topics.
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No doubt. But again, evolution doesn't change organisms to better deal with the environment, it kills the ones not able to adapt - and that means men, women and children.
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Okay, like I said, I try to do my part; I don't drive an SUV, I have a small car. I live close to where I work; and I rarely go to the DZ alone, so I carpool. What else can I do? What else can anyone do? I don't think that the pollution is nearly as large a factor in any change in the living environment as some make it out to be. It becomes an issue when a company wants to sell something, or when someone wants to get elected. As you said, the government has never done as much as possible toward stopping pollution. Why? Because they don't really care. They campaign with their "oh the poor environment" speeches, get elected, and quickly turn to other topics.
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No doubt. But again, evolution doesn't change organisms to better deal with the environment, it kills the ones not able to adapt - and that means men, women and children.
My problem with this statement is that, if you truly believe in "natural selection" (which I don't really), it's taking place just as quickly today as it would any other time. How do I mean? The weaker beings are already dying from diseases and inability to adjust. And that could rarely be rectified with money. So what's the difference?
Now, don't take that the wrong way; I value human life above anything else; but it's a reality that we should accept. That has nothing to do with "global warming".
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Blondes do have more fun!
billvon 2,475
>Okay, like I said, I try to do my part; I don't drive an SUV, I have a
>small car. I live close to where I work; and I rarely go to the DZ
> alone, so I carpool. What else can I do? What else can anyone do?
Get a solar hot water batch heater.
Get a solar electric power system.
Recycle everything you can; compost the rest.
Next time you get a car, get a diesel and use biodiesel, or a hybrid, or a natural gas car. All are available.
Replace all your bulbs with compact flourescents.
Switch from heating oil to natural gas.
Insulate more.
Get a more efficient air conditioner/refrigerator.
Get rid of 'phantom loads' in your house.
Get a programmable thermostat.
Buy foods grown in organic farms (less petroleum-based fertilizer used.)
>I don't think that the pollution is nearly as large a factor in any
> change in the living environment as some make it out to be.
Depends on what you call "large factor." Most life will adapt through evolution to whatever we do, but I don't think we'd be happy if the result was that cockroaches took over from birds. The ecosystem doesn't care too much of course, so from that point of view it's not too much of an issue.
Right now about 10,000 americans a year die from pulmonary disease and heart disease as a result of particulate pollution, primarily from unfiltered diesels (older trucks and trains) and coal power plants. Whether you call that a large factor or not depends on your particular values. It's a very small part of the population, certainly.
>My problem with this statement is that, if you truly believe in "natural
> selection" (which I don't really), it's taking place just as quickly
> today as it would any other time.
Not with humans. We give chemotherapy drugs to cancer patients. We separate conjoined twins. We have drugs that allow people with AIDS to live a relatively long life. We feed the hungry, shelter the helpless, cure the sick - basically go out of our way to make sure natural selection does NOT work.
>How do I mean? The weaker beings are already dying from diseases
> and inability to adjust. And that could rarely be rectified with money.
?? You have been in large hospitals, right? Money saves a lot of people nowadays.
>small car. I live close to where I work; and I rarely go to the DZ
> alone, so I carpool. What else can I do? What else can anyone do?
Get a solar hot water batch heater.
Get a solar electric power system.
Recycle everything you can; compost the rest.
Next time you get a car, get a diesel and use biodiesel, or a hybrid, or a natural gas car. All are available.
Replace all your bulbs with compact flourescents.
Switch from heating oil to natural gas.
Insulate more.
Get a more efficient air conditioner/refrigerator.
Get rid of 'phantom loads' in your house.
Get a programmable thermostat.
Buy foods grown in organic farms (less petroleum-based fertilizer used.)
>I don't think that the pollution is nearly as large a factor in any
> change in the living environment as some make it out to be.
Depends on what you call "large factor." Most life will adapt through evolution to whatever we do, but I don't think we'd be happy if the result was that cockroaches took over from birds. The ecosystem doesn't care too much of course, so from that point of view it's not too much of an issue.
Right now about 10,000 americans a year die from pulmonary disease and heart disease as a result of particulate pollution, primarily from unfiltered diesels (older trucks and trains) and coal power plants. Whether you call that a large factor or not depends on your particular values. It's a very small part of the population, certainly.
>My problem with this statement is that, if you truly believe in "natural
> selection" (which I don't really), it's taking place just as quickly
> today as it would any other time.
Not with humans. We give chemotherapy drugs to cancer patients. We separate conjoined twins. We have drugs that allow people with AIDS to live a relatively long life. We feed the hungry, shelter the helpless, cure the sick - basically go out of our way to make sure natural selection does NOT work.
>How do I mean? The weaker beings are already dying from diseases
> and inability to adjust. And that could rarely be rectified with money.
?? You have been in large hospitals, right? Money saves a lot of people nowadays.
QuoteYup....
I mean, we've been keeping detailed meteorological records for what, 100 years? How the hell can anyone possibly determine long term trends on the basis of this?
I agree, we are fucking up the environment, but I doubt it is to the extent that some would have us believe....
Well, we are fucking up the environment to that extent because The AlGore wants to be president. He needs a job, or a life, or something I dont know what until he gets his brain transplanted.
QuoteChased a tornado once,
With a broom out of your backyard ?
-- Hope you don't die. --
I'm fucking winning
The records I could find went back to 1850.. I have seen graphs that show thousands of years... determined from ice core samples in the arctic. I can't find them now. But remember the Ice Ages? Yes we may be adding fuel to the fire, but we actually are in a hot/cold cycle that is NATURAL. Its going to get hotter. Just like it did between every ice age. Then its going to get colder. An ice age is a natural cycle too.
I guess when the next ice age comes, we might have to drop whatever "clean" energy we are using at that time, and go back to fossil fuels to warm the place back up.
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