mtrager23 0 #1 December 5, 2011 Hey guys, I'm pretty new to the sport and have a gear question. I just bought my first ring used... -Wings W18 container -Safire 190 -PD reserve -Cypres The pilot chute handle is a pillow type and has a velcro attachment to the bottom of the container. Basically it looks just like a cutaway handle and there is a velcro attachement on the actual container to keep the handle in place. So my questions are... 1) Has anyone ever seen this before? 2) My rigger said that he had not, but it might be useful in keeping an accidental deployment. Do you think this benefit would outweigh the extra force it would take to detach and throw the pilot chute? 3) Do you think there's a chance that the velcro could catch the bridle on deployment? Or otherwise wear it down? One easy solution I think would be to just attach a hook side piece of velcro to the actual handle so it wouldnt attach to the container...or I suppose it would be easy enough to just replace the handle. Thoughts and suggestions appreciated! -Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #2 December 5, 2011 1) Yes. 2) Yes. 3) No.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #3 December 5, 2011 Quote1) Yes. 2) Yes. 3) No.YES Velcro wears things down, you know that... it might take a few hundred jumps to notice, and a few hundred more to make any difference, but it DOES."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #4 December 5, 2011 QuoteQuote1) Yes. 2) Yes. 3) No.YES Velcro wears things down, you know that... it might take a few hundred jumps to notice, and a few hundred more to make any difference, but it DOES. !!WARNING! NOT A RIGGER - OPINION ONLY!! Well, if the hook is on the container instead of the handle, I would agree. I don't see the pile as having much effect.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #5 December 5, 2011 Every time I check the drogue handle on a Strong tandem! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #6 December 5, 2011 QuoteVelcro wears things down, you know that... it might take a few hundred jumps to notice, and a few hundred more to make any difference, but it DOES. Just a guess, the 'No' was in response to the first part of question 3, where it asked if the bridle could get caught on the velcro. To that, I agree with the 'No'. In response to the idea that the velcro could wear something out, of course, hook velcro does wear out things that it comes in contact with (even pile velcro). However, in that application, I have never seen a velcro handle cause wear to a bridle or PC faster than the bridle or PC wears out on it's own. The 'freefly pud' as it's called is a sound system, and should not be modified to work less than it already does. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mtrager23 0 #7 December 5, 2011 Awesome thanks everyone for the responses. I was getting no where googling "main pilot chute velcro attachment," haha. Freefly pud yielded much better results. One more follow up: Should I be concerned that my rigger of 10 years experience has never seen this? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #8 December 5, 2011 QuoteVelcro wears things down, you know that... it might take a few hundred jumps to notice, and a few hundred more to make any difference, but it DOES. Take a look at a Strong tandem pilot chute next time you get a chance. Or, at the velcro notch on the main top-flap on most rigs, where you velcro the bridle in place before closing. Velcro eats many things, but not mail bridles. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,053 #9 December 5, 2011 QuoteHey guys, I'm pretty new to the sport and have a gear question. I just bought my first ring used... -Wings W18 container -Safire 190 -PD reserve -Cypres The pilot chute handle is a pillow type and has a velcro attachment to the bottom of the container. Basically it looks just like a cutaway handle and there is a velcro attachement on the actual container to keep the handle in place. So my questions are... 1) Has anyone ever seen this before? 2) My rigger said that he had not, but it might be useful in keeping an accidental deployment. Do you think this benefit would outweigh the extra force it would take to detach and throw the pilot chute? 3) Do you think there's a chance that the velcro could catch the bridle on deployment? Or otherwise wear it down? One easy solution I think would be to just attach a hook side piece of velcro to the actual handle so it wouldnt attach to the container...or I suppose it would be easy enough to just replace the handle. Thoughts and suggestions appreciated! -Mike I had this setup on my WingsEXT Yes. Yes - and made the decision to do it when the pud handle can out of the pack tray seam and went floppy on me during an exit one time (no big deal as it's just a flat hackey). No - you've just got a 1"x1/2" piece on the inside of the pack tray with the mate sewn on the pud handle. NOTE: For FF'ing, it's really a great setup.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #10 December 5, 2011 As you've found out this type of handle is an option on some rigs. Should you be concerned about your rigger? It depends. Are they a part time rigger in an area of small dropzones with few customers? Then maybe not. There are many options I haven't seen in person. But he/she should have been quickly able to determine if it was factory or an after market field creation. All riggers are constantly learning and while this option may be very popular in some parts of the country their may be other parts where it is rare. The same with some brands of rigs or other equipment. But, the idea of modifying this system should never have been entertained by you or particularly your rigger with out finding out more about it. Fill out your profile and folks can give you better answers.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mtrager23 0 #11 December 6, 2011 Hey thanks everyone for the input, very helpful answers. Yea when I first saw this set up with my novice eyes it initially seemed like it'd be a good idea. But what may seem good to the inexperienced eye, could be a bad idea. It's nice to have a spot online to get experienced advice. And I think i may like to get into freeflying eventually so it'll be nice to have. And yea the rigger is part time so I guess that makes me feel better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #12 December 7, 2011 Quote One more follow up: Should I be concerned that my rigger of 10 years experience has never seen this? Yes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kawisixer01 0 #13 December 7, 2011 Are you sure you didn't end up purchasing a rig with a pull out deployment rather than a BOC throw out? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #14 December 7, 2011 QuoteAre you sure you didn't end up purchasing a rig with a pull out deployment rather than a BOC throw out Doesn't sound like it. He mentioned the thought of covering the velcro on the rig, and if it was a pull-out the handle would have nothing to attach to and would just be a full time floating pud. In a freefly pud set-up, the attachment to the PC and the BOC pouch would hold the handle in place if you cover the velcro. It wouldn't be as secure, and why it was discouraged upthread. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #15 December 7, 2011 I would almost prefer a rigger that is willing to admit that he is unfamiliar with something. Riggers have ego's too and there are many that would never admit to not having knowledge of some types of equipment or the skill to maintain or repair the same equipment. Look for a rigger that is conscientious and willing to put his ego aside when confronted with something new or unusual. I got my rigger's ticket 15 years ago and don't do any rigging anymore simply because I haven't kept up with the latest equipment designs. Gear changes and riggers are usually the first to see new things and the last to be told how to maintain them and keep the system working. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaustik 3 #16 December 7, 2011 QuoteQuoteAre you sure you didn't end up purchasing a rig with a pull out deployment rather than a BOC throw out Doesn't sound like it. He mentioned the thought of covering the velcro on the rig, and if it was a pull-out the handle would have nothing to attach to and would just be a full time floating pud. In a freefly pud set-up, the attachment to the PC and the BOC pouch would hold the handle in place if you cover the velcro. It wouldn't be as secure, and why it was discouraged upthread. My ex flew (and prolly still does) a pull out wings system. There is velcro involved with wings pull outs. It's quite similar to velcro on a strong dual hawk drogue.The future belongs to those of us still willing to get our hands dirty. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #17 December 7, 2011 QuoteMy ex flew (and prolly still does) a pull out wings system. There is velcro involved with wings pull outs. It's quite similar to velcro on a strong dual hawk drogue. It's probably the same handle and velcro arrangement for the pull-out and the freefly pud. However, if you remove the velcro from the pull-out, there's nothing left to hold the handle in place (I don't think that bottom flap would do the trick). If you remove the velcro from a freefly pud, the handle would stay in the same area because it's attached to the PC in the pouch. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,053 #18 December 7, 2011 QuoteQuoteMy ex flew (and prolly still does) a pull out wings system. There is velcro involved with wings pull outs. It's quite similar to velcro on a strong dual hawk drogue. ...if you remove the velcro from the pull-out, there's nothing left to hold the handle in place (I don't think that bottom flap would do the trick). If you remove the velcro from a freefly pud, the handle would stay in the same area because it's attached to the PC in the pouch. Exactly.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 6 #19 December 7, 2011 QuoteQuoteAre you sure you didn't end up purchasing a rig with a pull out deployment rather than a BOC throw out Doesn't sound like it. He mentioned the thought of covering the velcro on the rig, and if it was a pull-out the handle would have nothing to attach to and would just be a full time floating pud. In a freefly pud set-up, the attachment to the PC and the BOC pouch would hold the handle in place if you cover the Velcro. It wouldn't be as secure, and why it was discouraged upthread. I had an old Wonderhog with a pull-out that had both Velcro and little 'ears' that slipped into pockets on the bottom of the container, from what I understood the Velcro was added later as the ears didn't always keep it secure... ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaustik 3 #20 December 7, 2011 Steps for the newbies. 1) Find jumper with a pull out system. 2) Learn how to push a straight pin back under the right side closing flap. 3) Cash check. The future belongs to those of us still willing to get our hands dirty. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
