lurch 0 #101 May 26, 2003 Um, actually I'm pretty sure that was really her face, or as real as anything is in movies these days...I got the big 96 meg trailer and her face looks like that cause A) The agent was kicking her ass seconds before she took the high dive, (has scratches/cuts on her face) and B) she's in as desperate a situation as any you could think of and her face is all scrunched up like yours would be if you were putting forth a last effort. I thought the look on her face when she finally takes a bullet in the chest was very well done myself. The conga club scene -I- thought was the result of morpheus exhorting them all to shake the earth and make their presence felt, that whole "we're alive" assertion in the face of oncoming peril....better to be partying hard than panicking, eh? To me the scene was unnecessarily overdone, but fit nicely in with events. The movie DID have its glaring flaws, less-than-stellar dialogue in places and some scenes like the agent crushing the car that screamed "FAKE!!!"...that agent looked like something out of the next version of Unreal Tournament...way too cartoony. This one lacked the gritty (un)realism the first one had that made it so believable....they did a MUCH better job blending the CGI in the first flick, I'm surprised so much sloppy work made it through to release in this one. Overall score I'd give it about an 80% with extra credit given for so much unprecedented tight action. Excellent flick, a trifle disappointing in places but worth going to see again tonight maybe. My .02$Live and learn... or die, and teach by example. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #102 May 26, 2003 a nice exposition on some of the philosophy behind the matrix i disagree with some of his conclusions but you cant fault his research. edit: fixed it..forgot a " duh...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weid14 0 #103 May 26, 2003 Quote a nice exposition on some of the philosophy behind the matrix i disagree with some of his conclusions but you cant fault his research. link didn't work for me.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #104 May 26, 2003 bump to say i fixed it.. (blatant post whoring..) ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weid14 0 #105 May 26, 2003 Quote bump to say i fixed it.. (blatant post whoring..) and there is nothing wrong with that... and that dude has a lot of time on his hands.... I really was disappointed in the movie actually, if it had been a tv series, but come on "to be concluded"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingILweenie 0 #106 May 26, 2003 can you psychologically cut your lip? either way, it doesnt matter what is really possible. the important thing is the movie lays down rules for itself and sticks to them, which can believability to anything since it becomes plausible in the film's world. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #107 May 26, 2003 well thats a good question..and one that has been debated a bit in pseudo scientific circles.. if your mind thinks the fight you are in is real will your body react as if it is? the question is "what are the rules of the movie?" i think they are playing with the idea that your mind IS responsible for what happens to you physically.. which is why Neo doesnt die and can save Trinity etc...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #108 May 27, 2003 Watched it for a second time and this is what i picked up: ok the guy that triggered the premature EMP, was cutting his hand, and laying across from Neo in a comma is agent Smith. zion is in the matrix or a different matrix the oracle is on no ones side, she is just trying to get the matrix "reloaded". it is reloaded when zion is destroyed (like it has 5 times already) when it is reloaded, the process starts over. they find "the one" and so on untill the process is perfected. if she doesnt lead the one to help reload it, everyone dies connected to the matrix. if u will notice, everyone in zion is pretty young. that is because of when the matrix is reloaded. the council is older in age because they are part of the 7male/16female group that had to rebuild zion. just my .02 cents Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #109 May 27, 2003 watch it again...i think there are a few things your stil missing. ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #110 May 27, 2003 well explain then if you think i missed somethin... Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #111 May 27, 2003 granted i'm not going to explain the whole movie in one post, do you think somethin is wrong with what i wrote in the previous post? if so, back yourself up. Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #112 May 27, 2003 read the Architects speech for the bit about the Oracle..the Matrix has already rebooted 5 times. shes not needed for that, shes the 'designer' of the current system, that has a fundamental flaw that eventually results in the One and must be reset again. The Oracle is also on the run (from the Architect?)..she is "after" more than that, possibly and end to the matrix as a means of human enslavement..control and necessary coexistance are major themes..they are repeated in several characters dialogues Zion is not inside the matrix. That would be WAY to obvious and trivial an answer (its possible they will plot it that way but if they do they would be leaving far to many holes in the story..as in "why bother with all the deception in the first place if the machine have that level of control"..i would like to think they are better writers than that. check out the philosophy link i posted earlier for some more insights to what may be going on..____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #113 May 27, 2003 Quoteread the Architects speech for the bit about the Oracle..the Matrix has already rebooted 5 times. shes not needed for that i still think the oracle is needed for the matrix to reboot. without the oracle, neo would not have gotten as far as he has, as with every other anomaly, they have made it to the mainframe (according to the architect); thus making her very important to the rebooting of the matrix. do you think all the other anomalies would have been able to get to the architect(which leads to the matrix reboot) without the oracle? Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #114 May 27, 2003 just because the One is following this path this time doenst mean that he/she always has..the Architect expressed suprise in Neo's actions already.. I think the Oracle is trying ot break the cycle that has happened 5 times already, by influencing the one in a different manner than previous incarnations..____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #115 May 27, 2003 Quote]by influencing the one in a different manner than previous incarnations.. so you think that previous Ones have contacted the oracle before? Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #116 May 27, 2003 This thread reminds me of the Star Wars light saber kid... you guys are Uber-Geeks Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #117 May 27, 2003 its possible, there isnt enough information to really say..she is the only "program" that doesnt mention his predecessors' to him, but there are lots of reasons why she wouldnt i tend to think the Oracle is taking particular interest in this incarnation we dont have enough background on the previous matrixes... how long did each of them last? according to Morpheous the current resistance has been going for 100 years.. something (not specific enough to define) gave me the impression that the anomalies of the One were appearing faster and faster in each successive Matrix.____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattM 0 #118 May 27, 2003 you must hate movies that require you to think Matt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #119 May 27, 2003 Quoteyou must hate movies that require you to think I wouldnt include the matrix in a list of movie that REQUIRE you to think. Sure, you can add any layer of tought to any movie (I'm sure someone could do a analytic deconstruction of Dumb and Dumber), but that doenst make the movie hard to understand.... or complex... I found this movie fair entertainment, but was quite disapointed with VERY poor special effects, some very lenghty boring bits that added nothing to the story, and some so-so acting. I'm with Will: bring on LOTR3Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #120 May 27, 2003 Quote I'm with Will: bring on LOTR3 uh the movie (and the book you may have heard of it) is called "Return of the King" you dont have to think at all for any movie, but there is quite a bit of subtext going on that you probably missed if you went to the matrix thinking its only purpose was to be an over budget CGI action flick..unfortunately even the directors got a bit to enamored with the effects at the expense of the story.____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #121 May 27, 2003 Quoteand the book you may have heard of it THEY MADE A BOOK OUT OF IT!!!!!!!! unbeleivable.....Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #122 May 27, 2003 Yeah, the LOTR series kicks ass, even though I know exactly what's going to happen, having read the books a few times. That's whats fun about the 3 Matrix's, they're unkown and good, as well as having many layers to unravel. That makes a geek's life fun (i.e. me, I'm loving it). --"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingILweenie 0 #123 May 27, 2003 one thing I don't get is if the One is so important to rebooting the matrix and eventually solving the anomaly problem, why does the system try and send agents and sentinels in the real world to fight him, instead of letting him get to the source easily? does destroying the anomaly also solve the problem? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #124 May 27, 2003 >one thing I don't get is if the One is so important to rebooting the > matrix and eventually solving the anomaly problem, why does the >system try and send agents and sentinels in the real world to fight >him, instead of letting him get to the source easily? I think they are trying to show that there is no one "system" - there's the architect, the oracle, the sentinels, the agents, rouge agents etc each of whom has their own agenda. It may be that the agents/sentinels etc are neccessary to provide the 'foil' against which The One emerges. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aneblett 0 #125 May 27, 2003 Quote we dont have enough background on the previous matrixes... In the name of Uber-geekdom the plural of matrix is Matrices.. AgeS.E.X. party #2 ..It is far worse to live with fear, than to die confronting it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
